60 hours work week jobs in finance
I’m looking to leave banking as I’m now approaching the one year mark and wlb is very important for me. I just can’t function when I’m sleep deprived and stressed, my health has been terrible so I’m looking to interviewing ASAP. From talking to friends I know some roles like direct lending, investor relations, etc. are wlb friendly (60 hours). What other finance jobs out there are wlb friendly that will allow me to focus on execution at a fast pace (dl for example)?
DL and investor relations are excellent jobs, but spots in those two can be hard to come by. you could be waiting 6 months; if you want out ASAP/by end of summer, recommend you broaden your reach a bit while keeping an eye out for those more slimly hiring positions.
Also, many corp jobs are not "execution at a fast pace" in general, corp life is generally much slower. Much lower stress, but be prepared for your internal partners to take 2 weeks to get back with something you used to get in 2 hours in IB.
Corp dev at a less acquisitive company is an idea; corp strategy is typically lower hours too. If a startup sounds interesting (be careful these days, vet the firm very well) there's some "strategic finance" roles out there.
Real estate can be low hours (cap markets, development), PWM/private bank, asset management
Equity Research is fantastic
How are the hours like at the lightest and when it’s the most intense ?
Lightest - probably 40 hrs
Craziest - around 70-90 hrs (earnings season but we are slightly understaffed )
ER gets really crazy the 4x a year in earnings with each season could last between 4-5 weeks long
Look for smaller groups in BBs, typically the more overlooked ones
FP&A if the role is strategic/modeling based. Especially at smaller companies where you might get a good mix of responsibilities/have some promotion ops. Corp dev but you gotta find the right company. Too acquisitive and you will work just as much as you are now but for lower pay. Not acquisitive enough and you will be bored/probably not feel as secure in your job.
I will say FP&A is about 60 hrs on avg but it’s not like a constant amount. My experience has been that it’s lenient. Multiple long weeks in a row and it’s a slow Friday? Have a good weekend. Need to run an errand during the day? No problem. Bosses tell you to use your vacation. Bosses encourage you to take care of your health/go to the doctor. Plan your vacations around slower times and nobody calls you. Those are the real perks of corporate. You will still have many weeks each year where it’s 80/90/100 hrs. Will definitely get burnt out from time to time.
Hope this helps.
What would you say is a good acquisition appetite?
I’m on the FP&A side of things. Someone else may be able to give more specifics on corp dev. I have just had friends in both circumstances (too much/too little deal flow). If I had to make an educated guess it depends on industry, the size/complexity of the deals, and size of the team as much as the quantity of deals. That’s me from the outside looking in though, someone else may be able to give more concrete answers. Sorry if that’s not helpful.
I'll add onto the other user's reply, as my team does M&A work along with more traditional financial analysis for other purposes in the company.
It can get busy/stressful when there's a deadline to get materials in before submitting for board approval, as there is a cut-off when they will accept things and then you'd have to wait months for another time they'll be able to review something.
My team looks at a ton of deals, and have a few we're working on right now, but they're all in different stages and generally aren't too big of companies.
I'd recommend finding a company that isn't too big, as I'd imagine that would get stressful with the size/intensity of how the deals may come down the pipeline.
If you like the raw analysis and deal work, it's something to consider a team that does smaller deals. So far we get a number of LMM opportunities that we'll get an exclusive look/deal process for a period of time. The downside is that those companies can operate slowly in getting data you would need to actually get a concrete valuation range, but you'll ideally already know what kind of multiple the seller will want and this data really helps with peace of mind on a valuation.
If you go from IB to FP&A, are there any exits for that combination of experience? Climbing up in FP&A seems like pretty nice pay for the work life but just wondering if any sort of optionality would remain afterwards. Seems like IB doesn't exactly translate into FP&A in terms of tasks either.
Apparently IB https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forum/investment-banking/2022-investmen…
- they give generous raises and have improved hours. Maybe they will offer lap dances next
S&T is underrated honestly. I've been working 2 years in FX sales at a top 5 bank within the FX space (Citi, Deutsche, HSBC), my hours are 55-60 per week. Some more senior sales guys i know work like 9 hours a day since they sometimes take 11:30- 2pm off for lunch, gym, etc. Big caveat to that though is that these guys cover mostly corp clients who are inactive and don't trade during lunch time. Anybody covering FI clients especially hedge funds still need to be around at lunch. This is strictly the sales side though, the traders who price for me rarely leave the desk for lunch. But I still rarely see them going beyond 60 hours a week
Disclaimer: i don't work in NYC
I've heard the contrary, S&T sucks cause you start the day at 6am and CANNOT BE LATE. Lunch is also 10 min long. You might also end at 5 or 6pm. There are some banks where you'll work until 8-9pm (soc gen).
If you're not a morning person, and like having a decent lunch time, S&T is not for you. In my opinion, you truly have to love the product/work you're doing in S&T in order to survive.
My comments are only in response to OP's original question of what jobs are in the 60 hour a week range, which in my experience S&T always is. The S&T lifestyle, lunch times etc would be a different discussion. For me at least, I've never seen or heard of any S&T team at any bank, regardless of asset class, CONSISTENTLY working until 8-9pm. Structuring, and research guys yes, they work late all the time, but strictly sales/ trading, no. I've interned at 2 different strong FX banks in NYC, now work full time at a 3rd different bank in HK, the hours/ lifestyle seem more or less the same at all 3
As someone who worked in S&T for 4 months in a rotational program, I second all of the above.
I completely agree with this. I work in S&T and although I work 50-60 hours per week I have to wake up at 6am but I get yelled at if im 5 mins late and i cannot take logner than 15 mins for lunch. I also cannot leave the desk throughout the day. Products are extremely boring.
Working at a buyside asset management firm (RE) and the wlb is incredibly good - most of the people come to office around 9 and leave by 530 pm
Shush - It's a secret. Don't tell em.
Working 60hrs at a credit shop - would say most clo shops and credit asset managers are about there. Pay is lower than hedge funds and private equity but decent for the hours.
What’s the average pay like for an associate in credit shops? I’m interested in doing that after my banking stint
First year associate is ballpark $170K to $250K. I have a few friends working 60hrs on the private side (e.g. direct lender type), and I work 60hrs on public side (e.g. CLO manager type). Would say they make slightly more than I do within that same range. Their hours are deal driven whereas I work market hours, so slightly more predictable. Further up you get promoted, direct lending is a little more like levfin but without the pitchbooks - pay reflects that kind of steadiness and benefit comes from fund structure / carry. Would say public market roles are much more variable and depend on your contributions - has bigger tail end pay.
Thanks for this! What are some cool jobs that might be outside of corp dev and regular finance roles at some of these shops? I’m also been thinking of trying something new, although I enjoy finance somewhat I don’t think it’s something I’m very passionate about or where my strengths are put to good use. I’m more relationship/qualitative then analytical.
Public finance.
Wild thought, but you could slide into a commercial banking role fairly easily. Once you learn the products and have your own book, your hours can be anywhere from 20-60/week but generally you're hanging in the 30-35 range. Can make well over 150 your first year and it's a pretty cushy job.
Yes this is actually fairly representative of Corporate/ Commercial banking. Most folks work on average 30-40 hour weeks.
Is the 150k as a first year reasonable?
I know this is an old thread but do you know if it's possible to land associate roles at banks like yours straight from an MBA?
IMO- throw the perstige chase out the window and work at a regional boutique- hours are usually ~60-70 at the junior level, they're always happy to take juniors that come from solid BB/EB/MM, and pay is surprisingly good (at certain shops). They're honestly pretty overlooked
Equity research (outside of earnings season)
Asset management. Public and private credit (really good buyside seats)
Real talk, credit pays well for WLB. But if credit/ debt isn't your thing, then also take a look at lifcos/ insurance/ pension funds for PE, RE, Infra, Equities, etc. They pay well and have a good WLB. Fund of funds too. Last I'll say is whatever you do, the more interested are in it, the less burnout you'll have with the WLB.
Second this. I'm working in public high yield (ignore title) and we work 50-60hr weeks with good comp and 0 weekend work. Rarely above 60hrs unless you get a perfect storm of new issues that you aren't up to speed on in your sector... Which is not something that's happening in this market.
WLB is good for the industry and the work is interesting, but you are definitely actually working those full 50-60hrs and generally my brain is pretty shot at the end of the day.
Any chance you could provide a bit more detail on what comp looks like across various years of experience at a firm like yours? Ranges are totally fine if you'd rather not be too specific. Also would you characterize your firm as a large asset manager that invests in HY on a long only basis or more like a credit HF that does public HY on a both LO and L/S basis through various pockets?
that is hard
Equity Research, at least from how it seems based on my limited experience.I'm an intern in ER at a well-respected MM firm in NYC, and while the brunt of earnings haven't hit yet, it's been 50-60 hour weeks for most of the team. We generally get in around 7, and we're usually out by 6 or so.Work is surprisingly client-facing (funds/company leadership teams) - feels like sort of a mix of how I'd imagine IB and being an industry research expert. Pretty cerebral as well, and the culture is great.Pay seems decent by general "corporate America" standards, though it probably trails IB by 25% from the outset, and even more as one climbs the ranks. Feeling a little uneasy about exit ops (yes I know the buy side exists, but I wouldn't say exits are on par with IB), but for someone with a genuine interest in finance/public markets who wants to make a solid living without going through the "torture phase," it's an excellent option.
60 hrs a week is far from good WLB. There are plenty of PE shops you could find where you’d average around that amount per week
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The true question is: what pays the best at 60hrs a week?
Physical commodities - pay will start out low, if you’re good shoot past banking around 3 years, but the people may be tough to deal with and the hours start early
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