Want to know the best way to rank the banks? How about asking the incredibly obvious question "Who makes the most money?" instead of looking at the league tables and talking about "prestige"...
This is how those rankings would shake out (all NI ttm):
- JPMorgan Chase & Co.: 14.30B
- The Goldman Sachs Group, Inc.: 11.55B
- Deutsche Bank AG: 7.72B
- Credit Suisse Group: 6.32B
- Barclays PLC: 5.16B
- UBS AG: 5.08B
- Morgan Stanley: 3.39B
- Lazard: (0.95B)
- Bank of America Corporation: (2.00B)
- Citigroup, Inc.: (3.90B)
Can this please be the last "rank the bulge brackets" thread for the next 24 hours? They're all the same except for Goldman and that's just common knowledge.
yeah but these are not pure comps of each other. some of these banks have huge commercial/retail banking arms. and thus your comparable analysis is flawed, in my opinion.
people on this site come to talk about investment banks, not retail banks. and chase, citibank, bofa, contribute a lot to the revenues of each of the firms listed above. yet this site's audience is not interested in retail banking, so applying a heavy weight to a meaningless attribute ensures that your list is incorrect for this audience.
now go grab me a bagel downstairs.
People here care about exit opportunities, not fucking revenue....
The rankings are on income. Do tell me: can a company a.) continue to survive or b.) pay bonuses if it consistently posts losses?
Yeah, but those ALL have the same exit opportunities, trust me. The exit opportunity is YOU, much more than which firm of the above you worked at. Period, end of this.
Finally a guy with some sense to tell it like it is. Truer words have never been spoken
Rankings don't matter. What matters is how well you do your job and whether you like the people you work with. It's better to work at a rock quarry with folks you enjoy working with than work at a top-five firm with folks you hate. Life is short and money and prestige aren't worth spending the best years of your life working with people you hate at a job you hate.
How is it possible to be have negative revenue?
And where do these numbers come from?
http://www.revenuerecognition.com/content/experts/9011.asp
The numbers come from CapIQ. By the way, I'm still smiling at how someone deemed DontMakeMeShortYou worthy of a banana for a.) getting promptly owned by RadarBanker and b.) having the attention to detail to confuse revenue and income.
Attention to detail boys - "NI" = Net Income. Not negative revenue. Even if the "NI" wasn't there, you would question something is up based on the size of some of the values...
My apologies. I didn't notice the NI. But why is the NI relevant to investment banking division? Or is this the whole banks operation?
You're an idiot nohomo and I don't say that often.
Let's not bash man. The whole banks operations has nothing to do with it's status an an investment bank
I deem this table worthless for this discussion though. If it was more specific to ibd, then a different comment would be necessary
Sidekikz is a true TROLL
All your posts are TROLL posts
Why do you waste time and bash UBS
I can guarantee, KKR or Harvard don't really care whether you worked at Goldman or UBS or Lazard
They care about the whole package and people like you, even if you slipped through the cracks at a decent firm, will never ultimately be successful
SIDEKIKZ IS A TROLLLLLLLLLL
PS EYELIKECHEEZE IS A SOLID POSTER, KEEP IT UP MAN
These are just ridiculous to begin with. Worked at a top tier BB. There are tons of banks, and odds are if it is a name you've heard of or appears on ANY of these lists, it is likely a pretty good firm.
Well I don't think it's a matter of unprofitability, as evidenced by the income statement, but the cash actually coming in and going out. Maybe over a span of a few years, but banks have so many loopholes they exploit in the accounting codes, as well as write-offs, impairments, loan loss reserves, and especially shedding of non-core assets which results in write downs( a la Citi's $800m and BoA $10.4ish mil. At some banks, different divisions are the reason they are still generating solid earnings.
Look at MS, gets killed by real estate holding, but has 25% stake in deontology partners and a SOLID institutional securities division but weak as hell trading. BoA is solid in Global Markets and commercial banking, but their consumer division, cards, and home loans are a drag on earnings. Citi has a nice retail presence, great deal flow with advisory fees and is herding its non-core assets like crazy. Their ROE is 1.3% in the US vs. Over 3% in LatAm
It's all in the details and divisions.
I appreciate the shout out likeminded. Some would see things otherwise
Good post again. As I tee these posts up, you're hitting them out of the park.
The problem I wanted to highlight (other than sidekickz) is that an incredibly small percentage of this forum's userbase has insight enough to say what you just said - to understand each bank's strengths and weaknesses, to understand how numbers are juiced, to look beyond a generic league table to see what a bank is and isn't good at, etc.
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