Would you ding a kid for having their pronouns on their LinkedIn
Would you ding a kid for having their pronouns on their LinkedIn. How about in their email signature
There's been a common trend in every Summer Analyst I've worked with where they list She/Her in their name, they've been an annoying bitch to work with. Always expecting special treatment and other bs
Yes.
del
Ironic how each side claims the other are snowflakes and yet they both get offended so easily by stupid meaningless shit thats not hurting anyone
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Lol and what exactly does it say? See, this is the problem, both sides think that the other side are terrible people. I’m not liberal but i know Most people that do pronouns are just trying to be nice / inclusive to trans people. That's it. They just want to be nice lol
Having pronouns in someone's LinkedIn profile obviously isn't hurting anyone in and of itself, it's more that it's a massive red flag indicating that someone is very likely to be a problem child.
Take a time machine 50 years ago and the same thing would be said about people of color
Amen
If pronouns we’re meaningless, people wouldn’t bother telling you their preferred pronouns to begin with
It's not a matter of being "offended." It's a matter of whoever uses pronouns like this doesn't have common sense. There are two biological sexes. Not "genders"; gender is used to refer to grammar.
Face it, we don't want it. I know you're going to say that this lets us be more inclusive to people who practice transgenderism, but that's not my goal, nor is it something people want. If you were doing business in Saudi Arabia, you wouldn't get mad at them for not drinking alcohol. Well, we don't want Silicon Valley/New York values imposed on us either.
When homosexual marriage was legalized, at the time my mindset was, well this doesn't really affect people outside of them so although it's not my cup of tea, I can't really argue against it - but it does seem now that it's opened up a whole can of worms culturally, and we don't want it.
Whatever economic benefit we get from more "diversity" isn't worth continued cultural rot and debasement of all human life to the lowest common denominator, where everyone is androgynous, no one is exceptional, and the main priority is an obsession with safety, walking on eggshells, and just blindly following orders from your Latinx obese HR manager with 20 cats. We need to get back to a culture that focuses on greatness instead of rolling out the red carpet to the lowest.
Actually there are more than 2 distinct "sexes" or presentations of biological genitalia. There are people born with both male and female parts if you will, (now known as hermaphrodite or intersex) and some born lacking certain biological genitalia that traditionally corresponds with their "sex". Secondly, Human gender identity is not located in ones genitalia but rather in certain sections of the brain specifically, the development of gender identity is represented by the central subdivision of the bed nucleus of the stria terminalis (BNST) and the third interstitial nucleus of the anterior hypothalamus (INAH3). This has nothing to do with grammar.
None of this biology has anything to do with cultural rot except in your ideology. It's just science.
this dude got a C in high school biology
You know those people who put their pronouns in Zoom - lol. But no, I would not risk harming some kids career significantly due to a small sign of political affiliation they display which does not impact me in the slightest. That sounds like being a complete asshole to me. This is like dinging a dude for listing guns as one of his interests. Not cool.
How dare you have a reasonable and sensible take
Shit yeah this is actually pretty fair. Can't argue with you on that broski.
I fucking love guns, and would ding a kid for both of these things. It’s a lack of social intelligence and not knowing how to at least pretend to be normal more than political affiliation.
The left just keeps slowly encroaching and trying to restrict gun owners’ rights.
The number of kids who get jobs will be the same, so I don’t see anything wrong with “dinging” someone for any reason. It just helps someone else.
Putting pronouns in a profile is a sign of poor judgment. Whether that’s a dealbreaker depends on how competitive the role is.
I agree - it's just cringe. The exception would be if you're trying to finesse a DEI program (especially if you're claiming to be lgbt rather than Hispanic) - I feel like it'd be necessary to have it on your LinkedIn or at least your resume. Maybe go "he/him/él" for the extra implication
100%. It’s all virtue signaling.
dinging a candidate for virtue signaling is sociopathic shit
the right virtue signals fucking *constantly*, but are you dinging someone for fake outrage over starbucks cups?
virtuous people don't virtue signal.
actually, normal people don't virtue signal.
every virtue-signaling person I've come across has turned out to be borderline sociopathic
If you feel the need to use pronouns you don't belong in banking... simple as that.
Lol they are completely unrelated but ok
What exactly qualifies you to say this lmao
Nothing qualifies me at all. It's my opinion, take it as it is. I don't respond to anyone from my alma mater who uses pronouns. It's political virtue signaling, and in all honesty it's soft as f*ck.
You just used the pronoun 'you' looks like you don't belong in banking.
DING, DING, DING. Only part of it has to do with political leaning...in my opinion, either you are a male or female, and hopefully people can tell by looking at your photo and not because you specified your "pronouns". All this has gotten out of control over the last few years (and I'm not even that old).
Mostly it has to do with lack of awareness and street smarts. No one will EVER ding you for NOT including your pronouns, but some people will absolutely ding you for it.
It's a free country and you can say/think/feel whatever you want, but why put yourself at a potentially major disadvantage? Finance people, for the most part, are generally conservative.
I think it's to get past the HR screen tbh. Way too many "woke" basic bitches in HR.
lol thats so true they eat up so many shitty lies that candidates have given them (me included lol)
If I were still in IB, I would not. Who gives a shit? All I need is a bunch of efficient monkeys that crank out error free books.
Ding. Do not put pronouns. Stop virtue signalling. Read the bible. Uphold Judeo-Christian values upon which the West was built, and became the greatest, most successful, civilisation ever built.
We have to encourage a return to traditional moral values.
yes, like cocaine and hookers
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dude, Jesus wasn't white. LOL.
But you don't have to be white to do any of those things
Judeo-Christian values did nothing but harm the West's dominance and advances (i.e. Christian book burnings). Look at how successful Greek & Roman civilizations were pre-Christianity. Ancient Greek philosophy and Hellenistic philosophy like Stoicism produce superior civilizations than Christian civilizations.
“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.” ― Marcus Aurelius, Last of the Five Good Emperors of the Roman Empire
While there are some useful base values in Christianity, similar ones are found in other places, too. As Norf has aluded - read Plato's Republic for example - he talks about being good as the highest virtue and the only path to being a philosopher.
There is some overlap between ancient philosophies alike Stoicism and Judeo-Christian values. Both believe in the importance of living a virtuous life end using the rational mind to control you passions. When OP says, “return to Judeo-Christian values” I believe this is what he is talking about.
You picked the wrong industry. [Burped out in between gulps of a mixed drink]
Hate to break it to you, but Western glory came about like this
The modern Western world <- industrial revolution <- enlightenment <- renaissance <- reviving the Roman world by going against Middle Ages Christianity* (i.e. naked statues of David, and allowing usury in trade, which were anti-Christian) + Islamic Golden Age (example: algorithm comes from the Arabic Al Khawirzmi, so does alcohol and the concept of algebra) + < - Ancient Greece < - Babylon, Syria and Persia
*Btw, the Middle Ages Christianity the renaissance Italians were rebelling against in the 13th - 15th centuries was actually a Romanised form of Jesus' teachings that Jesus himself would've been offended by (idea of the trinity, three Gods in one, idolatry, alcohol) that are completely against the ideals of an Abrahamic faith.
It was never a Judeo-Christian thing. If its was, then Christians wouldn't have been slaughtering Jews for 2,000 years. Turn off Fox News and read a history book.
No such thing as "Judeo-Christian values". There´s the Hellenic/Master spirit, shared by some parts of the Catholic Church, and the Yeast/Slave spirit, shared by all the rest. Read BAP.
What's BAP?
Agree on the ding, but reading more not sure if this is sarcastic or not just for how over the top it was
Reality is that Christianity got us to where we are now. The Covington kids were thrown under the bus by their own church. Probably the best thing that will save the west is a moderated form of Islam really.
"Stop virtue signalling"
"We must return to Judeo-Christian Values"
hmmmm
Hmm, this is pretty interesting to read, didn't realize this forum was so against pronouns? Interesting that pronouns are supposedly a political topic, might just be my geography
To answer your question OP, I wouldn't even think twice about them listing it
Personally don't see an issue in listing/using preferred pronouns at all, I'm happy to refer to people in the way they prefer to be addressed. All experiences I've had in the workplace have just been catching myself if I slip up and use the wrong ones toward someone who uses different ones (typically someone who goes by they/them). Not much of a headache on my end and I haven't found any meaningful correlation between people who specify pronouns and their attitudes in the workplace.
To me, it's just a matter of respect and inclusivity - I understand there are differing opinions on the gender vs. sex debate that I don't see a need to get into (which I suppose explains why pronouns are a political topic), but feel like something so small as using the correct pronouns doesn't inconvenience anyone and shouldn't incite a big debate?
Hopefully the above isn't too controversial and happy for someone to challenge my views if I'm not thinking about it the right way
think of it this way -- the client CFO is on a call and asks to be explained a certain assumption made on the model. MD; "Sure, he [referring to the analyst] can explain." Analyst: "No md, my pronouns are they/them," 50-year-old conservative client CFO: "[What the hell is going on here?]". Long story short, these craps don't belong to the Investment Banking environment, if you care about these, then go work at a marketing company or at the HR department of the bank.
Appreciate the example and I can completely see where you’re coming from!
I think, if I were in a similar situation, the way I would have addressed that exchange (as the Analyst) would be to not bring up the pronoun correction during the meeting, rather address the MD afterwards (in a neutral tone, just flagging that would prefer to be referred as Asshole/Bitch)
I know you say this isn’t what IBD is like, but I’ve absolutely found the seniors in my firm to appreciate these things and our firm does promote this sort of environment without forcing D&I material down our throat
I will note it seems my experience isn’t representative of what the standard IBD environment is like, so think I’m not in the best position to talk about this with a banking-specific context
... but this isn't the scenario? Obviously this is inappropriate (unless said MD is doing it repeatedly and on purpose), but you've created this out of whole cloth. If my name is Randolph and I put Randy as my name on LinkedIn, I'm not "virtue signaling," I'm expressing a preference for how I'd like to be addressed. Pronouns are no different, whatever Sean Hannity may like you to think. Anyone getting up in arms because someone made an honest mistake is going to find other things to be upset about anyway, so you're not exactly dodging a bullet.
Use pronoun on LinkedIn and it's an automatic ding.
I have never met anyone who wants to be referred as something else than they are. Never met someone who asked to refer to them as they. Especially in IBD, this is highly unlikely.
According to Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental disorders (DSM 5), gender dysphoria is not common, with only less than 0.6% of the population suffering from it.
It does not make sense to reorganise the whole society for such a small % of the population suffering from gender dysphoria (policing whether we used right pronoubns, changing all official documents to include other genders, changing the way sports are split between men and women, bathrooms, locker rooms, competitions, department stores, fashion, schools etc).
The entire pronouns thing on LinkedIn is pure virtue signalling. Those that put their pronouns, almost always just put the pronouns we would have used anyways - he / him for men and she / her for women.
Appreciate you commenting, and I'll admit I find it hard to think of solutions for the broader issues in society (schools, sports etc.)
From my perspective, I do genuinely feel it's a sign of support. I view it as a simple way for me to show support to a group of people (yes - they are a small subset of our population) who struggle with their own battles, be it due to the lack of identity or the very divisive viewpoints people have on the topic
I never really thought there would be this much of a negative view towards it but it has been interesting reading this thread, and has left me with a bit to reflect on, so once again appreciate your thoughts
Thank you for bringing the truth to this conversation!
While this may be true, not everyone who chooses to use alternative pronouns suffers from gender dysphoria.
Are you, by chance, the world's biggest pussy? Asking for your dad.
Hahaha, I wouldn't say so
If you're referencing my tone - I've always found it better to have these discussions in good faith, because it allows me / hopefully others to think more critically about our views instead of resorting to bad faith arguments. I'm more than happy to think through and challenge my / others views but understand WSO may not be the best medium to do so
If you're referencing my views - I suppose I've just been in environments that focus on respect / empathy for others without allowing it to consume my entire life. I'm aware this could be perceived as "weak" behavior, but I wouldn't say that's the sentiment held by people in my life (relationships, work, friends)
Cant tell if this is a trolling comment or not. You have had multiple people ask you to refer to them as a 'They', and you see nothing wrong with that?
You have no spine. Those people hate you and everything you are. Don´t believe me? My mom had a gay friend, the way his "people" talked about us normal folk was more than derogatory, it was almost enough to warrant a hate crime - in Minecraft, of course.
hahahaha this comment is pure gold. "his people"? "us normal folk"? you must be seriously brainwashed to be this hostile.
most gay people aren't like that, & nobody's out to get you or straight people buddy
Here is how me and my fellow analysts would go about it:
Pronouns on their linkedin/email signature? No -> continue? Yes -> it depends:
Lol you better be careful about the she/her. The moment you start giving side glances expect to be reported to HR for harassment.
that's exactly why I'd ding them. Like I don't want to get cancelled or deal with HR nonsense because of this one weirdo who thinks he is neither male nor female and will raise a complaint if I make a mistake once.
Facts. The ugly ones would just be a complaining nightmare
that's exactly why I'd ding them. Like I don't want to get cancelled or deal with HR nonsense because of this one weirdo who thinks he is neither male nor female and will raise a complaint if I make a mistake once.
Fucking based. But watch these "she/her" Emilys, they´re the most ruthless ones in the pack.