Are failures forced to eventually give up and settle for something less?
I'm in the UK.
Here you pretty much have to go a target/semi-target undergrad and do the whole spring week to summer internship to full time position. This requires performing well as early as 16/17 to position yourself to go to a top uni. Even if you do all of this the odds are still heavily against you and every year you have so many students from elite universities who have failed to get in.
If you didn't do this you can try for a master's at a target uni and try again.
Some people do the long route of Big 4 to a MM/boutique IB firm.
The reality is the vast majority of people will never get into IB, especially in the UK where there are far fewer positions with competition from all over Europe.
To those that are really ambitious and failed to make it first time but try again and fail again - at what point do people accept they failed and aren't good enough?
I'm already a failure in the sense that I missed out on the traditional path by going to a bad uni and will be doing a master's degree at a good uni. However, there is a significant chance I fail again and I just wouldn't know what to do. Would I have to take a Big 4 job and try to lateral across? What if this doesn't work? What if I get stuck at the Big 4 and never lateral? Preference is always given to the summer intern cohort over people in other fields that failed to make it into IB first time around.
At what point do you have to essentially say "I'm a failure. I didn't get in. I now have to settle for another career for the rest of my life".
It's a bit like the countless people that dream of becoming doctors but eventually have to accept the cold hard reality that it will never happen and that they aren't good enough.
How do they just move on from that? How do they wake up everyday and not feel like shit that they weren't able to do what they wanted? Does that horrible feeling ever subside with time? Or do they constantly have that regret?
please stop the self-pity. i think everyone has seen at least one of your posts. it will do absolutely nothing to help you.
spamming posts on this forum won’t help. i think you should see a therapist as you seem depressed.
This. To paraphrase, stop being a pussy ass bitch and focus on the next step instead of asking yourself "What if? What if? What if?"
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Get off WSO and speak to a therapist. Multiple users have given this same advice to you and it seems that you’re not actually interested in taking criticism and improving your situation.
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Then go fuck yourself bc we’re not therapists here and you’re not gonna get what you need from us. This is pathetic. Get a fucking grip
You need to stop blasting your brain with adhd meds and ruminating in your room by yourself. Go get therapy please.
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The way you post sounds like you’re on Adderall or Vyvanse and ruminating in your room by yourself. You need to get some therapy and realize that there’s more to life than Banking. If you can’t break in all good pivot to something else temporarily or do a masters later on. All because you couldn’t break into Banking now doesn’t mean you’ll never break in.
My man, I didn't decide on going in to IB until the summer of my penultimate year (studying engineering at an at best semi-target) and managed to get a FO summer post-graduation purely by grinding out, trying to network as much as possible, and applying to as many places as possible. No spring weeks, definitely no real thought put in aged 17 as to what my career was going to be. It's not as rigid as you say, it never has been and it never will be. This reads like a bunch of copium.
Thinking practically to try to be generous, if you have to go to B4, that's not the end of the world - you can get your ACA, move in to the TAS or corporate finance teams and then progress in to IB from there. Know a lot of people who've made it in to the industry that way.
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You need to get out of the UK bro 😂
Genuinely, none of them cared. There wasn't a single place I applied to that dinged explicitly due to the fact I was a final year.
What was your path to IB? After your summer, did you start working straight away?
Yep stayed at the shop post-summer - had been very clear that I wanted to do that during interview process subject to performance etc. and they happily obliged. This is slightly more firm dependent though, some places I interviewed with had said they explicitly didn't expect me to stay after the summer but could start in e.g. January before joining the next year's full grad class in June-July.
Also, seek help. This isn't healthy
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Ignoring the advice that everyone has given you thus far is not healthy. Jesus Christ
Life is full of disappointments. But every time I feel like I’m at my lowest and unsure what to do, I take a step back to collect myself. Take a weekend trip, go visit family, etc.
Then think, “What’s next? What’s my game plan?” Sometimes it takes 2 weeks to figure out my next step and other times it requires 6 months.
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You haven’t failed, you just haven’t broke in yet. Most of my friends broke in at 26-27 and they’re the ones who lasted longer than the typical summer analysts. Your life ain’t over ffs. chill the fk out.
Hi,
I have tried to give advice on a few posts. I will again, but the texture of your posts (as some others have highlighted) is discouraging to someone wanting to help.
As you know well, there is no "reserve bank" or "reserve bucket" at Goldman Sachs specifically for people who failed to make it in their first applications.
I'll just make three comments which hopefully addresses the question of being a loser / etc.
1) Please stop implying that Big 4 is a "loser" job. I have one person I love deeply with that background, and several friends. It comes across (and I'm sure you don't mean it) as a bully / asshole.
2) Nobody (unless you're somehow bullying others or washed up with drugs or alcohol or something) can be a loser at your age. Admittedly this is an opinion. and not somehow fact, but you're young enough to work your way to the top CEO role of a corporate, start your own business, become Partner at a Big 4, etc.) They aren't loser roles (and are compensated REALLY well). So, to answer one aspect of your question, you don't give up on professional success (as opposed to IB success), you just apply the same ethic and competence eslewhere.
3) I think you need to re-define your abitions and what characterises value or worth. That could be someone you love, children, religion, hobby, whatever. I've worked more than 10 years in this industry and (while perhaps I take it for granted) I get far, far more happiness out of those former things than the latter. I have some (unsolicited, I know) song recommendation. Buy Dirt by Jordan David, Homegrown by the Zac Brown Band, and (a real oldie), and Everybody's Free by Baz Luhrmann.
I hope you are successful and happy in life - getting into IB is neither a necessary nor sufficient condition for that (and it can be quite the opposite).
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Ok so it's your fault? Move on and stop whining for fuck's sake, nobody on WSO gives a single fuck about your A levels regrets. You even mentioned alienating yourself from all your successful Oxbridge friends who got into prestigious IB positions - the very same people who would have been able to get you a foot in the door and keep you updated about hiring opportunities. But no, you chose a path of self-destruction and it's absolutely obvious that you don't have the correct mindset to succeed in any career. No one's coming to save you, crying in a corner is useless, get your shit together.
The attitude you have is more immature than anyone I know. And for context I am an 18 year old entering a BB in September with numerous friends going down the degree apprenticeship route/high tier uni route. I’m not surprised you did not get into IB as you clearly lack the self awareness to do so. Accept that you have got potentially good opportunities elsewhere and stop dwelling on the one thing you couldn’t enter.
You say you wish you could go back in time and fix things. If a version of you from 5 years in the future (2029) could come back in a time machine, what would he tell you to do now (in 2024)?
Seriously, what would the future version of you regret the current you not doing in these precious years? Like in chess, after you make a bad move, you can't go back- all you can do is make the next possible best move
You have crippling anxiety and are a huge pessimist, you need professional help.
He doesn’t need shit. He needs humbling. He’s been spoiled and privileged his entire life and he’s upset because he didn’t get his dream job without doing the work. This very moment today is exactly what he needed and deserves so he can change.
Ok
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You’re never getting an offer
You're telling a "pessimist" that lives in the UK that he needs "professional help"? I mean come on.. the sun doesn't even shine over there.
I get gripes now and again for not having broken into IB. I'm paid fairly well for a (somewhat) recent college grad in Finance but not at the level that my IB friends are making. It sucks but I do my best to be proactive and map out ways in the future that could open a door for me to break in, whether it's MBA, networking, or building out my current skillset in my AM/CorpFi role that could be applicable for future IB roles.
However, I struggle to resonate with you because I think you really need to see a therapist or take a break from social media. You don't have a chip on your shoulder or the need to prove yourself - what you're saying comes across as crippling anxiety and a borderline unhealthy obsession with wanting to break into IB.
Your life isn't over, just work with what you have and make the best move for yourself when the opportunity arises.
In short, you need to let it go for now. You are wasting your life away at your prime. You’ve mentioned getting an MBA in the US a few years down the road. Great, buckle into the job you’ve landed and put one foot in front of the other. Re-evaluate in 18 months. You aren’t homeless or dying on the side of the road. It will be ok
never seen such a roasting on a forum.
my two cents: shoulda been applying to multiple areas of finance the whole time (S&T, IB, ER, HF, AM, VC, Wealth Management, Fp&A, etc.)
Obviously weight on the one you want most with higher # of applications but always have a fallback. Time to start now if you haven’t already
He's getting roasted cos his last 20 posts are the same whiny thing with the same advice to seek professional help.
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At a non-target and see around 3/4 people get IB every year, this year will likely be higher because multiple people did springs i.e. stop moping and do some work.
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Agreed, or at least stop thinking that the sky is falling and there’s no solution. He could try again later on with an MBA if he really wants to do IB.
Look, I am one of those people in medical school. One day, I will become a doctor. I happen to know many others who just happened to not have the grades or for one reason or another were unable to study undergraduate medicine.
You know what they did? One went to Oxford to read biomedical science. One went to do a Global Business programme and might go on to private banking or consulting. One read biochemistry and wants to become a pilot now. One did physiotherapy. One is planning to do a first degree in medical science and apply for medicine as a second degree.
I hate to admit it, but some of them are happier than me. Some will go on to fly planes, some will open their own clinics, some will make life-changing scientific discoveries. Some of them will become richer, or find more professional success. I would be happy for them if they did. Perhaps you should broaden your perspective and find another path. Life is not just about your career or investment banking.
On that note I was recently talking to someone who had just quit banking after 5 years in financial restructuring with nothing lined up. He is really enjoying life, and I respect that. Life really is what you make of it.
I think you’re just here for attention and reassurance that things can work out. This is very bad. People here are not your therapist and that’s why people are taking a step back. You need better coping mechanisms for your anxiety which is why all of us are recommending therapy. From someone who has anxiety + OCD I’m telling you right now that if you do not fix that you will not last in IB. Forget breaking in, you won’t get promoted and kicked out and you’ll be on here in a few months asking what to do next.
if I were you I’d take the big 4 job, and not go the masters route. If the UK is really as bad as you say it is then forget the UK all together and try in a different country. Also, please don’t go around saying to people that you’re going to go to an M7. The people that go to M7s have their shit sorted our from day one, the rest who break in are an anecdotal which is not an indicator of what may happen to you. You need to forget IB for now - I’m serious - forget about it entirely, get your grades ups and get therapy so you can set yourself up for success.
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TLDR Suck it up and move on with your life. Find greener pastures.
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Yes.
Gives you time to do some introspection. It's honestly such a great question and I'm commenting for reference. This happen way more frequently in people's professional journeys than people care to share. The good news is, those who work hard tend to get where they want to within 3-5 years (granted, part of that is timing the market perfectly - some jobs I want now aren't realistic but I plan to revisit them when the economy bounces back).
I have been recruiting all summer but also trying to take time everyday to do something fun as I job search (recent MBA grad). Plan to pick up contract work in September if I'm still recruiting but I have no regret taking a light summer outside of recruiting and doing a ton of introspection.
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I graudated, went to a school ranked in the top 20 - 25.
So why do you actually want to do IB? I'm not actually seeing it from your posts, outside of just the "prestige"?
Because all of his friends are doing it.
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