Summer Analyst -> FT Offer, how to pick trading over sales
I will have a summer internship in sales & trading (rotational) at a BB and was wondering how an intern would be placed in either sales or trading if given a FT offer.
I'm not interested in doing sales so my question is:
1) How does the process work (how is a summer analyst placed in sales vs trading if FT offer is given)
2) Who makes this decision (sales vs trading)
3) I read in another post that being a female intern one can possibly be put into HR. Is this true? (that doesn't make sense, wouldn't there be an HR internship instead of Sales & Trading).
4) I'm concerned with previous posts saying that being a female will deter being hired as a trader (versus sales).
Any female traders on this board?
Serious answers please!
To answer some of your questions. If both of you receive offers, you may both be traders or you may both be salesmen, which school you go to has nothing to do with it. Whether you get placed into sales or trading, I am pretty sure you voice your preference and then its kind of a matchmaker process with the different desks and if they think your skills are suited for sales or trading. I do not believe that post that says a female can be put into HR, your sales and trading so you will work in sales and trading. The thing that I have to agree with is that most women end up going into sales. I think its a combination that there are not a lot of women traders and that many women have natural abilities of salesmen. With that said, I know that some women do trade. You just have to really show your enthusiasm and KNOWLEDGE. Being a women does not help getting into trading. I would equate it as trying to get IBD from a non-target school, where you need alumni support and work your ass off to show that you really want it. Congrats on the offer!!
Thanks Gekko21
Enthusiasm is no problem. But when you say "KNOWLEDGE" - do you mean I must show more knowledge than my (male) counterparts (and how do I do that) or just do the same thing as everyone else and what I am doing already every day (reading WSJ, understanding the markets, trading my own account, etc)?
Basically yes. You need to show them that you are one of the best analysts they have. This comes from general market knowledge, asking good questions, eagerness to learn, doing assignments correctly and of high quality. To put it bluntly, impress the shit out of them. You want trading which is super competitive. I don't know if you realize, but at large BB, sales people out number traders by a lot (I mean there might be 15-20 traders for over 100+ sales people). The key hear is that you need to befriend traders because its they who will give you the trading offer.
You shoud read WSJ everyday. Other great sources are Financial Times, The economist (everyweek), and Barrons (on weekends). These are the four key sources of information. Im not saying you have to read everyone of these publications each week (except for WSJ), but you should glance at at least one ( I personally like The economist). Trading your own account is important, because you will be able to talk about trades you have done, and keep up with EXACTLY what the market is doing. I dont know if you have a product you really like (I love FX and trade it), but you should be at least demo trading. Also, since you will be rotational, Make sure to read up on the three desks you are assigned and what products they trade (ex. Australian dollar and South African Rand influenced heavily by commodity prices, GBP should see downward pressure until the elections in May, and then an upswing should the conservative win, but a hung parliament will weaken it further).
Also, you should learn more about trading. I recommend reading Market Wizards: Interview with top traders by Jack Schwager (both books). Also, reading up on technical analysis by the John Murphy book. "Come into My Trading Room" by Alexander Elder is supposed to be excellent (just got it, plan on reading it soon) You probably dont need to read all of Murphy, but know about candle sticks and some of the other theories like Fib and Elliot. The Market Wizards book is excellent in terms of finding out why Americas best traders were so successful and their general philosophies.
Thanks for the great recommendation, and would there be specific ways/journals or magazines/books pertaining to FX trading? I will probably be assigned to FX trading(spot/options, G7 currencies), and I am wondering about the things that I can do from now until June to help me work on the prop and flow desk as an intern this summer.
It depends. I don't really use one source and I have learned a lot by just talking with FX traders and reading random stuff. Some of the books/sources that I have used/glanced at:
Currency Trading for Dummines--I swore I would never read a "For Dummies" book, but it is an excellent book for a beginner and you might be able to get one free from Forex.com if you sign up.
Lots of banks have research reports that they post (BNYmellon.com, UBS, I think DB also) the reports are analysts expectations as well as explaining what happened in the previous week. Its good in terms of understanding what is driving the markets.
I also go on fxweek.com from time to time to get info/find out what banks are doing with their FX desks.
These are just a few of the sources I can think of off the top of my head and you should not be looking at just these---look for other sources as well and you might find a real gem. Good Luck!
Also, I think the way it works at most banks is that they force you to do one trading and one sales rotation, but the third you get to choose. Its to make sure you get the full picture. Obviously, try to get three trading rotationals if possible, but if not make sure you show an interest in what the sales people do while at the same time talking with the traders at that desk---with any luck you'll sit next to a sales person who sits next to a trader.
Thanks for the good info/advice!
I've been meaning to read Market Wizards for ages, any ideas as to where I could download it from?
You can get all 3 for under $50....just buy them. http://www.amazon.com/Market-Wizards-Interviews-Top-Traders/dp/15928029…
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If it's a rotational program I don't think you should be dead set on anything. Use the opportunity to figure out where you fit in best. This will be your only opportunity to do so and once you start you will be pidgeon-holed
Advice for turning BB Sales internship --> full time trading offer? (Originally Posted: 03/01/2011)
I accepted a sales internship on the desk of a BB I would like to trade on. What should I do over the summer to work my way over to the trading side of things and maybe even snag a full time trading offer?
build relationships with traders maybe?
don't ask dipshit questions like this, perhaps.
Most important thing is to kill your sales internship. Nobody will be willing to help you move if you don't have great recommendations. Build relationships with traders, and if you're getting good reviews, be up front with your sales people towards the end of your internship. Even if you do a great job and your guys like you, they will still be pissed if a trader calls them up and asks about you.
I agree with makers mark. First and foremost, you must be a great sales intern. You will need the Sales team's help in order to move anywhere. Once everyone likes you, you can start spending some of your free time talking with traders. I would focus on asking very intelligent market questions or questions about their path to trading.
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