How much do you save

Iceman21's picture
Rank: Baboon | 143

Hello all,

Curious to know how much people saved over a two or three year stretch while working as an IB analyst. If you could list your city as well which would be helpful. Also, if anyone has advice of what the target should be to save would also be helpful. Last question about base pay, does that usually increase as a second and third year analyst?

Comments (96)

May 6, 2011

Friends have said between 20-40k per year depending on bonus and lifestyle. NYC. Base pay ups to 80k in year 2, 90k in year 3..

People tend to think life is a race with other people. They don't realize that every moment they spend sprinting towards the finish line is a moment they lose permanently, and a moment closer to their death.

May 6, 2011
rickyross:

Friends have said between 20-40k per year depending on bonus and lifestyle. NYC. Base pay ups to 80k in year 2, 90k in year 3..

I might have a naive perspective on this, and I know NYC ain't cheap, but saving 20-40k per year implies you are spending upwards of 60k after taxes. Seems like terrible money management.

May 7, 2011
JeffSkilling:
rickyross:

Friends have said between 20-40k per year depending on bonus and lifestyle. NYC. Base pay ups to 80k in year 2, 90k in year 3..

I might have a naive perspective on this, and I know NYC ain't cheap, but saving 20-40k per year implies you are spending upwards of 60k after taxes. Seems like terrible money management.

That's not bad money management at all... many people do a lot worse than that... gotta think things through before you jump the gun on your assessment. Your annual take home (before you get your tax refund) is going to be ~$45K depending on city so it can be more or less. Your bonus will be cut in half, so if you figure median bonus (hardly anyone gets full top bucket) you can probably guesstimate bonus of ~$60k, taking home 30 of that... so all in you have ~$72K in disposable. Take out rent (~$1500+ with utilities, so I would assume $1600x12 equals ~$19,200... call it an even $20k, and you're left with $52k... food/nightlife/miscellaneous expenses in NYC can take $20k off that in a blink of an eye... Bottom line is that you're taking home decent money, but NYC and LA and other major cities are incredibly expensive to live in, so you have to be really frugal if you want to save a substantial portion of your pay...

May 6, 2011

I don't think it's bad money management... I spend more than that and I live in China (it's a whole lot cheaper here).

May 6, 2011

From:
http://www.paycheckcity.com/netpaycalc/netpaycalcu... and
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dof/html/services/business...
$135k - $30k in federal taxes - $5k NYC tax - $9k NY state tax - a bunch of bullshit taxes = $85k leftover

So if you save up $25k you're left with about $60k, which seems reasonable. Bottle service every week = $26k right there (not recommended lol).

NYC rent will cost you around $18k a year if you get a good deal, which leaves you about $42k. I'd be giving at least $15k/yr to my parents, so that leaves me with about $2k a month to spend on misc things such as phone bills and subway tickets. You know, now that I think of it, there's not much else I'll need to spend money on while working 100 hours a week.

May 9, 2011
Spirit of LA:

From:
http://www.paycheckcity.com/netpaycalc/netpaycalcu... and
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dof/html/services/business...
$135k - $30k in federal taxes - $5k NYC tax - $9k NY state tax - a bunch of bullshit taxes = $85k leftover

So if you save up $25k you're left with about $60k, which seems reasonable. Bottle service every week = $26k right there (not recommended lol).

NYC rent will cost you around $18k a year if you get a good deal, which leaves you about $42k. I'd be giving at least $15k/yr to my parents, so that leaves me with about $2k a month to spend on misc things such as phone bills and subway tickets. You know, now that I think of it, there's not much else I'll need to spend money on while working 100 hours a week.

Give em 13k, that's the most recent federal max that you can give without them being required to include it as income. Then send them somewhere nice ;-)

May 9, 2011
bonks:
Spirit of LA:

From:
http://www.paycheckcity.com/netpaycalc/netpaycalcu... and
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dof/html/services/business...
$135k - $30k in federal taxes - $5k NYC tax - $9k NY state tax - a bunch of bullshit taxes = $85k leftover

So if you save up $25k you're left with about $60k, which seems reasonable. Bottle service every week = $26k right there (not recommended lol).

NYC rent will cost you around $18k a year if you get a good deal, which leaves you about $42k. I'd be giving at least $15k/yr to my parents, so that leaves me with about $2k a month to spend on misc things such as phone bills and subway tickets. You know, now that I think of it, there's not much else I'll need to spend money on while working 100 hours a week.

Give em 13k, that's the most recent federal max that you can give without them being required to include it as income. Then send them somewhere nice ;-)

Why would this matter? They're not going to report it as income and you're not going to deduct it on your tax returns. Worst case scenario can't you just say you "owe them" for something?

People tend to think life is a race with other people. They don't realize that every moment they spend sprinting towards the finish line is a moment they lose permanently, and a moment closer to their death.

May 10, 2011
bonks:

Give em 13k, that's the most recent federal max that you can give without them being required to include it as income. Then send them somewhere nice ;-)

I think you meant without him having to pay a gift tax on it, since the giftee is not the one having to pay taxes on gifts.
The 13 k a year gift tax exclusion is per person, so at 2k/month to both parents he is right under the 26 k combined.
Also medical and educational expenses paid directly to the provider are not a subject to the gift tax and are not included in the gift tax exclusion amount.

More is good, all is better

May 6, 2011

I save GBP 1700 or USD 2800 per month. London.

May 6, 2011
mxc:

I save GBP 1700 or USD 2800 per month. London.

How on earth do you manage? Are you renting?

May 8, 2011

My parents paid for my education (was in Europe/UK though, so less expensive).

Here's why:

  1. What matters is the wealth of the family as a whole. If my dad can spend $1 to help me save $2, then he'll do it.
  2. In terms of familial wealth (e.g. my future employment prospects), the value of my studying and socialising are higher than what a minimum wage job would pay.
  3. It is very tax efficient to pay for your kids' education.

Also, we have this idea that a harsh childhood is equally likely to turn a kid into a bitter fuckup as it is to make a "real man" out of you.

Bottom line: my parents are proud and feel like they've done their part; I for one am a rich, healthy and happy individual.

PS: as for my kids, I want an engineer, a doctor and an artist ;-) ;-) ;-)

thor1000:
mxc:

I save GBP 1700 or USD 2800 per month. London.

How on earth do you manage? Are you renting?

I made some money in college and it now pays dividend.

May 6, 2011

Have $96,000 saved from 3 year stint, and have 50,000 DP too.
What b1tches?

May 6, 2011

i'm expecting to save 100k in 2 years. going to live very frugally. 85k - 18k rent - 12k for random shit (food, clothes, drinks, etc, 1k per month). pretty reasonable since i don't plan on getting cable or anything. just internet and a cell phone. and maybe eating out once a week. i can just wear my old clothes. no need for new stuff. furniture is just gonna be a bed and a desk lamp and a desk. don't really need anything else. that leaves about $900 for discretionary spending per month. pretty reasonable given that i'll be trapped in the office for a good 80 hours a week and just hitting the gym or dive bars afterwards.

May 6, 2011

Plan on 20% of your salary, 100% of your bonus.

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May 6, 2011

I save about $5,000 a year on base. Maybe 50% of after-tax bonus. I'm not quite as frugal as some of the other guys on here...

EDIT: I also max 401k, so $16,500 there as well.

May 6, 2011
mxc:

I save GBP 1700 or USD 2800 per month. London.

This is pretty darned good if you're doing this exclusively on salary.

I save about $5,000 a year on base. Maybe 50% of after-tax bonus. I'm not quite as frugal as some of the other guys on here...
EDIT: I also max 401k, so $16,500 there as well.

Yeah, I include retirement savings in the numbers.

I recommend allocating net cash flux in the following order:

1.) Pay off all debt at greater than 10%, starting with student loans.
2.) Get your 401k match. If you have an ugly vesting schedule- IE no vesting whatsoever within two or three years, maybe wait until you've gotten the 7-8%+ loans paid off.
3.) Build up three months of emergency savings.
4.) $5K IRA contrib.
5.) All loans at greater than interest rates in your savings account
6.) Max out your 401K.
7.) Build up eight months of emergency savings.
8.) All other loans
9.) Brokerage account and/or savings depending on your preference for risk.

It was a lot less complicated for me because I graduated state school with $0 in student loans. But bottom line is that there's a series of priorities to pay off.

May 6, 2011

Does everybody pay for school with loans? I thought it was pretty standard for parents to pay, if you're not in a state school. I'm not that familiar with the US way of doing this.

May 6, 2011
thor1000:

Does everybody pay for school with loans? I thought it was pretty standard for parents to pay, if you're not in a state school. I'm not that familiar with the US way of doing this.

heh...really depends on upbringing/parents--many parents do pay, but many either cannot afford it or live by the "i paid my way, so youll be doing the same" or "im not paying 40k+ a year if you could go to xxx state school for 10k!"

May 6, 2011
leveRAGE.:

or live by the "i paid my way, so youll be doing the same" or "im not paying 40k+ a year if you could go to xxx state school for 10k!"

BINGO.

That's what my grandparents said to my Mom, that's what my Mom and Dad said to me. Actually, that is what I will probably be doing with my kids, too, even though it's starting to look like I can afford private school tuition on top of my retirement. They'll all be going to state schools.

There's something to be said for throwing a bunch of college students into the river, shouting "Learn to swim or drown", and meeting them five miles downstream. It's an efficient way of educating ~60% of the population that can make it, builds mental toughness, and institutes a healthy level of darwinism for everyone.

Best Response
May 6, 2011
IlliniProgrammer:
leveRAGE.:

or live by the "i paid my way, so youll be doing the same" or "im not paying 40k+ a year if you could go to xxx state school for 10k!"

BINGO.

That's what my grandparents said to my Mom, that's what my Mom and Dad said to me. Actually, that is what I will probably be doing with my kids, too, even though it's starting to look like I can afford private school tuition on top of my retirement. They'll all be going to state schools.

There's something to be said for throwing a bunch of college students into the river, shouting "Learn to swim or drown", and meeting them five miles downstream. It's an efficient way of educating ~60% of the population that can make it, builds mental toughness, and institutes a healthy level of darwinism for everyone.

Thank God I'm not your son. I'd be fucking pissed if I had to attend Uillinois over Columbia just cuz my non-target dad refused to help me pay tuition.

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May 6, 2011
leveRAGE.:

live by the "i paid my way, so youll be doing the same" or "im not paying 40k+ a year if you could go to xxx state school for 10k!"

Hate this logic to death.

I've met plenty of rich kids who are very modest and ambitious. It takes more effort to educate them this way, but it's possible. No need for draconian methods.

That being said, I'll make my kid work for a retail company, that's for sure. Great experience.

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May 6, 2011

double post

May 6, 2011

It depends. If you come from a well-to-do family, they will usually cover private school. I was lucky in that my family could at least cover in-state tuition If you are incredibly poor, you will typically get grants and scholarships. If you're middle-class, you are basically screwed and graduate school with $150K in student loan debt ($50K if you go in-state).

May 6, 2011

Damn, the loans really pressure you to save every penny. I think its harder to save up in London. I get the feeling housing is more expensive and higher taxes.

I hope the eur/usd doesnt go really low in a few years. I might end up paying 100kEU or just 60kEU. Big difference

May 6, 2011

I can tell you from my own experience here in Europe that when kids get free education not from parents but from the state 100% subsidised, you see a massive lack of drive. Even those with intelligence don't make something of themselves because they are just too damn comfortable.

Although I don't see why not pay for your kid's better education if you can. If your kid is relatively responsible there's no need to take the learn to swim or drown approach. Knowing how much their harvard education costs alone is probably enough to motivate them.

May 6, 2011

Lol man week has taken its toll.

May 6, 2011

dude you sound like a dbag

May 6, 2011

Frankly, I don't care. I had tough parents, my parents had tough parents, and I am going to be a tough parent at least when my kids hit 14. You push them when they're 14-20, and they learn not to panic like a 12-year-old during a market crash or an earthquake when they're 22.

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May 6, 2011

Ok, but you are taking away your kid's potentially better starting point. Sure, lets say you believe that your child has ability to make it this way, but he could be making it bigger if he had a traditionally better starting point. You can't really know these things for sure sometimes.

But if I were you I wouldn't commit to that plan you have, I'd leave it open to see what kind of kid I'll end up with and decide based on his/her character. For some it'll do wonders and for others vice versa, which leaves you with a frustrated daddy issues kid...

May 6, 2011
thor1000:

Ok, but you are taking away your kid's potentially better starting point. Sure, lets say you believe that your child has ability to make it this way, but he could be making it bigger if he had a traditionally better starting point. You can't really know these things for sure sometimes.

Perhaps, but my grandparents toughed out WWII and I know another war, civil revolt, or earthquake is eventually coming. You need to start with your bases and in that process, you're building the character and work ethic to succeed. (CC: Pat Robertson, tough parents, stint in marines, then Harvard MBA then CEO).

But if I were you I wouldn't commit to that plan you have, I'd leave it open to see what kind of kid I'll end up with and decide based on his/her character. For some it'll do wonders and for others vice versa, which leaves you with a frustrated daddy issues kid...

You raise your kids the right way- it's really about setting priorities in your own life and having the right attitude about parenting- and your kids tend to turn out just fine at 14. Then you make them get a summer job forcing them to get a glimpse of the real world, and finish it off by either sending them to state school or have the Army/Navy pay for college.

You need to have the experience of getting thrown into the river by your parents so that when it happens in real life- an earthquake, a war, a mortgage meltdown, you know how to handle it.

May 6, 2011

25% of Income
50% of Bonus

Max your IRA or any employer match, it is free money.

May 6, 2011

Let's be more realistic. Here are some conservative numbers.

Income: 70+10+40= 120K
Income After Tax: 120*.6= 72K

Sub Rent with utilities, cable/internet: 1800*12 = 21.6K
Food, Clothes, Alcohol, Haircuts, etc: 18.25K (figuring $50 a day or random spending on all this stuff, 365 a year). Obviously some days youl eat cereal, have lunch brought in, and log the $25 the firm gives you and not spend a dime. But other days youll spend $ on bottles, new suits, fine dining, vegas, etc.

Leaves you with $32,150. I think if you can save 30k+, you're in good shape. Anyhting lower than 20 your wasting everything.

This is for SF/NY/CHI with no car. If youre in LA, youll be another $500/month for your car, and about $1500/2k a year in car insurance as well as about $200 a month or maintenance (oil change, ac goes out, etc.)

--
"Those who say don't know, and those who know don't say."

May 6, 2011

If I were IlliniProgrammer's kid I would be really pissed if he didn't pay his EFC toward a target-school education.

"The right to have children should be a marketable commodity, bought and traded by individuals but absolutely limited by the state."--Kenneth Boulding

May 6, 2011
OnTheTrack:

If I were IlliniProgrammer's kid I would be really pissed if he didn't pay his EFC toward a target-school education.

I dunno. I got into several target schools, my Dad wouldn't pay our EFC- it was something ridiculous- and I opted for state school instead. My family and I saved $120K and things worked out the same as if I'd graduated from one of the private target schools with the added fact that I had the whole experience of baptism by fire into the take-a-number cinder-block-dorm-room system. I would not have gotten that experience had I gone to a private school. And if my kids grow up wealthy, they need that experience, too. Be it at state school or the armed services- even better- they're going to get it.

Hate this logic to death.

Do you work for a living yet? If you still rely on your parents for support, you're probably going to change your mind once you hit 23 or 24. At 17, I was annoyed that Mom and Dad wouldn't pay for MIT- I even asked them if my aunt and uncle could adopt me so I could get financial aid. Today, I'm grateful that they paid for my in-state tuition. They didn't have to. They didn't owe me anything the second I turned 18.

My kids are going to go through the same system. Not because of the cost, but because of the take-a-number, and you're on your own system. They need to learn that they are not special, they are nobody, they are what they are able to make of themselves, and that some kid from a goat farm outside Carbondale is going to kick their butt on a DiffyQ exam if they don't study. I'll pay for out-of-state tuition if we have a weak flagship college, but they are not going to a private school.

May 6, 2011
IlliniProgrammer:
OnTheTrack:

If I were IlliniProgrammer's kid I would be really pissed if he didn't pay his EFC toward a target-school education.

I dunno. I got into several target schools, my Dad wouldn't pay our EFC- it was something ridiculous- and I opted for state school instead. My family and I saved $120K and things worked out the same as if I'd graduated from one of the private target schools with the added fact that I had the whole experience of baptism by fire into the take-a-number cinder-block-dorm-room system. I would not have gotten that experience had I gone to a private school. And if my kids grow up wealthy, they need that experience, too. Be it at state school or the armed services- even better- they're going to get it.

If you're sure you wouldn't be more successful coming from one of those targets then you're right. If not, you're going to negatively impact your children's futures by refusing to pay for target schools.

"The right to have children should be a marketable commodity, bought and traded by individuals but absolutely limited by the state."--Kenneth Boulding

May 6, 2011
IlliniProgrammer:

My kids are going to go through the same system. Not because of the cost, but because of the take-a-number, and you're on your own system. They need to learn that they are not special, they are nobody, they are what they are able to make of themselves, and that some kid from a goat farm outside Carbondale is going to kick their butt on a DiffyQ exam if they don't study. I'll pay for out-of-state tuition if we have a weak flagship college, but they are not going to a private school.

I won't question your method, but your prejudice towards private school is crazy. Are you mad that your parents didn't pay for private school? Did your gf cheat on you with a dude from private school?

If my kid gets into H/S/W, I'll be more than happy to pay for his or her education. I don't know about you, but I want my kid to be better than me. This entails attending a better university and frankly, only private institutions and a few public schools can top that.

Some of you have so much hate towards elite private schools. Take a break and stop fighting the system. A kid from Wharton, ceteris paribus, will have a much better start than a kid from U of Michigan.

May 9, 2011
OnTheTrack:

If I were IlliniProgrammer's kid I would be really pissed if he didn't pay his EFC toward a target-school education.

Yeah. If I could afford to send my kids to, say, Amherst, I can't imagine not sending them there over a state school. Not every kid has the aptitude or the patience to make it through lots of high level college math, and there's no sense in trying to stick a square peg in a round hole if that's not what they want to do with their life. There are lots of other ways to teach your kids toughness and resiliency.

Debt really limits your options, and I would just hate it if my kids had to start out with that sort of burden if they chose to not go the state school route (or, force them to go to a state school if they have better options).

May 6, 2011
IlliniProgrammer:

Perhaps, but my grandparents toughed out WWII and I know another war, civil revolt, or earthquake is eventually coming. You need to start with your bases and in that process, you're building the character and work ethic to succeed. (CC: Pat Robertson, tough parents, stint in marines, then Harvard MBA then CEO).
You raise your kids the right way- it's really about setting priorities in your own life and having the right attitude about parenting- and your kids tend to turn out just fine at 14. Then you make them get a summer job forcing them to get a glimpse of the real world, and finish it off by either sending them to state school or have the Army/Navy pay for college.
You need to have the experience of getting thrown into the river by your parents so that when it happens in real life- an earthquake, a war, a mortgage meltdown, you know how to handle it.

I find that when disasters happen, human action is much too unpredictable and irrational for such preparation to yield positive results. We obviously differ somewhat in our world view so there's no point in poking further, but I'll tell you that the reason I think that in the extreme situations you described tough upbringing doesnt matter, comes only from what I saw during the 90's in the balkans. You'd be suprised how people who are complete losers in real life, change in times of crisis.

So there's no need to base your kids education on the worst case scenario IMO, but hey my profile pic is Milton Friedman so you know what suits you and your kids best and I wouldnt even dare to pretend I could raise them better.

May 6, 2011

Illini you sound exactly like my roommate... I see merit in the underlying logic of a lot of your sentiments but seriously man, you need to incorporate more flexibility into your plans, otherwise you are bound for disappointment. What happens when your precious daughter wants to study art history and econ at Brown? Would you rather have her elope with her stoner boyfriend to spite you?

May 6, 2011

the most important thing I learned about trying to budget your life, is that you will ALWAYS end up with less money than you expected. reason being that in life there will always be unexpected expenses (speeding ticket, broke your phone/ipod/laptop/ipad/shades etc), some larger expected expenses like a new suit, BIRTHDAY AND XMAS GIFTS, new TV or furniture, but almost never any unexpected savings.

May 6, 2011

what the fuck? why do all the kids here expect their parents to pay for their schooling? What ever happened to a good old fashioned school loan if you cannot afford to go to an overpriced ivy? Better yet go to a good state school and try to get a ton of scholarships. fuck the entitlement mentality. By the time I graduated I saved up a few hundred k from random business ventures i created while still in school.

-guy who paid for his own schooling.

May 7, 2011

Let me just offer a counterperspective here.

My parents were very clear from the start I wasn't getting money from them for college. My two older brothers didn't, I wouldn't, none of us were. We were each expected to learn to provide for ourselves and be self-reliant. My oldest brother couldn't have done much better. He finished high school at 15, did two years of college locally at a small school, enlisted, deployed, finished, got a phenomenal tech job, deployed again, worked, married, fathered two kids, owns two houses, and is a candidate for a pilot in the Reserves. He carved out a path for himself that got him a great education, some phenomenal jobs (the average time he's spent at eight jobs so far is below a year because he keeps getting poached away to bigger and better things), a phenomenal wife (let's leave out the anti-marriage argument for a minute, there's a religious component to that for him) ... happiness in general.

In my case, I knew I had to support myself wherever I went for school. I was nowhere near as informed about the college admissions process as I should have been and approached it very lackadaisically, but I knew I wanted to study business and didn't want to dick around in the bullshit "Business Administration" programs everyone I knew was going into at a bunch of regional unknowns and other joke schools. I applied to a spread of top undergrad b-schools not knowing a damn thing about finance, and I ended up taking a weaker 'target' over Wharton for a few reasons.

Regardless, I got to school and realized that covering $150,000 of a $250,000 education was a bit more than I realized I'd bitten off. I also became aware of the financial services industry as an actual profession, more than the idealized Wall Street everyone knows vaguely of. I was a mess. I had the max credit hours, max work-study hours, was working off-campus too, and pretty unhappy socially. After a miserable freshman year, I decided I wanted to turn things around completely and threw myself into extracurriculars, recruiting, and studying.

I participated in the accelerated recruiting process with a number of banks as a first-semester sophomore. I went from knowing nothing to absorbing absolutely every bit of information I could, a large part of which was this site and M&I. By the end of the semester when I was pulling offers, one of the senior MDs pulled me aside and told me to be careful when I was making my decisions. From what he saw, I was too hungry, too principled, and too driven to make stupid choices when it came to employment.

Long story short, in all honesty I do not believe I would be either where or who I am today if it weren't for the way my parents raised me, particularly my father. Most kids try to pity me when I say I bear the full financial burden of my education alone. It's not something pitiable. I was raised to be self-sufficient, self-reliant, support myself and be responsible for my actions, and I knew if I didn't succeed, I didn't have a safety net to fall back on. I think that's a powerfully motivating factor, and to be frank, while it would've been easier knowing I could just dial Dad and ask for more money whenever I wanted something, it definitely would have made me a weaker person.

I don't think it's right to hate elite schools, because from my experience, the name behind a certain pedigree is an incredible advantage in general. If someone deserves to get into that school, they deserve the benefits that come along with it. That being said, there's no reason to dump on a lesser name-brand school that excels in certain areas. One of the smartest kids I know and who I have the most respect doesn't go to a target, but I expect he'll probably place better than almost anyone I know at Harvard, Wharton, Princeton, Stanford, Duke, or Stern. Why? He went to a top program in what he wanted to study, is excelling, is saving money doing it, and is making for himself better opportunities than the kids at those schools expect to be handed to them.

At the end of the day, I think that's what the whole parents-pay-for-school vs. parents-don't-pay, elite school vs. no-name debate boils down to. My circumstances drove me to create opportunities for myself. I feel like a ton of the kids I met during recruiting had an air of entitlement and, ironically enough, ended up coming across far more nervous because they suddenly had a startling moment of insecurity, whereas I saw it as the culmination of everything I'd been working for.

I wasn't as informed as IP seems to have been about the relative merits of certain programs at certain schools, I basically knew I wanted to go to Wharton/Stern/UVA/Duke/etc. Where I differ, however, is in where I plan to let my kids go. If my kid can get into HPWS etc. on his own merits, there is no reason I will hold him back from that in favor of PSU Schreyer's/UIUC/IU/etc. I will not be coddling my kids. They will have jobs, learn to support themselves, and my blank checkbook will not be behind them a la carte. I will support their talents and dreams, but I am not babying them.

May 7, 2011

You're not a real man if you don't suffer. I'm going to make my kids practice flagellation every night so they can build some damn character.

Jun 29, 2011

2 answer OP question. I've heard that in regional offices you can save up to $20-40k depending on your situation with loans.

May 7, 2011

Ah, the memories of catholic upbringing are coming back to me...

May 7, 2011

IP, you have some twisted logic.

What if your kids start to crash and burn? Are you just going to stand by? I'm going to say no.

So what do you actually gain? If you raised your kids right and they're decent individuals then why saddle them with debt so early in life? If they start to crash and burn you're going to bail them out anyway.

May 8, 2011

Hi, I just wanted to hear more responses about the original topic question. This discussion about paying for state schools vs private schools is great, but I really would like to hear more responses pertaining to the OP. Thanks!

Banking.

May 8, 2011

I already broke it down for you MrV.

--
"Those who say don't know, and those who know don't say."

May 8, 2011

c. 45% of salary. No income tax.

May 8, 2011

How much is health insurance per month?

May 8, 2011
puax:

I made some money in college and it now pays dividend.

Oh I thought it was just from your salary. I'm finishing uni now and I have piled up somewhere around 35k euros so 50k$ or 30k pounds... not much in terms of income but it'll probably give me a buffer and some starting security so I wont have to save every penny I earn.

How are you generating your extra income? dividend stocks?

May 8, 2011

Wow, a bunch of complaints and comments on parenting from entitled college kids who have never worked for a living. This really says everything 95% of parents in the country needs to hear.

There probably won't be an effective student loan system in place in 20 years after the raft of defaults coming, so loans aren't something we have to worry about here.

May 8, 2011
IlliniProgrammer:

Wow, a bunch of complaints and comments on parenting from entitled college kids who have never worked for a living. This really says everything 95% of parents in the country needs to hear.

Not true. Some of us have worked just as hard, but that doesnt mean we all got as bitter as you have from the experience. You can rationalize it and say that your way is the only right way, but strong family support is important just as a great school is regardless of who pays for it. I find it that much more disturbing that knowing what its like to work hard and being on your own, you want the same for your kid... if anything you should be dedicated to giving your kid a better life... I dunno dude, whatever it is don't fuck up your kids because of traumatic experiences you've had... that would actually be wrong.

May 8, 2011
thor1000:

Not true. Some of us have worked just as hard, but that doesnt mean we all got as bitter as you have from the experience.

I'm not bitter about it- I'm grateful for the experience. I needed it going into the crash of 2008. People from private schools were getting hit with layoffs left and right, but I somehow managed to come out stronger. The take-a-number system was exactly what I needed. It is what my kids are going to need, too- all it took for me was a financial dislocation that was comparatively mild on a historical basis.

You can rationalize it and say that your way is the only right way, but strong family support is important just as a great school is regardless of who pays for it. I find it that much more disturbing that knowing what its like to work hard and being on your own, you want the same for your kid... if anything you should be dedicated to giving your kid a better life...

The way you get to a better life is hard work and long-term commitments. Look back through my family and each generation, you see someone moving up an economic class level. It comes from hard work and not taking things for granted. I do want my kids to have a better life than me- the only way they're going to be able to get that, though, is to learn toughness from state school, ROTC, or an armed services academy. It's simply the way my family's Y-chromosome works, going back at least three or four generations.

I dunno dude, whatever it is don't fuck up your kids because of traumatic experiences you've had... that would actually be wrong.

I know how to raise my kids better than you know how to raise them, thank you. If you want to pamper your kids, that's your choice. As for me, Sparta kicked Athens' butt in the Peloponnesian war, and it's what worked incredibly well for several generations in my family.

The armed services and state schools are great programs for meritocracy. We need to strengthen them and allocate more of the country's opportunities to them.

May 8, 2011

spend all my money on alcohol/drugs so i'll die when i'm 50 and saving isn't necessary. took you bitches to school on that one.

May 10, 2011
dt18:

spend all my money on alcohol/drugs so i'll die when i'm 50 and saving isn't necessary. took you bitches to school on that one.

lmao

Still I Rise

May 9, 2011

As one man famously said while wasted at an Ivy League fraternity clambake my senior year "does it count as saving when you don't take money out of your trust fund for a year and so the balance goes up due to like... stock rises and shit?!?"

what a silly, silly pledge.

May 12, 2011

This is hilarious. Like a boss:

International Pymp:

As one man famously said while wasted at an Ivy League fraternity clambake my senior year "does it count as saving when you don't take money out of your trust fund for a year and so the balance goes up due to like... stock rises and shit?!?"

what a silly, silly pledge.

May 9, 2011

My pay fluctuates but I save 1-2 grand per month that gets deposited into my brokerage account and I purchase a new stock. I go out to eat for a good dinner a drink or two almost every day and have a girl friend who I pay for dinner ~4 days a week... so I spend about 35k on food a year and probably another $5000 on booze. Rent is about $1800 a month. I also have zero debt and make sure to pay off my credit card in full every month.

May 9, 2011

$35k a year on food? Wow

May 9, 2011

Wow... Just think if you had saved that 75k instead of going to to eat... Was it worth it?

May 10, 2011
thekingwillwhip:

Wow... Just think if you had saved that 75k instead of going to to eat... Was it worth it?

It is definitely a lot of money to throw into your stomach but I look at it this way... I save time not having to shop for groceries, spend time cooking, and spend time cleaning the kitchen... and I am obviously not buying any groceries. So I have more free time, and it's not like you can cut your eating expense to 0$ so even if i cut back it probably be somewhere in the middle. I also consider eating out to be my greatest decadence and if you live in an expensive place like NYC and enjoy drinking and have a girlfriend who you pay for about half your dinners it's not that unreasonable to average $100 a day (a nice dinner with wine for two is rarely under $250).

Also, I have the advantage (or disadvantage depending on your perspective) of having wealthier parents so I don't really need to save up a big nest egg to avoid being bankrupt and homeless if I faced unexpected long term unemployment-- that being said I have saved enough to live 6 months at my current standard of living, and if i got laid off, I could easily cut back and live a year plus.

May 9, 2011

Trainwreck, choo choo chugga chugga choo choo. Allllllll aboooaard, the train to hell

May 9, 2011

IlliniProgrammer,

I respect your opinions in this thread and others, but let me offer you an alternative prospective through a personal anecdote:

I have a brother who is my age. We had the same upbringing and are interested in all of the same things. We're both "mathematically inclined" are have similar levels of intelligence. We grew up in a very wealthy family (annual income > $1MM). Anything we ever wanted, we got. When it came time to go to college, my dad just wrote the check no questions asked, for both of us. He gave us "spending money" and credit cards linked to his account with no guidance other than to be reasonable. My brother went to a state school to become an engineer while I went to a very expensive but very non-target private school to study computer science.

Fast forward five years after graduation. My brother has a good job making decent pay. He is happy with his stead in life and certainly independent enough to "make it" in the world. Meanwhile, I, through the same upbringing, am on track to be a millionaire by the age of 32. Despite being handed everything in life, I am very capable of managing everything that life throws my way.

So my point? Tough love isn't meant for everyone. I don't know if I would have been as successful had my dad not paid for my college and instead forced me to rough it out on my own. I also don't think one needs to pay their own way to recognize the value of hard work. I would hope that you would attempt to maximize your kids' potential through giving them opportunity rather than disadvantaging them in order to teach a lesson.

May 9, 2011

And to the original poster -- I did my investment banking years in the south, but I managed to save ~$80k (basically just saved significant portions of my bonuses). My rent was ~$1,200/month and I had car/insurance payments, etc. No student loans though (whew!)

May 10, 2011
CompBanker:

And to the original poster -- I did my investment banking years in the south, but I managed to save ~$80k (basically just saved significant portions of my bonuses). My rent was ~$1,200/month and I had car/insurance payments, etc. No student loans though (whew!)

Houston?

People tend to think life is a race with other people. They don't realize that every moment they spend sprinting towards the finish line is a moment they lose permanently, and a moment closer to their death.

May 10, 2011

saved about 65K after 2 years. this is for a middle office guy so bonus wasn't on par with banking.

some advice
- do be reasonable, but don't be afraid to take vacations/enjoy yourself (i prolly spent ~5K on vacations and random road trips)
- don't go models&bottles every weekend but again, don't be afraid to enjoy yourself. i probably budget ~300 dollars a month for going out.
- food is damned expensive. eating at home saves tons (i typically spend less than 15 dollars a day on food. again im MO so i don't need the afterhours dinners).
- rentwise, try to get a place in the 1100~1300 range. it's definitely possible especially if you have a bunch of roomates. midtown west and fidi have very good prices for their amenities.
- don't be stingy, especially with your friends/parents. i sent my parents on trips for their birthdays/anniversaries etc.

all in all, if I had been frugral I prolly could have saved another 20~30K, but IMO it's not worth it. as with everything in life, key is finding your balance.

IP, i definitely appreciate your posts and input and i do see your point of view with regard to having kids pay for their own education. i was parentally-funded through undergrad and but i supported myself through grad school and noticed a huge difference. let's just say i never missed a single class in grad school... however, while environment does play a factor in building someone's character, so does genetics. some people simply cannot survive and thrive under pressure and need a different form of parenting than just baptism by fire. you might say that it's darwinism, but would you really want to your kids having a potentially miserable life by being so inflexible?

May 10, 2011

i like how all these >50 post kids are coming out of the woodworks when theyre obvious trolls and dont have the balls to post or give any helpful information. this is why the site is going to shit and ive given up largely on posting and reading things here.

that being said my kid will probably pay for their own schooling and learn to do things on their own for the most part. most private schools are shit but if you get into a top tier then youll likely have the intellect to go to it.

and PS not all state schools are crap. if you are 'forced' to go to illinois over columbia then that is your own fucking retarded decision to not attend columbia with the price tag difference, not your fathers.

May 10, 2011

how do you guys not save at least 30 to 40k a year? I find that appalling... barring debt servicing, there literally isn't that much shit I could spend $ on

May 10, 2011

Rent can be a huge budget-killer. Some analysts come into the city spending $1000/month more on rent than I choose to, insisting on getting their own studio in a doorman building in Midtown. That's $12K/year on a post-tax basis.

As for me, I still enjoy drinking Shiraz that comes from a $12 1.5L bottle, living with a roommate, avoiding the 4% NYC resident tax, eating out a $15/plate restaurants, and saving the balance for hang gliding, or better yet, just sticking it into dividend stocks.

Start with a $1200/month budget for rent (OK, $1400 if you work in IBD and need to be close to work) and only scale that amount up when you've got the (sustainable) dividends to cover the difference. At some point, there's tax efficiencies to owning your own place, but don't get overexposed, and try to avoid the extra transaction costs a mortgage imposes.

May 10, 2011

Let's say your after-tax takehome pay is $80k

Rent: $1.5k x 12 = 18k
Lunch (1 meal/day since dinner is comped): $10 x 365 = 3.65k
Discretionary: 1k computer, 2k new TV/sound setup, 2k furniture? These are all one-time purchases
Phone/internet: 1k/year?
Clothes: ~$5k? but seriously no one needs to spend this much $ on clothes... I bought the majority of my stuff from Macy's but I also got quite a few Brooks Brothers shirts, jackets, and slacks. It ran me under $2k total for 10-15 dress shirts, 5 slacks, shoes, belts, and a few jackets
Other: $10k

That leaves you with 40k... and I pretty much overestimated on every single expenditure as well as $10k in random discretionary spending and one-time purchases (clothes, gadgets, furniture).

May 10, 2011

But some analysts insist on getting their own apartment- $2K+/month, not $1500. Add $6K.

Discretionary looks low. Also, dinners aren't always covered, and you're not counting weekend food, eating out, etc. This all adds up. And remember that $80K post-tax with NYC city and state taxes works out to a lot of money pre-tax.

May 10, 2011

Not sure if this is the case with all banks but when I was working this summer I was comped for both lunch and dinner on weekends

I ended up making $22k and worked so much that I only had time to spend 3-4k... we split bills when we went out and I didn't complain when the "baller" first years wanted to foot the entire bill on some nights

Also, I don't understand people who insist on living alone. I'm 21 and can't fathom the thought of living alone until I'm at least 25. The people my age who are living alone are either 1) incredibly and independently wealthy, 2) such pricks that they can't live with others / others refuse to live with them, or 3) borderline sociopaths.

May 10, 2011

where did you live? the bowery homeless shelter?

May 10, 2011

CompBanker - Grats on VP promotion.

May 10, 2011

Jesus, most of the kids on this board sound so spoiled and entitled. I would hate to hang out with people like you. Bitching about having to take out loans for college? Seriously? You should be thankful you even have that option, because most of the world is stuck in whatever situation they are born into. Most live and die poor.

Men here are pathetic and weak. You talk like you are kings of society but couldnt last 30 seconds in a fight with someone.

I dont really know what a "silver banana" is, but if I had one, I'd toss it to IlliniProgrammer because his comments have been right on. We're all trying to get a piece. If its really worth having, its worth working for.

May 10, 2011

hey IP, just chiming in on this one. Read your posts, and understand you. My grandparents both sides came from relative poverty in the UK (one from the roughest part of town there was). Education got them out of it, and they paid for me and my brother to have the best education possible, and not a penny on anything else (i had a job at university). I respect your opinion, but dont be so absolute. If your kid turns out to be a prodigy at something, and the only place that they would fit in you have to pay for, id be disappointed if they turned out any other way.

Back to the original poster, was saving around 1.5k a month (euros) off salary only. Not saving it for anything other than my next big spend (the Paris Dakar rally in a Bowler Nemesis)

May 10, 2011

.

May 11, 2011

i pay 1.9k a month for a 2 bed 2.5 bath 2 story 2 living room viking/sub zero/porsche designed kitchen (i have a roomie, rent and all utes comes to 3800 a month) a block away from columbus circle in a walk up. i spend less than 10 percent on rent (do maff suckas) and stash all the rest in the market

walk up > doorman suckas. not worth the premium to me.

May 11, 2011

Automatic deduction of 10% of salary into savings, 15% into 401(k). Bonus was shit (MM prorated) so not much savings there. Anyone have any input on whether this is high or low?

May 11, 2011

^^^ Do you get a match from your employer that you expect to vest? That should be included in an analysis. Also, does your employer normally pay out significant bonuses or have they moved to the more conservative post-2008 compensation model that many banks have moved to?

Saving 25% of your earnings would probably put you in the middle quintile of analysts. But if you're getting a 6% match from your employer, that might move you up to saving more than 60-80% of analysts.

May 11, 2011
IlliniProgrammer:

^^^ Do you get a match from your employer that you expect to vest? That should be included in an analysis. Also, does your employer normally pay out significant bonuses or have they moved to the more conservative post-2008 compensation model that many banks have moved to?

Saving 25% of your earnings would probably put you in the middle quintile of analysts. But if you're getting a 6% match from your employer, that might move you up to saving more than 60-80% of analysts.

Matching only comes at 1 year...got a few months to go on that. Bonuses have been well below street for some time, even before 2008. Were around 30% of base for 2010.

May 11, 2011

Hmm, I think that if you stick it out for the match, you're probably doing better than 60% of analysts. My first year, I think my net savings rate was something like 35%.

May 11, 2011

The reason that people pay for elite private education is because it's exceptional. If you look at the kind of teachers I had in HS (and in middle school, for that matter), you'd have trouble finding another set of instructors that talented and with those credentials at Harvard or Yale.

Tough love and making your kids pay for their own schooling is one way to go, but personally I'll spend 20k+ per year per child for my children's schooling from the age of 4 till 18, and then I'll pay for their ivy league UG and hopefully for their JD, MBA, MD, PHD, etc, as well. I'll pay for them to live comfortably while at college so that they can focus on learning and enjoying themselves until they are ready to enter the workforce after graduation.

May 12, 2011

Also - re: saving, I've found that it's the little things that add up and are just hard to plan around. For example, friends want to go out to a boozy dinner/pregame - that's usually at least $50 and sometimes closer to $100, and I'm not even talking about nice restaurants. No one plans on spending $100 for dinner on a Saturday night, but shit happens and you don't want to be the guy splitting hairs on whose entree cost $3 more than whose. Have that happen at least 4 times a month, then add drinks at bars for yourself, buying a few for friends, buying some for girls, maybe a few cover charges, taxis, etc. etc. Then brunch the next morning, which sometimes involves drinks, maybe go to a concert once every few months. Everything adds up.

I'm impressed with people that can be frugal and not go to weekend dinners with friends, but I find that fewer and fewer people are interested in sitting at home and pregaming with PBRs or something vs. going out places.

Anyway, NYC is damn expensive, and kudos to all of you who can save significant amounts of money.

May 12, 2011

Agree with Otter that once you graduate, hanging out at someone's apartment loses much of its appeal. It quickly becomes "which bar are we starting at?" or "I'm bored, let's meet up and grab dinner before we go out."

May 19, 2011
Comment
May 19, 2011
May 19, 2011
Comment

I think that we are all clinging to a great many piano tops...

May 21, 2011