Does anybody here not drink?

Just curious, does anybody in finance / banking not drink? Sounds like a ridiculous question, but I know NYC especially, has a huge drinking culture. I'm wondering as to whether any of you have personally experienced, or have heard / seen of anyone, be successful, especially in the early stages of their career (SA, analyst, etc) without drinking? Socializing and fitting in is part of assimilating with the company culture and company politics, so how do those that don't drink circumvent this issue?

 

I do drink and intend on having the occasional beer etc, but my glory days of college have to come to an end sometime. I like drinking too much and I tend to go overboard with my buddies and don't know how much longer I can keep this up health-wise. Especially since my family has a history of liver issues, I was thinking it would be in my best interest to tone it down after I graduate.

I also figured there would be people out there that don't drink cause of religious reasons or what not, but I guess that's not the case given the above reactions.

When you guys go out and drink with your co-workers...what's the usual setting? Is it like a beer or two at happy hour / watch a game type thing, or let's meet at xyz club / bar and get obliterated.

 

i don't know anyone one who doesn't drink at all, but one of the interns was sort of new to drinking (having been 3 years in college at a big party school)....i don't think it really affected his reputation in my group, but he was kinda annoying when he was drunk which i suspect was because it was pretty new to him, or he is just one of the annoying types when their drunk

when i went out with the group (analysts/associates), it was obliteration basically

when out with more of the group ie vps and mds, it was only a few beers, and i was sure to not get drunk

it certainly helps in this industry to know how to kick back with a few beers, but if you get your work done and its up to expectations, i doubt anyone is going to shun you or anything bc you dont like getting ass wasted

 

My motto is, if you can hold around 5 shots rapidfire and can still talk and smile without looking like a tool/fake then you're good to go. And make sure that with shots you don't make the noobface immediately after. Also make sure you down the shot in one fast gulp.

Nothing worse than seeing the ugly cringeface or watching someone take 3 small swallows and 20 seconds to finish a shot (usually girls do this shit).

 

you really don't have to drink, as long as you have an ecstatic personality and that you can have fun without alcohol in the system. If you are however the plain old boring guy, then good luck, cause you will look like a total outsider on many occasions.

 

I agree with the last post ... Also keep in mind Henry Paulson, the former CEO of Goldman Sachs, and Mitt Romney, not really an investment banker, are two of the most successful businessmen in history and they have never had a sip due to religious reasons.

This sparked an interesting question in my mind. How do bankers view smoking (cigarettes I mean)? Do a lot of bankers smoke due to the stress or is it viewed badly nowadays?

 
VineyardVines2011:
This sparked an interesting question in my mind. How do bankers view smoking (cigarettes I mean)? Do a lot of bankers smoke due to the stress or is it viewed badly nowadays?
No one in my group smokes (during the day at least). If I'm in a cubicle for 14 hours, I don't want to be anywhere near someone who smells like shit.

and I don't want to deal with someone who disappears once every while to take a smoke...

 

I don't drink. Every time I tell my friends or their friends I don't, I get a stare as if they had just seen a ghost.

They then proceed to interrogate me as to why I don't. The whole night then becomes away to get me to drink. Either by paying me, peer pressuring, or trying to switch my drinks as I go to the bathroom. It's quite ridiculous.

I don't see the problem with not drinking. Why do guys value drinking so much?

 
Best Response

Alright, if you are easily offended, skip this post. YOU'VE BEEN WARNED.

The second-in-command at my commodities firm didn't drink. This guy was a total fucking freakshow. He was one of these weird germ-o-phobes that was always washing his hands and hated to be touched by anyone. After about a half hour around him, you could tell that he wasn't quite right, that there was something truly malevolent about him. A true sociopath, just a couple notches down from Patrick Bateman.

Anyway, he and this other guy from the firm (a raging alcoholic who ended up drinking himself to death before 40) went out on the town one night and came across a drunken skank that was up for pretty much anything. They took her back to his place where they proceeded to tag team her, filming the whole thing on videotape. They ended up doing some foul shit to her, but it was after she passed out that the fun really began.

This is where it gets borderline criminal, so I won't go into any detail other than to point out that at one point they thought it'd be funny to film a Cleveland Steamer (at least one of them had the presence of mind to cover her chest in Saran Wrap prior to the act). The video went from funny to distasteful to downright disturbing in no time flat.

Of course, the video made the rounds in the pits and cemented in everyone's mind what a total degenerate freak this guy was. But that's not the end of the story. Fast forward about a year when one of the new guys tells everyone he met a girl about 9 months ago and they're getting married. Yup, you guessed it. It's the same chick.

Nobody says anything until they get back from their honeymoon, and then this guy brings the kid into his office and shows him the tape. It just wrecked this kid's fucking life. He was totally devastated. He washed out about a week later, when he couldn't take any more shit from the other traders. I have no idea what happened to him, or if he managed to stay married.

Moral of the story: if a guy is in this line of work and doesn't use booze or drugs to blow off steam, he's probably doing some shit you'd rather not know about. Take it from your old Uncle Eddie, give teetotalers a wide fucking berth. There is something wrong with them.

As for Paulson and Romney - I rest my case.

 

My cousin was a teetotaler till he became an SA. Then he saw the other SAs sucking up to the MDs and VPs over drinks and realised he was missing out on all the butt kissing. So he finally started nursing a pint of beer, accidentally took a sip and since then has never looked back to his 'teetotaling' days. I guess drinking is very very important in IB to network with the seniors.

 

There are a couple of guys in my team including my boss who don't drink. Both gave up drinking on the behest of their wives as far as I could make out. They are older though. Of the younger people I don't know anybody who doesn't drink at all, though there are some, mainly chicks, who will drink very rarely.

 
Marcus_Halberstram:
Edmundo... admit it... the raging alcoholic degenerate accomplice in your story is you.

I'm a bit skeptical though... it that situation, everyone would either have the "its not my place to tell him" or "I've got to tell him" perspective before he got married. In any case, great story.

I'm afraid the drunk in my story made me look like a choir boy. He went out in a blaze of glory, though. I'll say that much for him.

You must not know many commodities traders, Marcus. Either that, or some semblance of decency has crept into the commodities game since I left it a decade ago. The reason nobody told him was because everyone wanted to witness the train wreck that would ensue if he actually ended up marrying her (which he did). There was plenty of talk behind his back, but he obviously never got wise to it.

I think it helped that he didn't actually introduce her to anyone from the firm until about a month before they were married, otherwise the cat very well could have come out of the bag.

It was pretty sick. You'd have loved it. His level of human suffering was a joy to behold. Good times.

 

On evenings that I do get to enjoy NYC nightlife, occasional encounters with insane traders are not too far-fetched. Everytime I see guys fighting at a nice place up here, I always think to myself "that d-bag probably forgot to cover his position today..."

Traders drink more than a sailor. To thier credit however, a good reason is always given as to the occasion of the binge. If they had a good day trading - "I made $XXX,XXX today lets go get hammered, in contrast if they lost a bunch of money, they drink because "life is short". Indeed.

Plus people incorrectly blame us bankers for the financial crisis, when it is traders that should be blamed. As far as commodity traders are concerned, when you put a crazy person (trader) to trade a highly volatile product (commodities), you are certain to get some entertainment out of it.

I vote MTV does a "Real Life - I am a commodity trader", and we can all sit back, down a beer, and examine the irrationality and drama of the show.

 
MoneyKingdom:
On evenings that I do get to enjoy NYC nightlife, occasional encounters with insane traders are not too far-fetched. Everytime I see guys fighting at a nice place up here, I always think to myself "that d-bag probably forgot to cover his position today..."

We had a gym with a boxing ring a couple blocks from the office. Any trading disputes that couldn't be settled in the office got settled there after market hours.

 
<span class=keyword_link><a href=//www.wallstreetoasis.com/company/sac-capital>SAC</a></span>:
Where the hell do these insane traders hang out ? I've never even seen a fight in NYC and I'm out frequently on weekdays. The trader lifestyle totally sounds like my kinda thing..

But if you're looking for traders, you'll have better luck finding them in dive bars in Chelsea and Brooklyn than at any trendy nightclub.

You have to understand the trader persona. It's not about impressing anyone except other traders. Anyone else (including the CEOs of Investment Banks) are lesser beings, and aren't worth the steam off your shit.

Why would you go pay $300 for a bottle of Stoli when that same $300 will get you fucking obliterated with your bros in Brooklyn?

You see, a banker can throw his platinum on the bar and end up buying drinks for wannabe models all night and end up with a $7,000 tab and a chick that is maybe willing to jerk him off under the table. A trader throws his plastic on the bar and buys drinks for all his buddies all night long and gets out of there for under a grand with a bridge-and-tunnel Jersey skank (or two) under his arm and a story for all his buddies in the morning.

On April 15, the trader writes a check to the feds for a banker's annual salary.

I know this because I've been on both sides of the coin.

 

Sorry if I'm momentarily breaking up the awesomeness of this thread, but this is for the OP: if you have 1-3 drinks, a couple times of week, your liver will be fine, as a matter of fact, it's good for your heart.

Back to business: I wouldn't be surprised commodity traders from a decade+ ago would act like that, but I really doubt exotic credit traders were crushing beers and slaying hoes out in BK the last few years. Is that why you retired?

 

I don't drink at all--MAYBE 6 drinks per year. In my IB analyst stint I could tell that people thought I was arrogant because I didn't drink. The truth is, I don't like the taste of alcohol and preferred to save the $5,000/year I would have otherwise spent on it. It's actually one of the reasons I made the jump from investment banking to real estate (culture is totally different)--I was sick of being left out and made the freakshow.

My advice to you is to learn to drink in moderation--if you can't drink in moderation, then I still wouldn't drink. Risking your life isn't worth it.

Array
 

I don't drink either. Will it really cost me a return offer if I don't?

 

hahaha great post. I have not been drunk since labor day. If anyone would like more true stories about crazy ass commodity traders go get "RIGGED" by Ben Mezrich and read the first couple chapters.

"Oh the ladies ever tell you that you look like a fucking optical illusion" - Frank Slaughtery 25th Hour.
 

out my entire SA class, there were 2 girls that never went out with any of us...this became noticeable and they were then labeled the "outcasts." so, my advice would be to go out and nurse a drink or two. it really isn't that big of a deal to do so and nobody will notice that you are a few (or many) behind. someone else touched on it above, but drinking and going out is very much a part of the "wall street culture." you dont have to fit that mold to do well, but you might rub some ppl the wrong way if you continuously decline their invitations to grab a drink after work.

 

My advice would be to go out with everyone and just chill on one drink for a long time. Like another poster mentioned, as long as you're a fun guy, everything should be fine. Turning down invitations will definitely rub people the wrong way.

 

I used to go out on the town 3-4 times a week, but I gave up alcohol for Lent. The first week and a half of sobriety was pretty tough, but I've actually gotten used to it now and I feel great about just being able to order a club soda on the rocks (people can't tell the difference between a gin and tonic and a club soda unless they taste it...also helps me save my paycheck and my liver). I find that a lot of people drink because it helps them ease up a little in social situations, but I don't have a problem staying relaxed and being social even without alcohol. Besides, who would be so silly as to think that you have to drink in order to hang out with your friends or colleagues? We're not in college anymore, and Animal House is only a movie.

So, to answer your question, as of a few weeks ago I'd consider myself as one of those that don't drink. My friends and colleagues respect and even admire my decision not to drink. Frankly, I don't think anyone even cares. I'm just as cool as I was a few weeks ago -- I just don't drink anymore.

Hope that helps.

​* http://www.linkedin.com/in/numicareerconsulting
 

^ tell them last time you had a shot, you were in amsterdam and ended up killing two hookers. You left the country in a hurry and vowed never to drink again.

Wall Street leaders now understand that they made a mistake, one born of their innocent and trusting nature. They trusted ordinary Americans to behave more responsibly than they themselves ever would, and these ordinary Americans betrayed their trust.
 

Yeah I don't drink but sipping on something is def. something I have to do, so as not to stand out. I do not drink thanks to that fucking bear that used to come to my elementary school when I was younger and used to tell us the side effects of drugs/alcohol. But, on a serious note I believe in controlling myself at all times and would not do anything that compromises my ability to make sound judgment at anytime. Considering I live w/ a football player at a SEC school...this is tough.

 

I would take the stories about commodity traders with a grain of salt, I used to work at the NYMEX as a runner in the natural gas pit and I can categorically guarantee you the open outcry pit traders are light years away from the traders I met at the BB banks. Many barely graduated high school.

 
lab:
Just curious, does anybody in finance / banking not drink? Sounds like a ridiculous question, but I know NYC especially, has a huge drinking culture. I'm wondering as to whether any of you have personally experienced, or have heard / seen of anyone, be successful, especially in the early stages of their career (SA, analyst, etc) without drinking? Socializing and fitting in is part of assimilating with the company culture and company politics, so how do those that don't drink circumvent this issue?

Up to 20% of all Wall Street guys aren´t effected that much by stress, cause they do a lot of sports to balance their stress level. Most people who run the NY Marathon came from Finance.

But when you climb up in Finance, stress is risin. Most people say high compensation can be seen as compensation for personal suffering

http://www.madhedgefundtrader.com/ http://www.tradersmagazine.com/
 

Coming from a canadian school, in a big city where the drinking culture is huge. I think I only know one friend of mine who does not drink and he just became of age to drink. Needless to say, Im not really surprised since the name of the school is symbolic to the alcohol industry in north america.

 

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