We all know banking isn't easy, and I am usually all about encouraging young people to work hard in finance since the long-term benefits to your career can be incredible. But it's good to be realistic about the job - many of us tend to act like heroic titans of finance who love the grind, but this tends to be a coping mechanism driven by insecurity. I'm finally comfortable enough with myself to admit that I cried in the office bathroom a couple of times (we're talking one or two tears here, not full on sobbing, but still).
Here's a short list of things banking did to me (a few details changed to protect my identity):
- Constant heart palpitations due to caffeine/energy drinks/stress
- Carpal tunnel / tendinitis
- Lost a lot of hair
- Put on 25 lbs or more (fat, not muscle)
- Stress lowered my immune response to the point that I got a serious infection that landed me in the hospital (it started out small but spread to my veins)
- Became borderline alcoholic (was having 4-5 drinks every day after work, sometimes before work although not that often)
- Stopped caring about consequences and personal relationships; lost my girlfriend and several friends
- Developed blood clots in my legs that required medical intervention
- Became depressed and chronically anxious
In short, I was not very good at dealing with the stress and intensity of banking. My personal life went into a downward spiral and it took me a couple of years to recover. I'm doing better now, but I've learned that taking care of yourself is paramount in this business. I'm convinced I may have done serious permanent damage to myself if I'd stayed in banking past my 3rd year.
My story has a happy ending, as some of you know. I landed a gig in PE that I very much enjoy, and started putting serious effort into diet, fitness, mental health, and my personal relationships. I am now happily married, no longer abuse alcohol (well, sometimes), and am glad I went through a few years of hell to get to where I am now.
I hope opening up and talking about this does not get interpreted as a dick measuring contest. My intent is to be honest about the cost of going into this business - many people deal with it in better ways than I did, but I know others who went through some serious shit because of the job. To all you future monkeys out there, this post is not meant to discourage you. If I had to do it over again, I would. But I would pay attention to my mental and physical health from day 1 (including my relationships) and I would have been much more careful about not letting myself go. If you go into banking, do so with your eyes wide open and realize that the grind can be extremely rewarding, but also dangerous if you do it wrong.
Remember, kids:
- Exercise (even 20 minutes a day will go a long way)
- Watch what you eat (that dinner expense policy is a killer, don't order the 20 oz. steak with mac n cheese every night just because you can)
- Take care of your mental health through meditation, introspection, and making an effort to keep up your personal relationships
Someone dear to me summed this up like this: "You are constantly doing things that are good for your career, but you also need to do things that are good for your soul. Without that balance, you won't last in your career and in the end you will lose everything."
Mod Note (Andy): top 50 posts of 2017, this one ranks #4 (based on # of silver bananas)
Thanks for the post.
Pls share some advice/insights on how to keep up/maintain personal relationships in this business, I intend to stay in the business for the long term (I am not completely sold on PE) and I will be an incoming first-year analyst starting this July.
Thanks.
great post, +1, sorry to hear how much you suffered but great for the younger ones on the site to read this advice
dumb question but just curious, if you lose hair due to stress, does it grow back?
Not if you started taking rogaine before it falls out.
That's my plan.
Nope. Doctor told me to try Alopecia but he also said it may cause erectile dysfunction so I told him "fuck that". My coworker is on it though and his hair looks amazing.
Rogaine hasn't done shit for me yet but apparently it takes a long time and is only effective on 70% of men or something like that. Also, if you stop using Rogaine, apparently your hair thins out again, so you're hooked on it for life.
Any advice on this would be appreciated - I may just get a hair transplant in a few years (I have a very hairy ass). I'm also married and doing well financially so I don't really give a shit anymore, and for the young bucks out there, remember: a sexy car will get you more poon than a full head of hair. If she's fucking you for your car or your hair, she's not wife material anyway.
Alopecia is the medical term for hair loss. You're probably genetically predisposed to lose your hair and this is called Androgenic Alopecia. To give a very simple explanation, your hair falls out because your hair follicles are sensitive to a hormone called DHT, which is a biproduct of testosterone.
Doctors know nothing about hair loss. You should get on Finasteride or Dutasteride (a stronger version of Finasteride), which prevents your hair loss from progressing by blocking the conversion from testosterone to DHT and maybe even grow some of it back. Side effects are very rare if you have read some of longer studies - we're talking 1-2% with erectile dysfunction. I recommend you to start off with Finasteride and see how it goes, but talk to your doctor about it.
Quitting minoxidil is not necessarily going to drop you below baseline, studies shows a temporarily worsening but you'll bounce back to baseline as well.
Feel free to hook my up with a PM I know all about this shit.
Any kind of medication you're going to be using for life.
I'm using finasteride and it stopped my alopecia.
The possible side effects are loss of libido and depression. Tbh I thought it was worth it. I risked it and nothing happened to me. It's different for each person though.
@anyone reading this: please don't take Alopecia, side-effects of the drug can be so intense (and not just erectile dysfunction). Really not worth it.
Working out is must
FUCK MATE I DONT WANT TO LOOOOSE MY HAIR nor stop being goodlooking
Hahaha this is how I feel at the moment! I want my thick hair, physique and money! Even though I'm only 8months into my first year, I can see more hair falling out while I comb and shower :/
Uhh does everyone have really thin hair?
I feel like this even applies to those trying to break in
"Became borderline alcoholic (was having 4-5 drinks every day after work, sometimes before work although not that often)"
All the other stuff sounded bad, but if you can stop at 5 drinks, you are nowhere near alcoholism.
5 is a lot - I get drunk after 3 beers.
Seriously? I mean, I guess 3 beers in fifteen minutes might have breathalyzer issues but actually drunk.
https://www.niaaa.nih.gov/alcohol-health/overview-alcohol-consumption/m…
"NIAAA’s Definition of Drinking at Low Risk for Developing Alcohol Use Disorder (AUD):
For women, low-risk drinking is defined as no more than 3 drinks on any single day and no more than 7 drinks per week. For men, it is defined as no more than 4 drinks on any single day and no more than 14 drinks per week. NIAAA research shows that only about 2 in 100 people who drink within these limits have AUD."
Obviously you weren't being serious, but not many people actually know where the line is. This is just a guideline, but it definitely helps to serve as a wake-up call.
Actually, I was being serious. I've seen these guidelines before and this is what I was thinking about when I wrote the comment above.
The real definition of alcoholic is not being able to stop drinking once you start, until you pass out or get thrown in jail.
Source: I'm a real alcoholic.
Who has 5 drinks a night every night and works until 3am seriously? I worked at one of the worst teams in a BB before moving to PE and nobody was doing so...! I believe NuckFuts if he says he was desperate but it is certainly not the norm when people are productive.
If you drink before and after work everyday, even 1 or 2 drinks and sleep less than 4 hours yes you have a problem! Btw I noticed that a lot of people in PE do not even drink at all - not the same culture as IBD...
Do bankers get biddies by flaunting their firm/bonus anymore, and if not why did I pick this profession??
No one gives a shit about an after-tax 25k bonus.
Dumb question, but what would be a healthy way to "boost" your energy during those late nights? I can definitely see myself overdoing the coffee/red bulls..
Still in school, but during marathon study nights I sometimes use smelling salts (ammonia ampules) to refocus. You sometimes see professional athletes using them on the sidelines to get in the zone. No negative health effects (they are used medically to wake up people who faint) and not as sketchy as they sound, they sell them on Amazon.
Link?
Jeez. Just get modafinil, stuffs the shiz, just bought my 2nd order with bitcoin, looking forward to it..
Hope you get into a top 10 school, then.
I use these for lifting every once in a while (mainly to get my head right before a max attempt or a heavy set).
There might be no documented negative health effects but go ahead and use Nose Tork a couple of times and judge for yourself. Personally, it's hard for me to believe that it's not fvcking my brain up a little bit.
I'd recommend moderate caffeine and practice. It's something you just get used to doing over time. Also eat properly. If you eat shit throughout the day, are carb starved, etc., you will get super tired/lazy later on and your body will want to shut down/sleep. Sadly nutrition should be a core part of 'banking prep' and is ignored entirely.
I personally swear by tea. A nice Earl Grey with a couple of packets of sugar generally does the trick for me. Enough caffeine to keep you up, and not too much to put stress on your system. Tea also has many health benefits itself.
Run up a few flights of stairs.
Push-ups, cold water to drink/wipe my face.
Guys, a healthy coffee is a black coffee with no sugar. So stay away from Red Bulls and get yourself a quality italian coffee instead of that Starbucks shit
well where to get them??
Small shops owned by italian expats
Caffeine dependancy happens whether you put sugar in your coffee or not.
i'm pretty dependent on coffee and i never put sugar in it, do you have any evidence of this?
Preferably a lavazza crema e gusto
I drink about 7 cups of Colombian coffee per day - gave up the red bulls because of the heart palpitations and sugar.
American offices have no idea about this.
Go to any office in continental Western Europe and you'll have a fresh-grind espresso maker that can put out coffee that, although mediocre by European standards, is better than your average American grind.
Thanks for sharing this! I'm glad that you found a good path after that.
No permanent damage (I think).
I did two years as an analyst and left for a better opportunity, not because I hated the job.
I probably put on 25 lbs that I wouldn't have put on had I worked a 9-5, in addition to some weight I put on in college. Working it off now though, with the help of a personal trainer that I can afford due to banking. And I will always have banking on my resume.
I have more grey hair than I would otherwise. Big deal, I have a girlfriend. She makes fun of me but she's just as ambitious as I am so she understands.
Lucky you - women like grey hair, especially as you get older. I'm glad things worked out for you btw.
Going through it now. Certainly learning a ton, getting a good experience, etc. But I certainly agree my health is taking a greater hit than I expected.
Immune system took a huge hit. Getting sick all the time.
Tired 24/7. Perpetual cycle of grinding during the week, wanting to catch up on sleep on weekend, but you end up going out because you feel like you need to do something each week. therefore not catching up on sleep,and going back into the week already still exhausted. Repeat.
Chest pains likely due to a lot of stress
Lost a ton of weight, but have only been making it to the gym once every couple weeks, so this is not a pro
Diminished friendships and severe FOMO.
Would likely do this again but man am I ready for it to end.
This sounds like exactly like me when I studied engineering in college.
Really? Fuck man IB is so much harder than an engineering degree (stress wise). I feel like there shouldn't be so much emphasis put on it after seeing some of the mongs in my classes (or was that a mirror?).
Hang in there Joey. The end will come sooner than you think, and looking back it will all be a blur.
Just an incoming Summer Analyst, but gained a nicotine addiction during recruiting. Got an offer and have been trying to ween myself off.
Def get off of this before you start. I had a mild one coming in (dipped occasionally in college) and now its full blown. Once I'm done with my two years I'm gonna try and quit for good
Dipper here too, best of luck.
As others have said, and in regards to your intention, certainly ditch the habit before you start working. Banking is one of those things where you need to work without vices as much as possible, because they will grow much stronger. At this point I don't even drink caffeine very frequently because I have more energy waking up early and working out (even on 5 hours of sleep) than I do sleeping 7-8 hours and chugging caffeine throughout the day. That and smoking/dipping/excessive drinking will destroy your health during banking.
Thanks for sharing your experience. Could anyone further elaborate further on damage mitigation strategies for IB juniors?
I guess a lot boils down to genetics, personality type etc., but would still be great hear the daily routine of someone who went through their analyst years fairly undamaged.
The key is managing your time and stress effectively. Read "The Power of Habit" - available in audiobook format. Develop better habits over time, work out, eat well, and practice self-awareness / meditation / introspection. That last one was huge for me, actually.
All the more reason to work at a bank that has a gym. MS is nice.
This is like 3 years late, but do you know which banks have gyms or gym access? Thanks
Everyone knows of "Freshman 15". But fewer people know about "First-year (Analyst) 15".