I work for Edward Jones!
Now, answer honestly...could you ever see yourself saying those words? How about if one of your buddies hit you with that line? What would be your reaction?
Everywhere I turn lately, I see examples of people "living the dream". Generally, their means are humble, their horizons not too distant, but then I meet guys like Ted. They make me scratch my head about internal and external motivation .
Ted is one of these guys. The ones who make me think all my ambition and hubris are the not the engine, but the brakes stalling my machinery. Here's what the general public thinks about Ted and his colleagues , consider it as you read on.
Ted's 26 and has been at this racket since he finished high school. I met Ted, a gregarious fellow, who would make most native New Yorkers pull up and blow chunks at the sight of his genuine interest in others, about two years ago in a small Midwestern town. I swear the guy's like a saint, he runs to the other side of the street to help the old lady cross, gets shouted out mid stride by half the community, waves to passing cars like the Homecoming Queen and wears a permanent grin that would put the Joker to shame.
Ted makes a nice six figure salary, he has zero debt. He owns his house outright, has a vacation home, three cars, a boat, twin jet skis, a Ninja and a Harley. He works 9-5 Monday to Friday. In his community Ted is beloved like Jimmy Stewart in "It's a Wonderful Life". He really makes me friggin' mad...
Who is this non-Alpha male to be living the dream while I ride the subway next to a guy currently crapping himself? He doesn't have my style, my attitude, he doesn't crush it! He talks to old ladies about their annuities all day. He says stuff like "you shouldn't put all your eggs in one basket, Eunice" or "gotta start puttin'away for Tommy's college fund, ey George?". He wears a Tommy Hilfiger suit he bought at TJ Maxx for Pete's sake!!!
Though it has been asked many times on this site before...and many times in general...what is it about Wall Street? The allure of yesteryear is certainly no longer there. The models and bottles era has come to a screeching halt. Now on top of all that, guys like Ted seem to be the ones living, what many on The Street only dream about.
Is this for real? Is perception the real reality? Is Ted having the last laugh?
Would he even find this funny?
Ted isn't having the last laugh. Ben from Local PE Partners is. You see, Ben worked on Wall Street for a few years after college, and then returned home. Sort of like Mayor Matt did after Harvard Law.
There are a few Bens in every smaller city. Ben pulls in well over a Mill annually, runs many of the important local MM businesses, and has plenty of time on his hands. He is in the local Biz Times every other day, everyone knows who he is. Due to his success, people go to him asking how to fix the city.
These guys are super-Teds, and they don't have to grin.
Edward Jones is a joke... The job of the financial advisors is to walk around town knocking on doors, getting to know as many people in the community as possible. 90% of them quit or fail out of the business in the first 2 years. You just push crappy mutual funds onto people. Some of the best Edward Jones hires are former teachers and retired cops... guys who everybody already trusts, have huge networks, and know nothing about finance.
In your example, Ted is also the guy in town who is friends with everybody because he HAS to be. His prosperity is based on how many people in town like him. It's equivalent of being in a constant popularity contest.... Most people here want to have "F You" money, which is actually the opposite.
agreed. i did a little stint as a financial advisor. i found it to be unbearable. wearing a fake smile and "schmoozing" with people you can't stand... it's so draining, I wouldn't do it again for any amount of money in the world. By the way Ted sounds like a major fruit cup.
Speak for yourself.
If you ever want to make it big in IB/PE/VC/any other industry and you start with negative or very low net worth, you have to be nice. Personal relations is everything. You think Ken Moelis, Jamie Dimon, or Ken Lewis posses some kind of technical skills/abilities others don't?
Yes, there are good financial advisors from Edward Jones and bad financial advisors from EJ. My Dad got referred to this guy from a friend who was heavily involved in VC. The EJ guy called the stock market crash back in August 2008, told my Dad to get out of stock, and saved him a big chunk of his retirement money. Dad's a tax accountant who has a national reputation for handing situations with derivatives and normally manages his own money, but he says that the guy earned 10 years worth of fees based off of that.
Two of the smartest people I know from Illinois' accounting program went to work for EJ's investment banking division (and unless you go to UT Austin, we have a stronger Accy program than your school). Also, go to most places in the banking world and their fund managers have a bit of a reputation for being a lot smarter and more sophisticated than they let on.
I'm not going to speak to the average EJ employee vs the average GS employee, but there's smart people everywhere and EJ collects a number of smart kids who grew up on some farm outside of Rockford, IL got offers from GS and an admission to a PhD program at the London School, but they couldn't find a good Free Methodist church in Manhattan or London and didn't like the idea of moving so far from their family, so they picked EJ in St. Louis or Chicago. Now, they often continue to genuinely see themselves as ordinary, simple people because it makes for better business relationships and more friends.
So when I meet someone from Edward Jones, I take them pretty seriously. If Slacker23 doesn't get an offer from an NY BB, EJ might be a good place to land.
See, the problem is that motorcycles aren't that much fun in the Midwest. You get about 1-2 fewer months than the Northeast and all the roads are frigging straight. Disagree. (I am assuming that Ted lives in a small town rather than the suburbs of a big city.) Midwesterners are notoriously conservative with money. Iowans and Minnesotans are probably the worst. When the country was averaging 7.5% unemployment, Iowa was sitting pretty at 4.5%. During the agricultural bust of the 80s, the Midwest suffered a lot less than other parts of the country.That might be different in the suburbs or in downtown St. Louis, but chances are that Ted's wife, Tina, who got married right after final exams Senior year of college, insisted they pay cash for the house. Both of them graduated school without any debt (both went to state school, worked during the summer, and got some help from the parents), and Tina buys most of her clothes from Wal-Mart. (Except after Ted bought the Ninja and the Jet-skis- then she splurged and bought a couple conservative dresses at Bergner's). Tina has never used a credit card in her life and always pays cash for everything.
Seriously, are you able to read? Read the damn posts I was responding to instead of talking out of your ass. Nobody making low 6 figures is going to comfortably own a vacation house, 3 cars, a couple motorcycles, jet skis, and vacations multiple times a year without massive debt unless they have a few rich Ted's as uncles named Ken Lewis.
And I live in the midwest (work in Chicago, went to school on the southside) and have seen plenty. I think you're exaggerating substantially about how fiscally conservative people are from most of the Chicago suburbs.
Where are the facts in your post? Where is the news?
Why is this on the front page? Patrick, please get some more experienced, older guys to write these things.
Suprisingly this is actually a really good post MAGOO. Ted will have the last laugh on about 98% on the people on this website. You cant beat 0 debt house paid out right, he probably married a hot blonde midwestern chick and takes 10 vacations a year.
People in this forum need to face reality and this is a great way to smack it on their faces. Everyone in here "thinks" they will wind up in PE someday or running a Hedge Fund, probably have a ton of debt, have never seen a "box" in their lifetime and are so stuck in the whole FU money mentality that not even realizing it will be the cause of their own demise.
I think Teds life is great! if your horizons are not too distant as you said.
Me I'm not driven by money and the whole FU money bullshit...
I'm Driven by good old SUCCESS! everything else just comes with it.
No debt? Ted's are swimming in debt up to their ears, barely paying off 30 year mortgages, leasing a bunch of cars, etc. Plenty of people like that making circa 6 figures that live paycheck to paycheck on top of a good amount of debt.
Doesn't that happen to a bunch of people significantly richer than Ted? Aren't there lots of people who make a few hundred thousand dollars a year, but are still swimming in debt and living paycheck to paycheck? Sure, they have much nicer things than Ted, but they're still living paycheck to paycheck, it's just that their mortgage and car payments are much larger than Ted's.
I really don't see the point here--read the post I responded to. He was describing a guy with two homes, multiple cars, motorcycles, etc. Sure, even mega millionaires can blow their loads and go broke, but it is still far more common for nouveau riche Todds/Teds/Chads/etc. who want everyone to 'see' them having a lot of money. And 'a few hundred thousand' dollars would still put them in the same frame as the person I described because that is very little difference in terms of spending power if you don't consider location.
^^^ great post
Ted's happy, good for him. Me, if I had that job, I wouldn't be happy. Therefore, I don't pursue that career. It just doesn't suit my personality the way IB/PE/VC/HF/consulting would. I was drawn into wanting to pursue this line of work first because of the money. Now I'm staying because I believe this high level finance type of work suits my personality the best and would be where I excel the most/am happiest at. High level finance is not meant for everyone just like financial advising is not meant for everyone. Ted can BS with the common man, I don't think I could as well as he can. Ted probably doesn't have the work ethic or drive that I do.
Both career paths have positives and negatives. I'll take the good and the bad with high level finance knowing that I researched other career paths and have come to the decision that this is the appropriate path for me.
And bankers BS CEOs of multi-billion corporations. Don't even pretend that this is not true.
Conversation #1: MD: "Ok PussInBoots, this is what I want from this start-up: Year : Revenue 2010 : $1MM 2011 : $3MM 2012: $10MM 2013: $40MM 2014: $100M
Give or take few MM. And make sure quarterly growth rates look normal"
Conversation #2: Puss: "Hi MD, why is coloring so weird in that model you sent me? I mean Look-Up Tables have 7 difference colors." MD: "Coloring makes model look more complicated for our client."
I have nothing against banking, I enjoy it, and I cannot wait to start FT, but I try not to be self-righteous and pretentious about this industry..
the key word was COMMON, CEOs are in no way common.
To define common: someone with an average 9-5 job of average intelligence and of average wants and needs. A great example is a cop or a teacher.
That external/internal motivation part was interesting. Someone's misery can be your happiness and someone's happiness can be your misery. It's all a matter of personal perception. For example, some guy could be running his own burger joint and be living HIS dream. Whereas for me, that would be misery. I would love to be in a BB's IBD, but that could be misery for him (despite the big dollars). I have a passion for a certain industry, whereas he has a passion for making food.
As someone above said, Ted is swimming in debt if he has two homes, three cars, jet skis, multiple motorcycles, etc. Doing all that on a low 6 figure salary is as big a relic of the "age of leverage" as anything you will find on wall st. I am not knocking Ted, Edward Jones, or the job of financial advisor, but let's be real about what it entails. The reality is that Ted lives in a suburb of St. Louis, next to 100 houses that look exactly like his, and frets about paying for his kids college education because he falls just above financial aid level. He takes a couple of vacations a year to the gulf of mexico or the ozarks...unless he has some family money.
Again, Im not knocking Ted...believe me there are many days when I would love to work in a low pressure job in the midwest...but let's be honest and deal in reality.
I will admit that his wife is probably hot and nice and that he probably is a good guy who old ladys enjoy talking to. My girlfriend is hot but spoiled and old people find me frightening and impatient.
rofl, this is awesome
As someone who visits this area frequently I can say with certainty that this is the most accurate post on this thread.
^^^ hilarious
i guess to each their own. props to the Ted's out there but like most of you guys said, i rather stay on Wall Street vs. Main Street.
Some Teds work their ass off and make over a mil a year. I worked with a Jewish Ted that did that last year in GWM
I really really have to laugh at this post because it truly exemplfies how inexperienced and naive most of the posters are here. I work in GWM as a financial advisor and am more than qualified to speak on this.
Saying that you are a financial advisor (wealth manager, financial consultant, etc..the title means little) is much like saying you work in construction. Maybe you remodel people's bathrooms and maybe you own the company that builds skyscrapers....obviously very different types of jobs. The same applies for working in GWM. On the low end of the spectrum you might have young kids selling annuities and CDs to their clients at a bank (or maybe Ed Jones). On the opposite end you have advisors that are managing multi billion dollar books of business which is made up of UHNW clients, corporate accounts and smaller institutional accounts (pensions, endowments, foundations, etc). You just can't lump them into the same category.
Ted does exist in retail brokerage and honestly he is probably pretty happy living in the mid west somewhere making his 200K a year with his pleasant lifestyle and good looking wife. He works as hard as he wants to work (not very hard once he has his client base), when he wants to work and has job security that none of you will ever enjoy.
Other Teds make millions per year, still control their own schedule and once again have a level of security that can't be beat. It does takes a tremendous amount of work, time and knowledge to get there (yes...believe it or not some of us actually do have an education, understand basic security analysis, how capital markets work and can manage a portfolio...not just sell products), that being said it's a pretty damn nice lifestyle once you've made it.
Wealth is relative. Ted is living a comfortable life because he's living in a small Midwestern town, where few people are pulling in 6 figures. If Ted happened to be in a larger city -- NY, Chicago, SF, he'd be an average Joe. Obviously because there's more competition. That being said, being on top in a larger city is hell of a lot more difficult, and requires a lot more effort, savvy, and luck than it does in place like St. Louis. A lot of people in the middle of the totem pole in NYC could easily be on top in a smaller market with less stress, effort, etc,.
NYC is exciting, but its a grind. And that's what turns me off about starting a career there.
Wow IlliniProgrammer,
I have never seen someone so boastful of their "accountancy program". I'm not sure what school you went to in Illinois, but unless your mascot is a Wildcat (NW) or a Phoenix (U. Chicago), then you probably should tone it down. Lol kidding (sort of)
In regards to this Ted guy… I had an internship working with an FA team so maybe I could shed some light. It’s different, simple as that. To me it’s apples to oranges comparing this field to the likes of banking/trading ie.
The Ted’s in the office were pre-dominantly old white males, lets say trading/banking, but at least you get a decent check to hold you over. In the EJ world, if this happens, you simply will not eat. Which is why I think being an FA is fairly wack. It relies very little on how much you know and how hard you work- and relies very much on who you know.
So from my experience, it’s really difficult to just imagine this “Ted” guy, who basically sh_ts brownies and rainbows, and who magically pumps out this huge book of business without some serious connections, and has all of these toys sans the debt.
[quote]The Ted’s in the office were pre-dominantly old white males, lets say
Programmer, love the posts. I agree. It's interesting how people kind of forget about smart people that work at places like EJ. People have different things that make them happy.
The main reason that many folks at EJ aren't considered "elite" by us East Coasties is they simply choose to not see themselves as elite. IMHO, this is a REALLY smart career move. Clients get better service, it's easier to exceed everyone's expectations, and if you keep some sophistication and intellect hidden away in reserve, you can usually spot the scumbags of the business world from a few miles away and protect yourself and your clients.
Believe me, I am a native Midwesterner (and still rep it to death) and I know the level of sophistication of the most common man. I am certain that if I told people back home that I was a fixed income trader, maybe 15% would truly understand what that meant.
I am not saying that working as an FA instantaneously causes retardation, but the level of sophistication or the level of difficulty is far below what many intelligent individuals would consider challenging. Don’t get me wrong, the challenge of closing the deal is certainly there, but that’s different. Let’s be honest, your clients will not be CalPERS, looking for you to break a certain watermark. The vast majority of your job is not calling bottoms or valuing securities, it’s creating a financial plan for your client goals.
Do this, save this, and invest here in order to: -Buy a house/car -Send your kids to college -Retire
In fact, most of what you will invest in will be relatively low vol products (mutual Funds and the likes).
Comparing things that have basically no similarities FTW! You're comparing big city and wealthy suburb wages for the upper echelon FAs (prob $100k in loans for school (and were already maxing out credit cards for 'retail therapy' and their family was barely able to contribute because they were earning enough to get no fin. aid, but their family was stupid enough to spend it all on other things.
I dont care if Ted lives in the Midwest, NYC, or on Mars, if he has all the stuff described in the above post and makes in the low 6 figures he is functionally broke. If he is making 250K/year and he bought 2 houses with all cash (as the post says) that is two or three years of salary right there. Probably more since his houses have to be big enough to fit the 7 automobiles and aquacraft he has decided to purchase. I dont know how much Harley's cost and I dont even know what a ninja is, but that plus the garage full of cars has got to be another year of salary. Does Ted eat? God forbid nice, midwestern Suzy Housewife forgets a birth control pill Ted will really be in deep shit. If a few of those old lady's yank their accounts he will be filing for bankrupcy imminently.
And let's be real on another topic: Ted's is a salesman just like a salesman on wall st. except the people on the other end of the phone are much less savvy. Sure there are a few great FA's, but in general these guys are just pushing the products that make the most money for Edward Jones and thats it. Ted isnt saying "Dont put all your eggs in one basket, Granny", he is saying "dont put your eggs all in one basket, granny...instead invest in an Edward Jones branded mutual fund!". It's no different then a salesman from Goldman calling me and trying to push some exotic product that he gets paid large on...only i have a fighting chance and will call him on it. In some ways being a nice, midwestern broker is much more unseemly then being a sharp-elbowed wall st salesman.
That simply is not correct. Although it is true that the biggest producers tend to be on the coasts....there are plenty of million dollar producers throughout the US. Depending on where you work payouts range from about 40% to 50% so produce 1 million in GDC...you will take home 400K to 500K not including stock bonuses and other benefits and you will find some of these people in every major office across the US...even in the more rural , podunk places. I know because some of these people are my friends and they live very well.
Guys who are defending Ted just relax...
This is WSO... If you didn't graduate from Harvard with 4.0 and a triple major in Math/Econ/Aerospace Engineering, didn't work at GS TMT/MS M&A, and didn't get KKR/Apollo/SLP afterwards, then you are worthless piece of amphibian sh!t...
I find it odd that WSO has this kind of vibe, considering that none of the most frequent posters, or the most respected contributors, have anything close to a background like this.
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