How can I become a Quant (mid-career switcher)?
Plz ignore the title - I'm currently working in a qualitative investment research role at an institutional investor, covering a sector (think Healthcare, Infrastructure, Industrials etc) I majored in a humanities subject in undergrad, broke in through networking, and picked up econ concepts on the fly.
At some point, I decided I wanted to learn CS, so I took linear algebra, calc 1-2/multivariable, probability & stats, discrete math, and some optimization courses at my local university to meet the prerequisites for Georgia Tech’s Online Master’s in CS (OMSCS). For those who don't know, it can be completed part-time and doesn't say anywhere on the transcript/degree that's online, so counts as a real deal GT degree. I also picked up Python and got a solid grasp of data structures along the way.
I'm now pursuing the Machine Learning track in the program and really enjoying it, but lately, I’ve been fascinated by the idea of transitioning into quant trading or quant research. The goal would be to leverage my CS degree from a quant feeder school into internships or full-time quant positions, assuming I can demonstrate the necessary mathematical and programming skills.
For reference, I had a non-traditional path as I graduated high school early at 16, finished undergrad in three years, and started working at my current firm by 19. I’ve now been in this role for three years, but it’s a dead end. That said, it’s a chill 35-40 hour/week job, and I basically just collect a paycheck. I also run a side arbitrage business that covers my bills, so I have flexibility. If I landed a quant internship while finishing my degree, I wouldn’t hesitate to jump on it.
At 22, with a strong interest in quant trading/research and a top CS master’s in progress, what’s the best path for someone like me to break in? Or am I being delusional and this transition is unrealistic?
I don't have any advice, but how did you get a bachelor's at the age of 19?
Skipped a few grades in middle school through a program offered by my eventual high school, then took dual credit courses through the community college connected to the large state uni (non-target but well known) that I ended up going to. Graduated HS at 16 and then had 2.5 years left worth of credits
Not exactly sure what the timelines of your degree program are but generally in the US firms prefer interns who are in the summer before their last year. At most big firms it's generally to get an internship then full time offer by following the standard calendar but if you can network with smaller firms with more sporadic hiring schedules that is less of a constraint. I think being currently employed for another financial institution is potentially a bigger deal breaker as you would need to quit that job before doing the internships and many firms would likely feel uncomfortable having someone quit a full time job for an internship without a guaranteed return offer.
Developer/quantitative developer roles at trading firms are also generally less competitive and easier to get if studied CS and can code well. If you can can code well and have interest in markets it's often possible to slowly transition to more quanty type of work as well if you have a talent for it. In the normal course of quants interacting with devs/QDs there is going to be a lot of opportunity for devs/QDs to suggest small but good trading/quant ideas if they have the good intuition and understanding of markets although frequently in my experience the reason said individuals are in those roles in the first place is because they lack the necessary intuition and understanding to do actual quant work. A typical example of this would be a quant giving a dev/QD a spec for some idea to implement. A good dev/QD can implement a somewhat ambiguous spec and come up reasonable behavior for edge cases while some dev/QDs even if very strong technically struggle with anything ambiguous and lack the trading acumen to come up with reasonable behavior in edge cases.
You’re evidently a determined and intelligent individual. I think you just need to get out there and have people take a chance on you. Why not just go to some hackathons or other CS related events that employers may be at and speak to them? I bet they’ll be impressed that you’re 22, 3 years out of college, and completed a degree while working full-time. It’s more important imo to signal determination and if you can strike a chord with the right person they may want to help you out. Good luck (ps I think I’m gna do that GT masters in a couple years just bc of this post)
Hackathons are honestly a waste of time for quant dev roles. Shops would much rather prefer to see you contributing to open source quant software or develop your own trading algos and back test them on exchange apis. They don't have to be killer (although if you can develop a trading strat on your own that backtested shows promising results it would certainly help). I think bankers often forget that trading is very meritocratic and your background matters little in the "bazaar" If you can make a profit, no one cares where you went to school or who you're connected to.
In my first job we had a guy who was ‘a quant’ with a humanities background, he learned coding in high school. Half the battle is just knowing the necessary coding language for a lot of these ‘quant’ position. I’ve also known multiple people who landed ‘quant’ positions because they knew VBA. Frankly, these ‘quants’ were doing nothing that was actually quantitatively difficult. Also, both had those seats for two years and left - pretty sure voluntarily. Point is, remember different firms will use a title like ‘quantitative analyst’ purely to have that job title on their about us section.
Frankly if you’re in your early twenties and have an interest in it then pursuing a masters is your best path. Be warned though, I’ve met people with masters in quantitative finance who landed jobs doing back office work. Also, if you’re not a finance major and weaseled your way into asset management then hold onto that seat well. So high level summary:
Good path, keep going, get the degree.
Be wary of a lot of ‘quant’ job titles as they’re not actually quant positions but could be handled by finance majors with slightly advanced excel skills. Basically not everything that says quant is quant.
I think it's very important that I comment on here as the WSO community is mostly filled with IB/PE folks or fundamental traders that have decent math but not a purist math and stats background. For more info to learn about quants head to Quantnet. But with that being said, the term quant has been throw around a lot and has been greatly diluted due to marketing purposes. In real life, quants at institutions are research roles, meaning they typically have a PhD in Math, Stats, Physics, or CS with relation to Discrete Mathematics. In short, a real pure quant spends the bulk of their day analyzing data and making statistical models which are then generated into trade ideas based on their research findings.
Based on what you are saying, you want to be a quant dev which honestly is just another word for software engineer, it's just for whatever reason people decided that developers can be considered quants because they work with the pure quants on a day to day basis, translating their algos to code and deploying them for testing on live exchange data. In short, any developer can become a quant dev, you just need to read up on the math and stats that these algorithms use. I've found that you can transition especially if you've already got a solid background as a software engineer. There are many software developers that come from big tech to small no name dev shops that work in this industry, you don't necessarily need to have a background in finance though it certainly helps since it shows you have an interest in the markets. I don't believe you need an MS but it certainly can't hurt. What's most important is to know python and the data science/ML libraries that come with the territory, but even more important is having the confidence to deal with vast amounts of data. Knowing data structures is key here. Overall, don't stress about breaking into Quant Dev roles. They're always looking for talent and all it takes is time to build up your skills and apply. Just because you don't get it today doesn't mean you won't a 2-5 years from now. In my opinion an MFE is also useless and is a money grab from schools. It's better to specialize either in stats or CS, an MFE tries to cram that all into one degree and it's not really marketable outside of finance, so if you don't want to stay in finance, if you have a Stats or CS masters, you can pivot to any industry. MFE, not so much.
Very helpful - I think being a quant dev is moreso what I consider realistic and my goal rather than a pure quant, so its encouraging to hear that. Ik you mentioned that having the data structuring, ML and python reps are most important for a quant dev role, so if you were in my shoes and working in my current role whilst completing my MSCS, what would be the best path to get more tangible experience to eventually lateral into a quant dev role?
I guess the worry I have is while I'm learning loads of these relevant skills my degree, i'm not handling anything day to day in my job. A bit worried that when I finish the degree and start applying to quant dev roles, the knock on my resume will be 'yeah its great you have a strong CS background, but you have no work experience applying anything' etc. Is this a valid concern and what would you do in my shoes (ie. stay in current role and focus on learning vs. try to pivot to be a swe somewhere via internships/lower tier roles like startups vs. something else)?
Hi bro -
I have seen some quant trading firms that trade single stock equities have desk analysts. “Equity Analyst - Financials” for example. You could be valuable to a firm if you can decipher the financial stuff. Helps with earnings vol - like you have normal levels of vol for front month lets called that background vol. and then there’s the event vol. if you can decipher or project earnings well maybe you can imply the event vol with more certainty than the market and then trade off it (long vol via strad/strang or just how to help mm). And this is just a basic example. I think you have a unique skill set that you can get a spot
Voluptates vitae quam et non. Vel illo et nam. Hic tempore laboriosam ut inventore in deserunt.
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