MSIM or DE Shaw?
As the title suggests, I've received summer 2020 offers for both MSIM and DE Shaw (fundamental research) - what would be a better start to a career in terms of training and growth?
Probably DE Shaw. I wouldn’t think this is even a tough / close decision
Who's MSIM?
My first thought was Morgan Stanley Investment Management ..
DE Shaw
Generally boutiques are much better than the large banks in AM. That said, DE Shaw is primarily known for their quantitative strategies. Would be hard to give guidance without understanding specific roles/where you'd sit within the broader team/strategies.
Could you elaborate on why working at a boutique AM firm would be better than working at GSAM/JPM?
All the usual benefits of being at a boutique. The firm gets 100% of the fee revenue rather than being spread out towards other parts of the firm. There's probably less pressure to open new strategies just to raise AUM and fee revenue. Similarly, banks probably want AUM to grow as large as possible rather than closing when the strategy reaches its capacity. All generalizations but hopefully that's somewhat helpful. I'm also coming at it from the allocator stand point not necessarily from an employee. That said, I've very rarely heard of junior guys spinning out of a bank platform to open their own shop while that's somewhat common at boutiques.
What division under MSIM? If its fixed income, I would stay away from that. From my understanding the program is relatively new (or seems like it) and they don't know how to have interns.They have very few SA, and you go through 4-6 rotations with basically no depth in each one. Not sure about other divisions within MSIM.
Am actually Superdaying with Fixed Income tomorrow, but was offered RE - thanks for the insight!
hey, how long was your MSIM superday (hours)?
I’d lean towards DE Shaw, but it does depend on the group to some extent. For what it’s worth, I work in long-only AM on the fixed income side and never hear about MSIM. If your offer is in RE @ MSIM, think long and hard about whether that is what you want to do vs. equities/credit (not knocking RE but it is a different skill set vs. analyzing companies). Do a little digging around DE Shaw’s activist investment in LOW.
Hi, sorry about the abbreviation MSIM is MS Investment Management division - I received offer for fixed income if that makes a difference
When did you heard back after each interview?
DE Shaw took about a week, MS was very quick after the superday
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