12/6/17

Hello guys,

I am currently a final year student at a UK semi-target and trying to do a Masters in the US. I have little knowledge about target universities (apart from Ivy) and would love some help if someone had a similar experience moving from one country to the other.

Thank you

Comments (34)

11/19/17

Interested.

Investment Banking Interview Course
11/19/17

worked and lived in 9 countries. Moved between UK and US several times; however, I can't help with the college system because I have never studied in the US. Or at least I wouldn't be able to help any more than WSO could.

Very generally speaking, a Masters degrees in the US could be seen as the "cash cow" at a school when internationals apply, including MBA courses. There are almost no stipends, loans, scholarships or tuition rebate systems that might apply for internationals. As an example, successful international PhD candidates are commonly fully funded (and most PhDs have Masters coursework included and even award Masters degrees as part of the program).
If funding your course is a concern you could aim for a need-blind school in the US. afaik there are only six need-blind US institutions that fully cover demonstrated need for internationals (MIT, Harvard, Princeton, Yale and two more).

Which school or industry are you aiming at and, if you don't mind sharing it, what is the reason you would like to study in the US? Are you planning to return to Europe afterwards or would you like to stay in the US?

PS, have a look at:
http://www.fulbright.org.uk/

11/19/17

That is indeed impressive, 2 countries so far for me.

In terms of loans, I thought there were private companies that offered to internationals as well; it's true that they charge a high-interest rate, but wouldn't care if that allows me to have a shot at getting into Wall St. I want to do a Masters because it is a way of continuing education ( I have done only 3 years after high school, so by doing a 2-year Masters I will be one year older only than the average US grad as undergrad over there is 4 years).
Thanks for naming some universities, I hear that by being at an Ivy League you have higher chances than usual, is that right?

In terms of industry, I am aiming for Investment Banking, and specifically, Sales and Trading. I have always wanted to move to US for a few years, even for undergrad, but as costs were really high plus they asked me to take SATs (which I didn't have time for as I had to take my national exams too). Also, in the US trading volume is way higher and there are more buy-side shops. Moreover, I don't want to stay in the UK as Brexit is hitting hard, and may mean moving to Frankfurt or some other EU location, which I am not really pleased with.

In the short term, I want to enjoy my stay in the US, and maybe at some time I return to the UK or even my country (I am an international student in the UK too, thus outside of the EU)

Lastly, thanks a lot for your answer. I have already checked the Fulbright scheme before, for my country though.

11/20/17
  • I personally wouldn't take up loans with high interest for a degree. Unless you get into a top-tier school it will most likely not be worth the financial trouble.
  • You will have a better shot at getting placed if you are at a good school; however, there are plenty of ivy internationals who lost in the H1b lottery (and had to go home). Naturally, this information is also hard to find or specific data is not available from schools.
  • Be very careful when going into debt for an international degree in the US. It can be unclear whether you'll get a shot at a life in the US due to the current economic climate/Visa issues. If you are not local to either the US or the European Union you should focus on a country that will most likely give you the best shot at a life and career (including visa, job placement).

Can't help you with S&T but WSO will have plenty of information.

11/20/17

-My plan to go to US is only at Ivy and big universities, as I know it is not worth going to a non-target and wasting your money.
-In terms of H1B, I thought if you managed to get a job and with a STEM Visa, it would be easier to get, without the need of a lottery
- My country is considered third-world, and there is high unemployment and no chances for a graduate like me to work in something related to banking. That's why I was aiming for somewhere better like the US, and even the UK. The latter is still a really good option but would prefer to avoid going due to current economic climate. In terms of US bank, with Brexit, they are tending to hire more for US offices to make up for the loss of human capital in London

11/20/17

1) Some degrees aiming at the world of finance/banking do not qualify as STEM. And I don't know how many banks are placing international STEM graduates into which group (maybe they do for quants in S&T? I am not sure. Maths, CS, data science, etc should all qualify though for quant jobs and STEM)
2) One of the STEM advantages would be the OPT extension - however, that would not be a Visa and you'll still have to go through the H1b process (but you'll have more shots at it if you find a company willing to pay for all of this)
3) CPT & OPT, STEM extension should give you many attempts at securing H1b; but there is never a guarantee

11/22/17

Just saying - haven't seen any real impact on hiring / jobs from Brexit yet and don't think we will (even though it was an awful decision).

11/23/17

Talked to some ppl at BBs and told me how they were planning to move to Frankfurt or Paris. It's not sure, but the odds are high; especially with the current government

Best Response
11/26/17

You talked to the wrong people.

Paris and Frankfurt are not an option. The decentralising away from London was already happening, MS and ML just used brexit as an excuse to move a lot of their back office in Ireland. Country specific team, like a French coverage team might move to Paris as not a lot of reason for them to operate out of London now.

The current government is doing very well given the situation. Labor is in complete shamble and has not chance in hell of getting elected. The conservatives still have four years in power, that should be plenty of times to sort thing out.

Brexit for the fucking win, out of that corrupt EU. On the contrary regulations will come down a bit and there are a lot of financials industry who will benefit from being out of the EU, particularly for the buy side.

Anyways - from the previous post you seem to be slightly confused as to what you want to do with your life. S&T is a dying industry in terms of headcounts, brexit or no brexit - so it's not a particular judicious choice for someone coming out of undergrad, unless you are some sort of mathematically inclined quant.

12/7/17

I'm not a Brexit supporter but I do agree with you mate, Brexit will affect only BO and few MO positions. Nothing more.

To the OP: C'mon pal, be realistic. Ppl in finance in London: more than 1 million
Ppl in the whole Frankfurt area 500,000.
R u serious?
About Paris: LMAO. Hours limit, high taxes, lazy ppl

I'm scared about Labours. Implications of a Labour gov for UK could be significant, particularly under Corbyn's leadership. Risks on tax rates going up, nationalization, about a shift from capital over labor to favor labor over capital.

Let's make of Brexit an opportunity. And yes, I'm an EU citizen

Nicest haircut than Bateman

12/8/17

It will also affect FO. Did you forget about Euro clearing? And even Euro coverage area for S&T? Maybe M&A is not going to be affected much, but S&T is

12/8/17

S&T is dying in terms of vanilla products, but if you trade exotics there is still a long way until they can be traded through algos

12/8/17

We have to wait MIFID II, Basel IV and so on. But we are talking about up to 500 ppl.
And we still do not have the trade outcomes between EU/UK

Nicest haircut than Bateman

Investment Banking Interview Course
11/20/17

1) Masters I am looking for are usually quantitative subjects or pure finance, so most of the times they are STEM eligible
2) I guess if I secure a role they pay for it in terms of sponsorship
3) I see, but it's a better chance than doing so from the UK, right?

11/21/17

on 3)
I honestly don't know and I don' think anybody could foresee the outcome. Basically, you need to figure out what companies and the economic/political climate will do or be like in several years to come.

Personally, I feel like my colleagues and friends in the UK have an easier time securing visas (I have no data, so this research would be a good starting point).

edit:
Just emailed a friend who moved to California for grad studies. He tried getting the H1b during his OPT and failed to secure it. He will return to Europe when his OPT expires. This is anecdotal at best, so you could focus your primary research on success/placement rates for international graduates in the UK vs. US.

11/22/17

ohh wow, that sucks. Well thank you for your advice then. Sounds like a really harsh market

11/22/17

Why not secure a role in London and then transfer internally?

11/22/17

As mentioned previously, I want to do S&T and with Brexit, many jobs in the division are shifting to continental Europe, which would delay the process even more and make it harder to transfer as everyone will be wanting to

11/22/17

Fair point. Well, in your case a job in London would be better than taking your chances with a role in US. Like people have mentioned, you have to go through the Visa lottery EVEN after you land an offer, making things that much harder.

Additionally, masters degrees are not really viewed upon favourably in the States, meaning that undergrads from top schools will always be top priority over a grad student. Exceptions obviously for top programs like Princeton, MIT, etc.

Just some things to keep in mind.

11/22/17

Thanks for the advice. You mentioned Princeton and MIT, what other universities are top ranked in the US?

11/22/17

Np, just trying to give back to the community lol.

Some good MFin programs include Vanderbilt, WUSTL, Columbia (more financial engineering), CMU Computation Finance (super quanty).

These are the programs I've heard place really well in the states. In any case, you would be at disadvantage to local US students.

11/22/17

Best bet for you is to do a STEM designated MFin.

11/22/17

You could also try for the MFE at Baruch. It's super quanty and very competitive yet also isn't super expensive. Plus Baruch does a really good job with immigration help as so many of the students are immigrants. Baruch also has several STEM designated degrees with the OPT ext.

********"Babies don't cost money, they MAKE money." - Jerri Blank********

11/22/17

Thanks a lot guys. I have noted down all the unis you have mentioned and I will try applying to them

11/23/17

If you are a UK nationality person and moving to USA, then all you need is to setup a business there or do a better job so that you may earn some good loving for you and your family.

11/23/17

Wish I was a UK national, I am actually non-EU, which makes it more challenging, but also more rewarding if I achieve something big

12/8/17

I came to US to complete my Masters, so know the drill - from student loans, etc up until post grad employment. **My #1 suggestion would be to ONLY come here if you get full funding for your degree, whichever university you get into. Just because it is Ivy League or other top 10 school - does not mean a $100K+ job is guaranteed after graduation, and even if it was, it takes probably another 10 years to pay off the tuition from those schools. **

Apply to as many scholarships as possible, email the professors (or RAs/TAs) to see what kind of funding they have, etc. Ensure you get over funded. It is important that you have as close to zero debt as possible when you graduate, so that - if you have difficulty finding a job for 12 months after graduation (very common if you see the stats). With the restrictions in CPT/ OPT/ H1B/ GC all getting up there, things will change (not if), so you want to have cushion for yourself, and your future - not drown in student debt.

I'm probably not the right person for S&T / M&A etc related questions, but in terms of masters/ higher education in the US, I have been conveying the same for many of my family / friends and anyone who has the brains and can see the light behind the haze surrounding the accumulation of debt they'd have when they land here with $0 funding.

Side note: if you are thinking what my background is, I came to do Masters here in the US, in a city /state school with zero funding. I was able to apply for and get internship outside the country (applied close to 100 internships, only 4 called back, and one offer). For FTE, I got zero call backs from big banks or 'brand name companies. I have been @ GS for ~3 years now. This was by chance, as I responded to a recruiter and then took upon interviews (as I was sure I would flunk and get rejected straightaway - ended up getting offer on the same day). I'm not complaining, but this is just another job - at least that's my view on it. Thanks for reading.

12/10/17

Thanks a lot for the advice. In terms of tuition, it is almost the same as a top Business school in the UK for a Masters; therefore I believe I can afford one year of tuition or I might get part of it from loans. I have also applied for grants and will keep applying, but I still do not have a decision by now.

In terms of getting a job, I thought in the US, if on a good university, it is easier as OCR helps you secure that role. By any chance, was your state school well known? I am aiming for top schools as mine in the UK is a top 10 uni already, so trying to aim high. Also, how was your experience with OCR? And do you mind sharing where you did your undergrad, if that's fine with you.Thank you

11/26/17

Think long and hard about coming to the U.S. for a masters. When you go for recruiting, a lot of companies are going to screen based on work eligibility. If the school you end up at has a solid network and alumni base in the UK, you'll be fine. But if you're coming for a shot at working in the U.S. after, just know that it can be a painful process.

"Anything less than the best is a felony"

12/10/17

How important is the alumni network in the US? I have seen universities like Baruch and Fordham, which are not in rankings, but then have loads of student placement at BBs.

12/11/17

It's important. Generally speaking, alumni will be happy to push your resume through and alert you to opportunities if you reach out and set up chats in a thoughtful way. If you network correctly and leverage your school's alumni base at a company, it can make a world of difference. Most banks have recruiting teams made up of alumni. If you are coming from a school that doesn't have a substantial alumni group at the firm, you miss the opportunity to have people champion your cause internally.

"Anything less than the best is a felony"

11/26/17

Additionally, I will caution against my earlier advice of getting a STEM Masters degree as there are rumors that the Trump Administration might be trying to shorten the time given for STEM OPT. Buyer beware!

12/7/17

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