ADHD help requested

ADHD help requested / medication - I have severe medically diagnosed attention deficit disorder. My brain’s ability to concentrate has now degraded even further. It’s a problem to work in finance with this condition. I am unsuited to long periods of concentration required to make PPTs, memos, models. I muddle through but I keep underperforming and condition worsening. Adderoll helped but big side effect. Any alternatives? Neutropics? Caffeinating up?

 

personally I need at least 30mg to concentrate on boring tasks. My Dextroamphetamine isn’t as strong as the adderall in terms of mental focus but the side affects are significantly easier to deal with and I prefer it. Ritalin is often a popular replacement for those who don’t respond well to adderall

 

also

The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) have also approved three nonstimulant medications for treating the symptoms of ADHD: atomoxetine (Strattera), guanfacine (Intuniv), and clonidine (Kapvay). Doctors typically prescribe these drugs for people who have problems when taking stimulants.

if you talk to your doctor about the side effects you are experiencing, they can try to find the right combination of meds for you. There are multiple brain chemistries that all fall under the ADHD umbrella...which is why you need to find the right combo of meds for you.

its not one-size-fits-all

 

I prescrition by a psychiatrist of concerta (27mg) and it works amazingly. The main nasty side effects that I experience. - Whenever I take it, my mouth feels dry and my bladder shrinks to the size of a six year old kid. - My body becomes slowly exhausted If I take it for two/three weeks in a row. I usually take it whenever I have something big coming up and mix ritalin. They are both made from Methylphenidate.

 

donqua

Do you have ADHD? If so, how does it work with trading?

I "have ADHD," and it works pretty well in trading/risk. Market events really drive the liveliness around here, so the work can get intense? but it's ALWAYS exciting & never menial. Think the excitement keeps me focused. When markets are stable, shit gets boring, and that's when it can get.... "reporting-y," which isn't fun. But distract your managers long enough, then another event will occur & we're back to the fun haha

 

The first question I'm going to ask is if you enjoy this.

Seriously, I was diagnosed as ADD/OCD at 6 and put on Ritalin for years. I think that it's more common than you'd think around here.

I have trouble 'shutting off' as well as building the final report. I just try to suck it up and power through it. I never took Adderall, as my experience with Ritalin really soured me to those things, and completely ruined my social experience for a decade. My big advantage is that I love the underlying data, and would continue to do it for free. (Don't tell my boss that)

The only difference between Asset Management and Investment Research is assets. I generally see somebody I know on TV on Bloomberg/CNBC etc. once or twice a week. This sounds cool, until I remind myself that I see somebody I know on ESPN five days a week.
 

Do I enjoy work you mean? Generally not. But I have expenses and need to earn a living. I keep trying to find things that are more suitable. But for now, I just got to do well enough to be able to make rent.

But if you're asking if I might be more able to concentrate if I enjoyed the subject matter more I'd still also be tempted to say 'no.' Even in subjects I enjoy concentration has become difficult. I have a far easier time remembering what I hear and focusing on social interactions. I have a harder time sticking to computer tasks. In fact doing so is nearly impossible.

 

I have the same diagnosis and you remind me of myself :) Do you take any medications at all? I take zoloft which just helps with the ocd and wellbutrin which decreases side effects and maybe helps a little with adhd. Still working on finding the right combination with my doctor so it'd be interesting to hear what someone else does (I do understand that different things work for diff people). The adhd restlessness affects my sleep a lot which I don't think is healthy. I'm hesitant to try actual stimulants just from the side effects I've been hearing.

Array
 

Do you count Coffee and Alcohol as medications?

Honestly, I really lucked out. I've found myself on the pointy end of the spear to the point where my OCD is largely taking care of my ADD. I'm assigned a different task every time and am known as the 'odd projects' guy in my department.

Family members are like "I've got this question about X that Grandma's FA is putting her in," and my response is to read the methodology doc or email contacts at S&P/MSCI/FTSE Russell. Let's just say that that Merrill or Ameriprise "Vice President" FA gets scared when you forward an email from the 'Senior Director for Index Products' from a major index provider faster than you can imagine.

The only difference between Asset Management and Investment Research is assets. I generally see somebody I know on TV on Bloomberg/CNBC etc. once or twice a week. This sounds cool, until I remind myself that I see somebody I know on ESPN five days a week.
 

Was diagnosed with ADHD as a kid and continually since. I’m not entirely convinced it’s really a thing, but I have my experiences like others here.

I found junior IB work to actually be the easiest ADHD job in terms of needing almost no meds. It’s a lot of short bursts of objective work that isn’t too boring . . not fascinating either but not boring and not a lot of writing. So you may be fine, and if you do keep medicating then start small bc you may not need much.

Following obvi not medical advice, in fact some advice on docs at bottom:

People who don’t do well on adderall may do well with Straterra, Vyvanse or other members of the “non stimulant” class. I use quotes bc they still raise heart rate and have similar risks to stimulants, but their chemical pathway is different so they’re a new opportunity for anyone who had trouble with a “stimulant” class drug.

Also, minimum effective dose is huge. Take any opportunity you can for skipping days and for cutting dosage. If you know an easier day is coming, make that an off day. Vacations and holidays, don’t take it. This is critical for avoiding buildup of these long-half life drugs, and keeping your body from doing reuptake that forces you to need more of the drug later.

Get a good doc who’s thoughtful, any doc who seems to be cookie-cutter in his thinking is bad news. Good litmus test is to ask about dosing strategy. If they’re like “recommended dose is X, take as directed” that’s bad. If they’re willing to work on a custom strategy for minimizing load over time like I said above, that’s your doc. If you’re having trouble with regular docs, see a psychiatrist, they’re usually smarter about this.

Other things that have helped me are meditation, being fanatical about sleep.

 

I was diagnosed with ADHD as a kid. I am the hyperactive type. I work best under pressure and on a deadline basis. I am really talkative and high energy. Would IB suit me or would be S&T better?

 

If your ADHD was the only factor in the world that matters, S&T probably a bit of a better fit. But there's everything else to consider like which work interests you more and so on. IB and S&T are both fairly ADHD friendly (compared to other jobs) so don't make ADHD the only deciding factor.

 

Great reply. I was diagnosed with ADHD as a kid. I am really interested in HF and I love research. If L/S is not ideal for ADHD- if that is so, what type of Hedge Funds are best for ADHD? What are the best asset to dive into? I think I'll have some trouble to read an 10-k.

 

I third this. Vyvanse changed my life. Was on addy and they kept upping the dosage. It would give me horrible social anxiety and the come downs were horrendous.

Vyvanse is much smoother, no cracked out feeling and doesn't give the same anxiety that addy does.

"Out the garage is how you end up in charge It's how you end up in penthouses, end up in cars, it's how you Start off a curb servin', end up a boss"
 

It is based on personal experience. I have had a boss who took it and an ex girlfriend who was on Vivanse and a few other people and it made a noticeable difference for them.

If they forgot to take it, it was noticeable and reminding them to take it and seeing them morph back into a functioning person was part of it. Sometimes I would say to take it and they would forget and I would have to remind like 5 times until seeing them put the pill in their mouth.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

Cut out all caffeine. increase water consumption. Speak to doc about alternative medications (concerta, medikinet etc.) but more importantly: plan on moving to a job that excites you. ADHD is amazing (medicated or not) if you work on something you like (at least have a plan to get there at some point...). M&A is simply not a high ADHD suitable job. The same reading of docs and doing presentations could however become really exciting if you like the underlying topic, job etc. more.

 

Do you think PE is a good job for ADHD? What is the best job for ADHD in finance?

 

Hey man,

I use medication for my ADHD. I used Ritalin but that stuff had a major impact on my mood and energy levels. I switched to dexamphetamine and it works way better because it has a good impact on my mood. I try minimize the amount of meds I take but so far it improved my life for the better. Make sure to check with a doctor though! Different meds help with different problems.

Good luck :)

Edit: I'm from Europe, dexamphetamine might have a different name in the USA but if you plan on medication I highly recommend that one. Still, discuss your problems with a doctor! Edit 2: it's Vyvanse, and as said by other users, works great!

 

Aside from medication, what about meditation/visualization? There are short guided meditations on youtube you could listen to. Let's say 5-10 minutes worth. If you train your brain (you can literally rewire it) by practicing this, it can be helpful. Basically, when you feel you are unable to focus, take the couple minutes to literally "unfocus". When you refocus, you may have a better time at it. The brain needs to REST. Literally. Taking breaks - research this. This is why people get epiphanies or finally figure something out when they're drifting off to sleep, or in the shower. It's when they finally relax and unfocus that the thoughts come through. By taking a few moments to unfocus, relax, you can refocus after more fully. Another method that works is called EFT, or tapping. It can be done quickly. There are many Youtube videos to show you how. I think in many cases, at work we are dealing with OVERWHELM. While worrying about the pitch you're trying to complete on a deadline, other tasks loom in your head. Or you're thinking "if I don't leave by X, I'll miss dinner with my GF again." So yes, there are emotions we all repress. Both meditation/visualization and EFT are very effective in helping you deal with the core emotions that are in the background, which you are likely stifling, because you want to "be a big boy and do your work!" But we are not robots...managing the emotions that go along with these tasks can be useful.

I hope this maybe is simply another option to help you along with whatever you need to do medically. Maybe it can make a big difference for you.

 

I think that very much affects all things emotional and psychological. I have always heard that "sleep hygiene" like going to bed at the same time, not sleeping extra on weekends, no screens before bed etc, a.m. exercise - maybe you've done all that already or can't with work. I am a total zombie without good sleep.

There are some sleep meditations on youtube that help you fall asleep and play in the background during the night...maybe worth a look? Just a thought for you.

 

Talk to a reputable psychiatrist or psychologist. Discount everything people say here. The brain while less understood by medicine than say the heart is still way way better understood by medicine than random people. There are even non stimulant medications for adhd like strattera. Probably want to go to 1 hr therapy sessions hopefully once a week but IB isn't exactly conducive to taking anytime off during the work week.

Array
 

Here is my recommendation, take it or leave it.

For 2 weeks, do the following:

100% Cut out: - Sugar - Caffeine - Gluten - Grains (rice, quinoa, etc.) - Dairy - Soy - Corn - Alcohol - Any medications Drink 80 ounces of water a day Exercise at least 4x a week for 1 hour, with heart rate at least 80% of max for 30 minutes (this is probably over ~160 bpm depending on your age, fitness, and weight). I recommend HIIT weight training Sleep at least 8 hours each night, the same hours each night Do not look at phone for 30 min before going to sleep

If after 2 weeks you haven't noticed a change in brain chemistry / ADHD symptoms, talk to a therapist

 

I'm not saying don't eat any carbs at all, but just try and lower the carbs. I do keto everyday and it has been great. I suffered from ADHD for a long time but I took a lot of biohacking advice from some people and it's helped enormously. Eating a lot of carbs is the biggest cause of "food comas" which is when you feel so damn lethargic you can never get out of bed in the morning. It causes lethargy throughout the day as well.

 

I have ADD. I keep missing little details or forgetting to do shit. I don't fucking know why I'm still employed.

 

How do you still manage to find work if you get fired so much? Have you tried medication?

Try looking shit up on /r/adhd and /r/nootropics look into something and take it to your psychiatrist. People on those forums have experience taking of label stuff that their psychiatrists recommend. Take notes and go talk to your psychiatrist.

The idea that I am simply retarded pops up in my head every now and then.

 

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“The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly salary.” - Nassim Taleb
 

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“The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly salary.” - Nassim Taleb

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