Article: https://www.wsj.com/articles/biden-administration…
Moratorium for student loans extended to August.
I have to start by saying I am not surprised , but does the mean than the federal government is basically to 1 just never require repayment at this point? This really feels like just the biggest bandaid to a larger problem.
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Just speed read the article and my off the cuff 30,000' view is that yeah this will just be a kick of the can to another point where if this happens a couple more times and/or the economy doesn't exactly spectacularly rebound they'll wind up throwing in the towel and that'll be another "such and such crisis" ala housing bubble, tech bubble, etc.
I think the current administration is waiting to use cancellation as election ammunition, either for the midterms or for Biden to use whenever the new Dem runs in 24.
I didn't even really think of it as a long term political play, but honestly you are probably not wrong.
at this point, I wouldn't put it past them.
Strategically that would actually be a very solid idea. Realistically, horrible fucking plan and god do I hope not.
I was planning on paying off my total student loan balance (~30k) after I graduate this summer (I have it all in savings) but now you have me questioning myself
No point in not waiting a little longer at this point since they're extending the moratorium
Wouldn't it be more like fuck the senate and the house? unless it was executive order.
You heard it. If education is affordable in this country like it was in the past (UC, CUNY, UF were all tuition free) or in every other developed country, this tough guy conservative is gonna 'burn it all down'. 😂😂 What a good little Koch bros NPC
It would be a cold day in hell before you were able to comprehend that the only reason college got so expensive in the first place was because the government subsidized it so heavily and made it so any Tom Dick and Harry can get a loan for whatever degree they please. This entire situation is 100% the government's fault from end to end, as most bubbles tend to be.
Take a good junior monkeys, this your brain on modern progressivism. Not even once!
No, it was Reagan era budget cuts. He initiated tuition in the UCs and many states followed suit and slashed education budgets. America did just fine with free education in the past and many countries are doing it well now. But then conservatives decided throwing more money at Soros was a better idea than an educated workforce. Still waiting for it to trickle down!
It's truly amazing that your whole new spiel is that it's conservatives funding Soros. Never change Dumpy, we need people like you to make it abundantly clear to everyone else just how stupid you have to be to be a hard lefty. You are a man of the people!
The fact that universities do not face consequences in the event of a default (like traditional loans) incentivizes a high tuition rate and useless degrees.
Says the dude on a wall Street forum, the people who need to be bailed out every decade now.
Even worse still - nothing is being done to fix the underlying issue. Forgiving these loans basically becomes tax payers paying for corner offices for worthless admin jobs at every public university in America, or new and unneeded student center buildings, or tons of other shit.
Complete waste of taxpayer money that results in almost no actual return in terms of education quality. You could cut 75% of university admin jobs, I am not kidding, and not impact quality of education
Spot on. And a lot of these loans are to doctors and other relatively high earners.
They should just cut interest at this point and just make people repay their principal. Anyone who votes for forgiveness hates the working class. Young people who advocate for this absolutely hate poor people and want more privilege. Anyone who believes the "oh this makes it too hard to buy a house or start our financial lives" crap needs to educate themselves on the most basic shit. Why would a society forgive debt for people who are incredibly economically advantaged over those who did not go to college? It is litterally an insane policy position.
Because the people who are "economically advantaged" are the ones with the cash flow to finance a home purchase, new Merc purchase, boat purchase, or even their children's education at a private school, etc. So yes, it's in the financier's best interest (profit motive) to get extra debt wiped off these peoples' balance sheets so the borrowers can then take on their debt. And of course, they already have the money to court the politicians to make that happen.
This is political suicide. The financiers benefit isn't relevant. When a party claims to be to the benefit of a group while courting another group and then passes legslation that only benefits the courted group while massively disadvantaging the group they proport to support, well to put it lightly that political group will never hold broad power for at least a generation. This isn't a financial problem, it is an optics problem for the Democrats. They need stupid young people who believe they can get something for nothing to propell them into office. Once in office the politican needs to pretend to try to get their stuff done while ignoring them long enough that the young people get to prime tax paying age and realize that wiping out the debts of privilged memebers of society at the expense of everyone is a terrible fucking idea.
Speaking as one, millennials are the most entitled and pathetic generation in history. But hey easy to blame boomers for everything
To be fair the boomers did wreck everything by embracing corporate welfare and outsourcing a ton of jobs. Look at Detroit 60 years ago and Detroit today. It is only one example of several cities.
Boomers destroyed the most prosperous society in human history. They deserve the scorn they get for being greedy little sociopaths.
Woodstock was gay, the Beatles suck, and no one thinks Camaros are cool. Fuck boomers. Maybe if more of them were drafted in Vietnam they wouldn't have been such fucking hypocrites.
As a generation, we could do so much better, but rather than be better, we choose not to.
you mean the way almost every person/government handles every problem?
too many people doing heroin? lock 'em up instead of fixing root causes of the reasons they want to use or legalizing everything and letting people screw up their lives
people too fat? instead of losing weight via diet & exercise, take statins and insulin
too much govt spending? just change to chained CPI so social security doesn't go bankrupt and have the Fed buy debt
racial tensions? instead of starting conversations and investing from the ground up in education and public safety, let's have everybody do DEI training so we can feel good about ourselves while also enacting reverse segregation to make things worse
banks fail? let's just bail 'em out because we're so fucking terrified of a recession instead of removing moral hazard by forcing them to hold the risk they offload to other citizens
gas too expensive? let's just give people checks and say fuck all for the next 40 years because MUH ESG instead of actually investing in energy independence while at the same time investing in sustainable resources that will last us the next hundred years
billionaires evading taxes? instead of actually changing the tax code let's just add another law to the books that fucks over about 56 people and makes lives ever more miserable for W2 workers (like fucking always)
Nothing bas been built.
Nothing is back.
Nothing is better.
I don't think there is a single presidential slogan that has held up.
Ya because it's the name of a bill that didn't get passed, not a campaign slogan, not to mention the fact that legislative changes take a while to propagate through the economy. We're going to have better highways and bridges because of the infrastructure bill that was passed, but I doubt I'll ever hear someone on here giving Biden credit for that. I swear to god the political understanding on this forum is worse than walking into a Bernie Sanders convention.
Smells like copium to me.
IMO, if student loans are forgiven completely, that would start a death spiral in our country. All debt would suddenly be able to be called into question. Why can't credit card debt, car debt, mortgage debt, payday loan debt etc., etc., etc., be next on the chopping block? Those are hard to pay back too.
These people signed on the line as sober adults, and it stinks that they got the short end of the stick in many cases, but that's on them, and is all the more reason that the government should just stay out of debt markets to prevent easy access to credit to people who have no business getting it and our university systems are just a complete disaster.
Everytime I read a WSJ article on Student loans, it becomes clear how bad of decisions some of these people made to get into their situation.
Especially those ones mentioning some guy who ended up getting a worthless master's in whatever and now works as a barista, it's really unfortunate.
Because all of those other types of debt are dischargeable in bankruptcy, student loans aren't.
So change the laws to make them dischargeable…
Yea, I'm not sure why WSO acts so perplexed why there are a good number of people who want their school loans erased (I'm neither strongly against or for it). Corporations have been either directly or indirectly getting rid of their debt, eventually people were going to get louder requesting it for school loans.
Democracies are unable to effectively run a country.
Authoritarian fascism and a aristocratic/noble ruling class have created literally 100% of great empires up until 80 years ago when the anomaly known as "Murica" combined an unassaultable geographical location with divine amounts of natural resources and the sheer luck that all her contemporary rivals fucked each other over in Europe, Asia and the Middle East so "Murica", a democratic and plutocratic ABOMINATION of a "nation" could rise to relevancy.
This is why China's PPP GDP will literally be 50% of the world's GNP in a decade.
They can actually plan infrastructure, economic and military projects beyond 4 years. They regularly begin projects and operations that last more than an average lifespan, unlike stupid democracies fucking over the country beyond the duration of their term/time in the spotlight.
Based and redpilled.
America is the anomalous Anglo-Zionist mercantile entity that seeks to spread its tentacles worldwide so that every country on earth eats McDonalds, teaches that cutting off your dick makes you a woman, and makes sure to recognize that Black Lives and Israel matter more than anything else. All brought to you by Citigroup and Lockheed Martin, of course.
The final redpill is that World War II was a global war of conquest waged by the United States to establish the liberal capitalist order. World War II is the myth that the entire global narrative rests upon. Once the last WWII vets and boomers die off, you're going to see the narrative collapse.
oWW2 was not a global war of conquest waged by the United States. Germany declared war on Poland and invaded. Then a bunch of other countries. Then they invaded Russia. Japan invaded China and other countries as well, and then they bombed Pearl Harbor. Only then did the US become involved. You need to pick up a history book, no wonder you're a fascist.
Many of you make great points. While I think some of student debt should be eliminated on a case-by-case basis, I think it should be the universities themselves that are forced to write it off. I disagree with some of the other posts about people having horrible decision making as it comes to college. Today more than ever are we forced to take on debt and attend college because almost any job you pull up requires a bachelors degree - at least any job that pays wages one can actually live on. For some of you saying that, you may have had your college paid for you from the moment you were born. That’s not everyone’s case. That said, I do think the government tends to make situations worse.
Why do you think it is t he case that every job requires a degree?
Because today, anyone with half a brain can get one, as long as they're willing to sign themselves up for some of that undischargeable debt. And employers want their employees to have at least half a brain.
I am sorry I whole hearted disagree with this. Yes, I do agree that there should probably be some Financial Aid on a case by case basis. But there is nothing stopping someone from attending an instate school, working while in undergrad or even postponing school until they are in a better financial position. One can also serve in the Military to get free education in the US as well. One does not need to take on debt to get an education in this nation.
And if you do all the above, This should be able to reduce your debt to a manageable level after graduation.
I appreciate your perspective here. Can't argue with your strategies for reducing the debt burden. These are solid options. That said, I don't think these are all feasible for everyone. Not making excuses for people here, just that it depends on the situation. For instance, postponing school only hurts a candidate. Work experience doesn't mean a thing unless there is a credential attached to it. I've learned this the hard way. Look at IB, you can have five years of actual business world experience relevant to an industry group you want to work in only to be required to go to B-school so you can become an associate. Where is the logic?
I'm all for doing your best for what you can control, but college and everything that it entails is the equivalent of living in NYC - it takes more from you than what you get in return. With the exceptions of top schools (I guess), degrees are not as valuable as we've been led to believe - which is one of the only reasons why people attend.
Ended up ranting a bit here lol.
When I attended the state schools about 7-8 years ago, it was filled with students delaying the need to work/face the world as it was an extension of high school. The lines to the Financial Aid office wrapped around the entire building. Usually it would be about 100-130+ students in the beginning of the semester, either petitioning or appealing their Financial Aid decision. Majority, if not all the students I saw in line had new phones, shoes, clothing, etc.
I remember finishing high school back in early 2000's where the price for college education was out of reach for me, and universities had open admission due to lack of enrollment in the education system. Minimum wage was roughly around $7.00 hourly, and community college was not free at all.
I wonder if we will ever get back to those times. Though, I feel that there is a segment of the population who benefited from getting student loans to advance onward in their careers/lives - PhD, PsyD, MD, JD, MS, MA, etc.
The question I have are:
1. What has the outcome been due to the backing of student loan borrowers by the federal government?
2. Has society improved due to more attendance of universities?
3. What impact did this have on the population who did not originally have access to higher education?
Similar to how Social Security has robbed life-changing wealth from younger generations, even on its clear path to demise, they simply procrastinate taking any sort of action on these issues, even though they are fundamentally broken. However, in the case of student debt forgiveness, the delays are intentional so the incumbents can claim “well, there’s 0 chance the GOP will forgive your student loans, but we might…maybe”
As you mentioned, any student loan forgiveness is basically a slap in the face to those who have already paid off their loans responsibly, and sets a dangerous precedent for future “debt cancellation”. Full transparency, I went to a state school on a full scholarship; the issue with student loans is not flagship state schools (despite half of WSO condemning any state school that isn’t in the top 30 USNWR) or highly-selective, prestigious universities, as these two categories have either discounted tuition through in-state taxes or generous financial aid opportunities. However, over the past 15 years there has been a shift in narrative that college is for everyone. A number of states will have over a dozen public colleges, where only 2-4 of those universities will have graduation rates of over 50%. There are also far too many overpriced, unranked private schools (no, I’m not referring to highly selective LACs) that really emphasize the “college experience” while accepting 90% of applicants, a sizable portion of which will never graduate, charging them $60k per year, and then send them to careers with starting salaries of ~$50k. When people feel that they can take a swing at college like it’s a ball in the batting cage free of risk, it further encourages this reckless financial behavior, especially when many of the proposals for cancelling student debt even introduce the idea of prioritizing the forgiveness of loans held by those who failed to graduate, once again, further incentivizing this poor behavior. If someone’s career goal is to be an elementary school teacher, these students should not be able to take out $200k in loans to pay for college. My state school wasn’t in a “cool” part of the country, but I still got a great education and had a good experience; it wasn’t my “dream” campus, and the library wasn’t 100% eco-friendly with multiple 24/7 starbucks inside, but I got an education and grew as an individual - college is supposed to be an investment in your future, not a 6-year vacation funded by tax payers.
Somewhat unrelated note, but the “college is for everyone” narrative needs to be eradicated first and foremost. One of my best friends is a welder and has great pay, is part of a union, and fantastic WLB; another pal assembles furniture and helps people move in a college town and charges $50 per hour, and usually averages about 35-45 hours per week. These are very viable ways to make a living, and I’m tired of the “intellectuals” mocking blue-collar roles when these can be fantastic routes to financial independence for so many people.
Well articulated. I agree with many points you made. I don't see why it is viewed as either college or go learn a trade. There are so many jobs in between that shouldn't require a degree because you learn them on the job. Either way, college doesn't teach you the skills for chosen career paths (at least not for many of them.) That is why we have this whole internship to full-time model.
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