Stay for recruiting or study abroad in junior spring?

pundit's picture
Rank: Monkey | 39

I've been planning to study abroad next semester (in my junior year) for quite some time now, as I thought I was getting a return offer at a BB I worked at last summer. I was so dedicated to the idea of studying abroad that I had already paid a deposit and planned my entire semester around it. Well turns out there was a bit of a miscommunication, and I do not have an internship lined up for next summer anymore.

Which leads to a big issue - spring semester of junior year is recruiting season for BBs, consulting firms, and all kinds of financial services. Since I don't have a job next summer anymore, I feel like I should stay and go through the recruiting process. However, this is also my last opportunity to study abroad and I know what a life-changing experience it is. I've already missed the deadlines for most fast track applications since I found out very recently that I did not have the internship. I'm a junior at a target school, and I need to confirm going abroad in the next week. I'm a total loss of what to do - part of me knows that I will really regret not studying abroad especially since I only get one chance in a lifetime to do it, but part of me also knows how important it is to land a job this summer and how miserable I would feel if I don't.

There a couple of firms that allow video and phone interviews from abroad in the spring semester. However I'm worried that this would be a big disadvantage to an in-person interview.

What do you guys think? To go abroad or stay for recruiting? And have any of you landed an internship while abroad before, and is it harder?

Comments (148)

Nov 27, 2013

I'm not US based so take what I say with a pinch of salt, I AM working/studying abroad at the moment (Moved from the UK to SE Asia) and it's been brilliant, traveled all over the place met some amazing people and experienced some very different cultures.

I was meant to stay here for the year but I AM coming back 5 months early because I landed a buy-side internship back in the UK. I got my internship through contacts from my old internship at an engineering company but found traditional recruiting pretty difficult out here.

Nov 27, 2013

I studied abroad the summer following my sophomore year because I was worried about running into this issue. That said, I know of one friend at my semi-target that was able to land a summer front office role for his junior summer at a BB. He did a video interview but I know for a fact that some banks were not as open to this as the one he landed at.

It's hard to give you a definitive answer here as I had a great experience studying abroad that I would gladly do over again, but I'd always recommend an in-person interview over a video/Skype one. Flying out for an in-person superday might be tough too depending on your program.

Nov 27, 2013

Do it. Plenty of people make it work out. Studying abroad was the best decision of my life even though it did make SA a nightmare.

Then again, it would really suck if you ended up in a program/place that blew.

"Yes. Money has been a little bit tight lately, but at the end of my life, when I'm sitting on my yacht, am I gonna be thinking about how much money I have? No. I'm gonna be thinking about how many friends I have and my children and my comedy albums."

Nov 27, 2013

Study abroad. Easily my biggest regret of undergrad. You will not get a chance to spend 3 months in Europe/wherever until you retire with good money. Plus it won't be the same at all. Study abroad is a 3 month vacation with joke classes mixed in.

Hell, if you're so worried about recruiting find an internship while you're abroad (especially if you go London, Zurich, Germany). My school had a program where you spent 8 weeks doing classes aka nothing then 8 weeks working at a bank.

Nov 27, 2013

IB will always be there. Seeing the world while you're still young will not.

I will not get into the subject of Spanish women.

That's a forum of it's own. Enjoy.

Nov 27, 2013

You can get something set up before you leave if you get on your shit now. I know plenty of people who have done this.

Nov 27, 2013

Agree with the above -- get your act together and start reaching out. Perhaps speak to seniors who were in the same position the prior year. No matter what, do NOT cancel your trip to Barcelona to go through recruiting.

Nov 27, 2013

One of the other SA's at my internship was abroad during the same period but that didn't effect him. He just got his act together in the fall.

Nov 27, 2013

I was in the same position as you when I was a junior....I didn't set anything up and therefore missed out on SA recruiting, but I busted my ass off for FT when senior year started and it all worked out in the end. As everyone is saying above DO NOTTTTT miss out on studying abroad, it was the best time of my life and I wouldn't give it up for a SA gig at any bank.

Nov 27, 2013

Check out the club "carpe diem", close to the Hotel Arts (ritz carlton owned I think)... last time I was there that place was THE SPOT

Nov 27, 2013

thanks everyone for your responses. I'll definitely start reaching out to people now so that hopefully by the time spring rolls around ill be relaxing on a beach in Barcelona without any worries.

Nov 27, 2013

There are accelerated recruiting deadlines at GS, MS, JPM, CS, BofAML, Barcap, and UBS (i applied to all of these last year). IN some cases, I'm convinced it was easier to land a summer offer than going through the entire process with the rest of your school. Network early if you are from non-target. If you are from target, go to BB recruiting events and connect with the HR.

Anyway, as everyone else says... going to a foreign country and having no burdens when you are a junior in college is absolutely a once in a lifetime opportunity. IB will always, always be there. Go study abroad and enjoy.

Nov 27, 2013

I want to disagree with the general trend here... it depends how dedicated you are to getting into IB. I would definitely set yourself up to go on the program to Barcelona, and then start networking hardcore in the fall. If 3 weeks before you leave you don't have anything, reassess then.

Nov 27, 2013

I wanted to thank everyone again for your advice. I landed an SA position at one of the BB's IBD by going through a study abroad superday and have been having the time of my life in Spain!! Already travelled to Rome and Florence and I'm heading to Morocco on Thursday.

@International Pymp - Carpe Diem is one helluva time.

@Midas - I use your exact response when a sophomore at my school asked me the same question I posed on this thread. "IB will always be there. Seeing the world while you're young will not." Couldn't be more true.

Thanks again everyone!!!

Nov 27, 2013

Are you away fall or winter? Do you go to a target? I am not sure if you are referring to FT recruiting or Summer. I have assumed that you meant summer since it's uncommon to go abroad your senior year.

Most banks will conduct an early round in November / December for candidate going abroad in the winter term. Obviously limited to targets. So if that's your case, you should be fine. If you'll be back for the winter semester, just send you applications without mentioning anything. If you're gone for the whole year, I would talk to OCR and figure when most banks will conduct 1st round and super days and plan to be around. Many banks might offer to do first round on the phone if you mention that you're abroad, but I would try to do everything in person as it's so much harder to get a feel for a candidate over the phone.

Nov 27, 2013

Some banks offer study abroad processes, I know GS does for sure and I think MS. In those processes you'd apply in mid-Novemeber and interview in December. Best thing to do, if you are at a target e-mail your school recruiter telling them you're studying abroad but really interested would love to apply early to allow for that

Nov 27, 2013

definitely better first semester
i don't know prague's schedule, but i know many study abroad/foreign spring semesters do not end until late june-- way past the starting date of many summer programs
although you may still be accepted to a program, you would have to start later than the rest of your summer analyst class, which is a disadvantage.

Nov 27, 2013

If you have contacts at banks you can get accelerated interview processes and/or have them fly you back for interviews.

Nov 27, 2013

q

Nov 27, 2013

thanks guys...so basically the interviews are second semester so I might as well just study abroad first semester?

Nov 27, 2013

I'm currently studying abroad at LSE. Although the exam schedule hasn't been released yet for this summer, my friend studied at LSE last year and her finals all ended by mid June. LSE is very strict about not missing exams. This same friend had a summer IB internship in New York that started in early June. As a result, she had to attend the training week (first week), then fly back to London and finish her exams. Most banks will understand your situation, however, so it's all good, just not the most convenient situation to be in.

You bring up a good point, namely that regardless of where you intern, you're going to be missing school. Although it's more hectic, I would rather miss the days before my finals than start senior year two weeks late.

As far as interviewing goes, if you're going to apply to London, apply early since a lot of the applications are rolling. Most of my friends who are currently interviewing with New York banks have first round phone interviews. Then they will fly out to New York for a final round interview if they advance. Some people regard flying to New York as hectic while others think of it is as a somewhat exciting chance to leave London for a weekend and visit New York. I've also heard of some places conducting video interviews for abroad applicants, though this is probably less common.

The short story is to apply to New York BB's accelerated interview programs. Basically you apply in November and if you make final rounds, you fly to New York to interview in December when LSE has its break anyway.

LSE's study abroad program is a great experience and I would highly recommend it. It just helps to be aware of the complications that come with attending a year-long study abroad program and to plan accordingly, that's all.

Nov 28, 2013

.

Nov 28, 2013

Banks have accelerated processes for candidates studying abroad in the spring.

Nov 28, 2013

if you have an internship lined up after junior summer you could get an offer right after

Nov 28, 2013

I do have an internship with a smaller company, but doubt it will amount to a full time offer.

Nov 28, 2013

I would venture a guess that it would be fine.

I studied abroad in London spring junior year, but one of my roommates was in his last semester. He actually got flown back from London to Nashville for Wells Fargo interviews; so I would imagine that if a large scale wall street firm wanted you they'd fly you back as well.

Nov 28, 2013

I have a summer internship lined up, and I will be going to Europe for the fall semester. I have been trying to do a study abroad for three semesters now but I have always pushed it back to participate in recruiting. While I consider finding a job the most importing thing for me to focus on right now, I only have two semesters left to go abroad.

Just go. You might never get the opportunity to go again, and I would imagine you will want to be on campus with your friends the last semester of college. I know that competition is beyond stiff in finance right now...but at some point you have to throw your hands up, say "I'm only 21", and go get wasted with the Europeans.

Nov 28, 2013

companies wont do skype interview unless u are personally affiliated with the managers or CEO.. for real..

Nov 28, 2013

Studying abroad junior year is recruiting suicide. Why would they take you via a skype interview when they have 1000 candidates they can actually meet in person. You are better off staying at school your junior year, getting an internship from a firm you really like, accepting the return offer over the summer, and studying abroad your senior fall or spring.

Nov 28, 2013

-

Nov 28, 2013

Sorry I wasn't clear: I mean I will be a senior this fall. I already spent my summer in banking, but I am looking for other jobs outside of banking.
Need less hours, more work/life balance. I would be happier with less pay.

Nov 28, 2013
  1. there are other threads, do a search
  2. in general, I say go abroad, once in a lifetime experience
  3. most big firms are accommodating, smaller ones without firm recruitment practices can be a hassle
Nov 28, 2013
GutShot:

2. in general, I say go abroad, once in a lifetime experience

This.

Nov 28, 2013
GutShot:

1. there are other threads, do a search
2. in general, I say go abroad, once in a lifetime experience
3. most big firms are accommodating, smaller ones without firm recruitment practices can be a hassle

  1. You are right. I apologize.
  2. I am already abroad actually so I would definitely have to concur.
  3. This was helpful. I now have a better idea which firms might not accommodate me so I'm not caught off guard.

2x2Matrix, thanks for backing consultants up and consistently giving out really solid advice.

"Rage, rage against the dying of the light." - DT

Nov 28, 2013

why are you doing consulting in the first place

Nov 28, 2013

gsduke, if you're just going to show up and bash consultants in every thread here, just don't write anything - this is the consulting sub-forum, and that's what we discuss. Didn't your parents tell you what to do if you don't have anything nice to say? Believe it or not, yes, some people want to do consulting. Deal with it.

Anyway, it sounds like the OP is already abroad or going abroad very soon. MBB will usually let you do your interview over the phone, but for the final round they'll usually want to get you there in person. In general, they'll try to accommodate you; they value the study-abroad experience.

Nov 28, 2013
Baronec:

I am a Sophomore in College, and I am considering studying abroad my Spring semester of Junior year, which is one year from now.

Only thing is.. Spring is interview season, and over winterbreak while I am a Junior, I am going to be aggressively applying to internships and networking my balls off to secure something great for my last summer. If I study abroad, I will be out of the US when companies will be conducting interviews.

I know a ton of people study abroad, so I was wondering if anyone has had an issue with this, or do companies make exceptions and do Skype interviews or phone interviews etc.. Should I not even waste my time going abroad and just stay in the US?

P.S. I go to a non-target University, so I am already at a disadvantage than most applicants. Will being abroad when interviews are taking place emphasize a negative outlook on my consideration? Share your thoughts and past experiences.

Honestly, go abroad in the fall. In college, I went sophomore spring because I knew I wanted a spring semester abroad, but the juniors who were there in my program who were trying to do recruiting had little luck. Some did Skype or Cisco Telepresence interviews, and I knew one girl who BAML flew back for a GCM superday, but I think literally none of them converted interviews to offers.

If you really want to go abroad, do it early enough that it doesn't negatively impact recruiting or do it after recruiting. Going junior fall means you can still network (emails, phone) as well as you could anyway at your non-target, you wouldn't be missing campus presentations.

Nov 28, 2013

Are you sure about the finals being in late June, have you checked for your specific modules. Most of the UG ones, especially year 2, tend to be in May. Could you not just pick modules that they tend to examine early?

http://www2.lse.ac.uk/intranet/students/registrati...

Nov 28, 2013

I think they are both good choices. LSE is slightly better known than UCL, but they both have strong reputations so it doesn't really matter.

Personally, I would go for LSE just because you will get to experience a full year abroad, which will be a great 'life' experience! Although you might have to call or email several months in advance (I would start networking this summer), I believe that you might be able to pursue both NYC and London internships even if you spend the full year in London.

I landed a SA at a top BB even though I was off campus. It required a little bit of networking, but basically I had a phone interview and then they flew me to NYC for the final round. So don't give up a great year just because you think you need to be at on-campus recruiting in the US!

Nov 28, 2013

Finals start in mid may and go to late june, but the problem is that they don't release the schedule until the winter. So for now I have no way of picking classes that have early finals, especially since the schedule changes completely each year. Since i'm taking four courses its seems like there is a very good chance that at least one would be scheduled for june.

Nov 28, 2013

They won't give you specific exam dates, but you can bank on your last exam being no later than June 10, the 15th at the latest. You want to check out whether you can use OCR at your school now while you're abroad, because otherwise you'll be forced to only use LSE OCR which will have a strong focus to positions outside of the US, specifically London. I have friends who used their home school's OCR and did the Skype interviews or were flown in. I also have friends who were barred from using OCR unless they could make interviews on campus itself. Out of those, most if not all of them were able to use the LSE OCR to get the internships they wanted, albeit usually in London rather than NY.

The General Course is an awesome program and I would highly recommend doing the year abroad, given that you understand the risks with OCR and you'll accept them.

Nov 28, 2013

I'm currently studying abroad at LSE and from my experience being here, I'd say if you are doing social sciences, especially Econ., then LSE is a much better option than UCL. In this year's league table it was ranked 2nd best university in the UK, behind Cambridge and ahead of Imperial, Oxford, etc.

As far as internships go, I really don't have a preference between London and New York, at least based on other people's accounts. And if you are lucky, your last exam will be in May, like mine, even though my internship in the City doesn't start until late June. I should also add that many other General Course students who are spending a year abroad at LSE also have internships in the States, so yes you can do it too.

However if you decide to intern in London, mind you it is more competitive to get an internship here, at least based on my own experience. Among other things, you'll be competing with kids from LSE, Oxford, Cambridge, Warwick and other top schools from all over Europe. And you'll also have to take at least 2 numerical tests. That said, it's very possible to get an internship here as many other students from the States have in the past.

Good luck with your decision!

Nov 28, 2013

So, if I were to decide I wanted to pursue an internship in the US, but I had a final scheduled for early to mid june, what would happen...? Anyone know?

Thanks.

Nov 28, 2013

Do option 2, and go abroad again senior spring if that's an option. This way you have more time to travel through the summer.

Nov 28, 2013

What do Stanford kids do? They do not finish until early June if I recall properly.

Nov 28, 2013

Hey guys, another option: I could do the first semester at UCL and the second semester at the University of Hong Kong. Its either that or a year at the LSE. Thoughts?

Nov 28, 2013

You gotta make up your mind what you want. I don't think that it will be a problem at all to get an itnernship if banks are really interested in you. You can always go through first rounds etc. on the phone or go through their London office.

However, just my two cents: What the hell are you even thinking about? You're willing to give up living in one of the greatest cities in the world, because you are scared that you might possibly miss out on an internship? Come on man

Nov 28, 2013

Well the dilemma now is between London for a year or London for a semester and Hong Kong for a semester. So either way I'll be living someplace great for a year.

Nov 28, 2013

LSE > UCL+HK

Nov 28, 2013

Well the upside to the UCL+HK is that HK ends at the end of May, whereas the LSE will probably end mid june, so I would completely void any scheduling conflicts as far as internships are concerned.

Nov 28, 2013

One internship abroad and 3 semesters abroad. It delayed graduating by one year, but definitely one of the best decisions of my life!

Another plus to studying abroad is it provides a great topic of conversation for interviews.

Nov 28, 2013

Would there be no hope for someone once they started working? Besides getting moved to an international office, are there any well-known companies/programs that do international rotations?

Nov 28, 2013
zeuscannon:

Would there be no hope for someone once they started working? Besides getting moved to an international office, are there any well-known companies/programs that do international rotations?

Definitely still hope to live abroad once you've started working. I live in Beijing and know several people that are here working for international companies on rotational programs.

Nov 28, 2013

I just can't afford it

Nov 28, 2013
J_monkey:

I just can't afford it

Between grants, scholarships, and even loans- the money is out there. There are numerous grant and scholarship programs specifically for study abroad. Get on the Google and start scouring for them like you would for a boutique bank MD's email.

Nov 28, 2013

I studied abroad in two different countries and interned abroad in a third country. I still graduated in four years with a degree in finance and economics. However, I had to cram many of the classes in college and had to balance a lot of things so I wasn't able to keep my gpa up as much as I wanted to. That and my university doesn't count study abroad grades for gpa.

In any case it was really worth it cause I was also able to do it completely on the university's money. My scholarships exceeded the cost of studying abroad so I ended up even having some extra spending money directly from the university!

"I have never let my schooling interfere with my education" - Mark Twain

Nov 28, 2013

+1, SB.

I've done a full semester overseas. Though all classes were in English, the native language was not English, I was in an environment far removed from home, and used the opportunity to visit some of the more exotic locations of the world before I came back.

A couple of tips for those wanting to go on a semester exchange/year long exchange:

  • keep your GPA sky high if you want first choice of destinations.
  • take an extra course in the semester(s) leading up to it, allowing you to do a reduced work load or non-relevant "interest" courses overseas
  • any destination is better than no destination. Don't turn down an opportunity in rural Germany just because you'd prefer Paris. I've seen students do this - they have a preferred destination and aren't willing to compromise. Guess who was jealous that I went and they did not? Take what you can get.
  • send postcards back home to family rather than just emails. A postcard is more meaningful than an email, and your family will be grateful.
  • For the second time, keep your GPA sky high if you want the best opportunities.
    • 1
Nov 28, 2013

I did a semester in the US (Chapel Hill). It was in a foreign language and I learned a lot about the culture ;)

Nov 28, 2013

Regarding not being able to afford it.

I did a semester in Bangkok and could be done for much less than a semester at home if you don't count the excessive travel I did while I was there.

Flight - $800

1-Bedroom Apartment - $200 / month

Food - $300 / month ***Very conservative can get a meal for $1

Textbooks - $1 / Month *** Photocopied one due to slack copyright

Transportation - $100 / Month *** Taxi's are cheap (~$3 for 20min ride)

Booze - $100 / Month *** Bottle of Liquor is $5 & Beers are $1.50

Just showing that there are ways to experience studying abroad if working with a limited budget.

Nov 28, 2013

great post, I didnt study abroad but really wish I did, and now i'm making up for it

WSO's COO (Chief Operating Orangutan) | My Linkedin

Nov 28, 2013

1 internship abroad that turned into full time...wouldnt change it for the world

I eat success for breakfast...with skim milk

Nov 28, 2013
olafenizer:

Maybe I have a slightly different perspective on this topic because I grew up literally in the middle of a corn field and the extent of my childhood multicultural experience was talking to the 4 or 5 Hispanic kids in my grade whose parents worked at the canning factory during harvest season, but whenever I hear somebody ask whether they should study abroad as opposed to doing an internship or minor, I have to chuckle.

I chuckle because in my mind there is absolutely no reason why one wouldn't do a study abroad. Maybe it's because my hometown was 98% other white people and I wanted to get as far away from that as possible, but I really think study abroad should be required for every student. And not just because getting wasted in a foreign country and all the shenanigans that go along with that is really fun. There are actually real skills to be gained, skills you will never get from a paper pushing internship.

It starts by picking the right city to go to. For the love of God please don't go to London. There are few things that are a bigger waste of time and money than going to another English-speaking country to do a study abroad. If you're going to do it, do it right. Do a program that is conducted in a foreign language, or a straight up intensive language program in a developing country. Throw yourself into an unfamiliar environment. This is an expedition, not a vacation.

By jumping into a culture you've never experienced before, not only will you learn a ton about that other culture, but more importantly at the same time you'll learn things about just as much about yourself- how you react and adapt, why you have certain perceptions and expectations.

Leave your laptop back in the States. The more you disconnect from your lifestyle in the US, the more you will be able to integrate into the new environment. How good of an experience can you have if you sit on your Facebook everyday chatting with your friends back home?

If you do it right, after the initial excitement wears off you won't enjoy your experience. You'll miss your family and friends. You'll hate the fact that everybody speaks a different language than you. You'll have a hard time understanding the different values system. More than anything you'll just want to go home.

After a few weeks though you'll start to feel better as you figure things out and become more settled in. You'll become more comfortable getting around in the local language. By the time you have to go home, you'll almost feel a little bit like you're actually leaving home. It will feel good to go back to your family and friends, but you'll feel like you're leaving something behind.

In regard to exactly which semester to go abroad, I recommend doing it the summer after your freshman year or the fall of your sophomore year. If you have your heart set on doing finance internships in New York, studying abroad earlier in your college career not only gives you flexibility to pursue internships, but will also better prepare you for those internships by helping you understand how you operate in an unfamiliar environment.

Heck you could even do a semester abroad, come back for a year and then go abroad again for a year. Maybe that would cause you to delay graduation by a year, but you have your whole life ahead of you to sit in an office being someone else's bitch. Spend the time you have now doing something that actually matters. Study abroad teaches not only helps you learn about a foreign culture, but helps you understand yourself.

Semester at Sea I heard is an absolute shitshow...But highly respectable.

Eventus stultorum magister.

Nov 28, 2013
Johnny Ringo:
olafenizer:

Maybe I have a slightly different perspective on this topic because I grew up literally in the middle of a corn field and the extent of my childhood multicultural experience was talking to the 4 or 5 Hispanic kids in my grade whose parents worked at the canning factory during harvest season, but whenever I hear somebody ask whether they should study abroad as opposed to doing an internship or minor, I have to chuckle.

I chuckle because in my mind there is absolutely no reason why one wouldn't do a study abroad. Maybe it's because my hometown was 98% other white people and I wanted to get as far away from that as possible, but I really think study abroad should be required for every student. And not just because getting wasted in a foreign country and all the shenanigans that go along with that is really fun. There are actually real skills to be gained, skills you will never get from a paper pushing internship.

It starts by picking the right city to go to. For the love of God please don't go to London. There are few things that are a bigger waste of time and money than going to another English-speaking country to do a study abroad. If you're going to do it, do it right. Do a program that is conducted in a foreign language, or a straight up intensive language program in a developing country. Throw yourself into an unfamiliar environment. This is an expedition, not a vacation.

By jumping into a culture you've never experienced before, not only will you learn a ton about that other culture, but more importantly at the same time you'll learn things about just as much about yourself- how you react and adapt, why you have certain perceptions and expectations.

Leave your laptop back in the States. The more you disconnect from your lifestyle in the US, the more you will be able to integrate into the new environment. How good of an experience can you have if you sit on your Facebook everyday chatting with your friends back home?

If you do it right, after the initial excitement wears off you won't enjoy your experience. You'll miss your family and friends. You'll hate the fact that everybody speaks a different language than you. You'll have a hard time understanding the different values system. More than anything you'll just want to go home.

After a few weeks though you'll start to feel better as you figure things out and become more settled in. You'll become more comfortable getting around in the local language. By the time you have to go home, you'll almost feel a little bit like you're actually leaving home. It will feel good to go back to your family and friends, but you'll feel like you're leaving something behind.

In regard to exactly which semester to go abroad, I recommend doing it the summer after your freshman year or the fall of your sophomore year. If you have your heart set on doing finance internships in New York, studying abroad earlier in your college career not only gives you flexibility to pursue internships, but will also better prepare you for those internships by helping you understand how you operate in an unfamiliar environment.

Heck you could even do a semester abroad, come back for a year and then go abroad again for a year. Maybe that would cause you to delay graduation by a year, but you have your whole life ahead of you to sit in an office being someone else's bitch. Spend the time you have now doing something that actually matters. Study abroad teaches not only helps you learn about a foreign culture, but helps you understand yourself.

Semester at Sea I heard is an absolute shitshow...But highly respectable.

In retrospect, I wish I had done that for a semester. The sheer breadth of places you visit is astounding... you'll never have to travel ever again. Nor will you ever have as much time to do so.

Nov 28, 2013

You go to a target. Network.

Nov 28, 2013

bump

Nov 28, 2013

anyone got any idea/experience to share?

Nov 28, 2013

bumppp

Nov 28, 2013

Just be aware of when the semester starts and ends. I spent last year studying abroad, and the semester started and ended a month later. That and the fact that I was there for both semesters took away my chance of getting an internship. Luckily, I am only a sophomore.

Nov 28, 2013

Do whatever you want. You are young once, and as you'll see over time, many folks on Wall St and elsewhere didn't follow the Analyst-->Associate-->VP/MD etc track. Many people's paths are serendipitous and in this market environment, it's more of an incentive to blaze your own trail. Life only happens once.

Nov 28, 2013

My school actually had interview slots for those studying abroad in the spring. For the banks that didn't, I simply applied online and for one of the banks I paid for my accommodation while in New York given that the interview was off-cycle.

Feel free to PM me with follow-up questions.

Nov 28, 2013

Did you plan ahead? I know some firms have accelerated application processes and there are F500 firms recruiting in the fall for interns. You could also get an internship in the city your studying in. I was able to with some networking.

Nov 28, 2013

Yeah, just start contacting people right now and you should be fine

Nov 28, 2013

Just about every BB has accelerated interviews in December for study abroad students

Nov 28, 2013

How do you apply to accelerated interviews? Does it just require cold emailing people/HR at the bank and letting them know?

Nov 28, 2013

There is a separate application for study abroad applicants, usually due by the end of November. Just don't miss the deadline since it is earlier than the normal summer recruiting process. Alternatively, some cities interview earlier than others, for instance in early January as opposed to February or March. So if you wanted, you could delay your departure abroad by a week or two if the interview dates for the internships you're interested in occur in early-mid January. But I would do this only if you (or anyone else) had missed the accelerated deadline.

Nov 28, 2013

McK will do one superday at the office before you head abroad. Bain will do both rounds by phone in the spring at the same time they will be on your campus. Could be wrong here, but I think BCG does what McK does. By the way, I went to a target.

Nov 28, 2013

Thanks, that's good to know. Do many 2nd/3rd tiers (AT Kearney, Deloitte, etc) do this too?

Nov 28, 2013

I think it all depends on how early you reach out to firms about your situation and the type of candidate you are. If you get in touch with people early enough, no firm will be beyond reach. I talked to ones above in September on my junior year.

For the following firms, I applied through the on-campus process while I was abroad. AT was willing to talk to me by phone. Accenture could not interview me. Monitor and Katzenbach only do interviews in person.

Nov 28, 2013

Reproductions?

One of the most important things about college is having meaningful experiences with peers, this creates networks & relationships that will hopefully benefit your future. There should be no negative aspects of studying abroad from a professional standpoint. Studying abroad will provide a good talking point in networking/interviewing, it would allow the chance of experiencing different cultures, I really can't see a downside.

Nov 28, 2013

If IB is your goal you had best get that sophomore internship.

Nov 28, 2013

I did a study abroad in China and every interview I've ever had it has been brought up in and talked about for longer than just about anything else on my resume.

Nov 28, 2013

To add to this, everyone I've ever networked with has said my stand-out experience is the work/study abroad I did and really honed in on it also. It sets you apart from other people in a big way especially in an arena where pretty much everyone has great academics & a relevant internship under their belt already.

  • justanotherbanker
  •  Nov 28, 2013

Most BB internships start early June.

Lehman runs two 8-week sessions and I believe one of those starts around July. That might be your best bet for NYC.

Showing up late would mean missing your training. Pretty sure most places will find that unnaceptable.

The one positive thing I've heard about going abroad is that it can be much easier to land the first round interview (because you'll probably have to make a special, early appointment -- before the rest of the pool).

Hope this helps.

Nov 28, 2013

sometimes the kids we recruit for our Chicago office aren't even done with finals by the time training starts, they have to manage somehow.

Nov 28, 2013

how possible is it to get an internship in the london office and then transfer to the NYC office for senior year?

thanks.

Nov 28, 2013

sorry to ask the question again--but how difficult is it to get an internship in the london office, and then transfer for full time to NYC, if one has the study abroad program described above.

thanks!

Nov 28, 2013

probably hard - just as hard to get an internship in London as it is in New York - probably harder because of the complexity of products being used in london.

Nov 28, 2013

this is actually a great question...study abroad is great, but i know ppl who got screwed by early starts

Nov 28, 2013

Have you thought about doing a spring internship while you're in school? You could also take summer classes online while doing an internship or even travelling-- I completed an online class last summer while travelling in Thailand after study abroad in Hong Kong.

What university will you attend? Are you fluent in Mandarin?

Nov 28, 2013

If your an accounting major and want to do accounting then you should be fine. If you want something in business then you might have problems. Banks have early interviews for juniors that are studying abroad, but I dont think they have them for Sophomore. It will be extremely difficult to find an internship while you are in China and you will have to do it before you leave. If you can, I suggest studying abroad this Summer (I know the deadline passed, but see if you can sneak on one; your school may let you), first semester Sophomore year (you can network from China and then come back for interviews in the Winter), or first semester junior year (internship recruiting does not start until Dec, and doesn't hit full swing until Jan-Feb.).

Its not the classes you should be worried about, although make sure you take a corp. finance course and a fixed income course (called debt instruments in your school I think). These courses will give you a strong background knowledge and understanding. You can learn the rest later/read a study guide before the interview.

Nov 28, 2013

go to beijing. youll be fine with recruiting as long as you plan ahead and adjust accordingly. the experience you get from going abroad will make up for any of the downsides. totally worth it! not to mention, your junior to senior year internship is more important than next year anyway

Nov 28, 2013

So basically if I go, what steps should I take to prepare with the recruiting and planning?

I am fluent in Cantonese, and in the process of learning Mandarin. I would say I am 75% fluent.

I would also love the possibility of finding an internship in Hong Kong, but I don't know the chances of that since I don't even know where to begin to look for a company to help me get a working Visa.

Nov 28, 2013

bump

Nov 28, 2013

same question!

Nov 28, 2013

Anyone has had any experience? Would greatly appreciate it!

Nov 28, 2013

In my experience, studying abroad spring semester definitely made internship recruiting slightly more difficult (e.g. not being able to network in person, setting up calls at weird hours). However, I don't think this should make or break your decision. If you have the luxury to go in the fall instead, definitely do that (I couldn't because I played football) but I don't think a company would pass up on a well qualified employee simply because of the complicated logistics of recruiting when studying abroad.

Nov 28, 2013

I studied abroad my junior spring and managed to get an internship (but not in IBD). Lots of things to consider, but here are some of my thoughts.

1) The top banks have accelerated recruiting in the late fall for kids that are studying abroad. If you start networking early you could be included in that. And since you're at a non-target, you'll need to network anyway--so just start earlier.

2) If you aren't confident in your ability to get something in the accelerated process, I would recommend not going abroad for your junior spring. Being away during the spring is killer for OCR. I still dropped my resume, but a lot of companies weren't willing/able to switch to skype/phone interviews. I mean, think about it from their point of view--they could either interview you on the phone and have to guess how you would present yourself in person, or they could inteview an equally qualified candidate in person and not have to guess about it. I had a few companies that I had strong phone interviews with, but since they hadn't actually met me, I didn't end up getting an offer.

3) To address OP point 2, flying in from abroad is much more expensive, so most won't be willing to pay for it when they have plenty more candidates in the country.

If I could do it again, I would have studied abroad a different semester. I did end up getting a decent internship, but it was a really stressful process, and I almost definitely could have gotten something better if I had been on campus for OCR (even though I didn't go to a target).

Feel free to ask more specific questions if you have any.

Nov 28, 2013

Thank you! That's very helpful. I am studying abroad now in my Sophomore Spring and hope to manage to get a good internship in my Junior year.

Nov 28, 2013

From what I've been told interviews are typically in January/February. Also, a lot of banks conduct first-round interviews for non-target students over the phone anyways.

Nov 28, 2013

Being abroad in the fall is the opposite of what you want. You need to do all your networking then, so that you can either participate in the accelerated process which goes on in December before you leave or be a standout candidate and get invited back during your semester abroad.

Nov 28, 2013

Banks do SA recruiting in the spring too

Nov 28, 2013

Actually, at least in Houston most recruiting for SA started in January (the interviews, that is). You could submit resumes anytime before then, and they held info sessions and etc in the Fall, but all the banks in Houston held first rounds and superdays in January, a few in February. This was the case for JPMorgan, Lazard, Nomura, ScotiaWaterous, Goldman, and others that I can't remember for sure right now. I think Morgan Stanley was one who had an earlier date in Houston, but not sure.

My point is, being abroad during the Fall is better than being abroad during the Spring, assuming your interviews are in January.

Nov 28, 2013

Being abroad in the fall is worse in my opinion (and experience), because in the fall you can do networking + recruiting. In the spring, you're behind the game if you're just then trying to network. Spring is all about recruiting.

Nov 28, 2013

A guy in my SA class did the same thing except went to the LSE. You'll be fine, make sure you network you ass off via email/phone during the fall and get everything in on time. From what I've come to understand JWR34 is right about non-target first round interviews being over the phone. Also, you're going to Oxford BBs definitely recruit there, my buddy got a few interviews just leveraging OCR at the LSE the semester he was there.

Good Luck.

Nov 28, 2013

Posse I don't think it even matters which semester you go abroad, and I might even argue that it is better to go abroad in the fall. You can easily network (email resumes and call via Skype) in the fall while you're abroad and set yourself up for interviews in the spring - unless you're studying in a remote village with no electricity. On the other hand, if you study abroad in the spring you need to attack early and set up accelerated interviews in the fall before you go abroad.

Nov 28, 2013

ML, GS, Citi, CS, JPM, & lehman all had set study abroad super days. MS didn't have a set day from what I know, but they were acomodating and allowed me to come in and interview early. UBS was the only BB that I talked to who flat out said they didn't have any sort of early process for those studying abroad in the sprin.

Nov 28, 2013
tyang:

Greetings,

I would like to know if the bulge brackets accommodate the folks, who will be studying abroad in the spring semester, by granting earlier interviews for summer analyst positions.

Thanks in advance.

I applaude you for asking this question. This is the strategy those who really want to be in banking should use, rather than waiting until they get back and complaining about how they missed interviews because of study abroad.

Those who discourage studying abroad should also read this.

Nov 28, 2013

This is a really good way to get into a firm from a non-target school. This way you do not get stuck on the very last day in March where they really have no intention of hiring.

Nov 28, 2013

forgot to mention. Towards the end of the summer get proactive and start contacting hr and asking them about the study abroad interviews so you don't miss the dates. Some of the banks don't really advertise these interviews on their websites and college career centers. I had to pursue lb, ms, and ML to find out about their early interviews and this is even coming from a target. GL and if you have any other q's feel free to pm me.

Nov 28, 2013

Thanks for the positive feedback. I forgot to mention that I am from a non-target school.

I am also considering studying abroad during my last semester (spring '09) as opposed to the spring semester (spring '08) of my penultimate year. Are there any opinions regarding my options?

Side note:
I will be interning at a boutique investment bank this summer. Hopefully, this experience will give me a leg up on the next summer analyst recruiting cycle for bulge brackets.

Nov 28, 2013
tyang:

I am also considering studying abroad during my last semester (spring '09) as opposed to the spring semester (spring '08) of my penultimate year. Are there any opinions regarding my options?

Hi,

I just want to mention the fact that, depending on your destination, you might find yourself on an extremely tight (or potentially impossible) schedule with respect to the end of your semester abroad and the beginning of your internship back in the US. For example at most UK schools you will be done around the end of may. This could possibly go up to mid-late june for continental european schools, although there are some exceptions. So definitely something to bear in mind and look out for.

Nov 28, 2013

mean_reversion, thanks for the reminder.

I did a quick search on the forum for start date.
For 1st year analysts, the consensus start date is late June/early July (http://www.ibankingoasis.com/node/5836). For summer analysts, it seems like they start in early June (http://www.ibankingoasis.com/node/4944).

Nov 28, 2013

you have to find out the hr contacts at the banks and talk to them directly. I wish I'd known banks did this my junior year. It wouldv'e made things a hell of a lot easier for me.

Most banks do provide accelerated interviews in the fall, but don't publicize it very much. I think there was a thread about this a week ago or so, might want to do a search

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