I accepted an offer as a back office financial analyst at morgan stanley - if I got a JD from a top program (I went to a top business undergrad with 3.9 GPA and have a 175 LSAT so I think a top program is in my reach), how much could this degree help elevate me in the back office in terms of comp and moving up (whether I stay in finance or go more corporate lawyer route at a bank)?
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If you're looking to climb the ladder, do well on the job without getting the JD?
But advanced degrees typically do help..
How so? Figure out what you want to do. I dont think a JD or any advanced degree simply elevates anyone
2 years of experience helps more
talking ab JD
It’s not that simple. You need the right degree, from the right school, for the objective you are trying to achieve.
If you had a JD from a top law school, why stay in the back office?
Do the JD, focus on bankruptcy then jump to restructuring. You would be make more money, have a more interesting role and greater career opportunities.
This is the play. OP's rationale is so bad - if his statement that "but advanced degrees typically do help.." really were true, then might as well start having people get PhDs in history to "elevate you" for a career in banking lmao.
If he goes to a top business undergrad and wants to go into restructuring, he might as well just go for analyst positions from undergrad. JD doesnt seem worth it if you want to just go into finance
I am going to be blunt with you for your own good, no one gives a damn about a JD at a bank. It would make more sense to network with alumni in FO and hustle for the spot instead of going to law school.
This isn't true, T14 law school students can and sometimes do recruit for associate positions.
Key word sometimes. Sure it happens but there is a lot of survivorship bias that should not be taken at face value
This is NOT true.
JD is huge especially in leveraged finance. Wtf are you talking about?
Lev fin, rx, pe yeah yeah but compare the number of bankers that went straight from ug to lev fin and rx to the number of lawyers that pivoted and then account for how many lawyers are stuck on the other side of the table incapable of doing a bankers job that wanted to make the switch.
Really? I'm just not familiar with lev fin being on the RX side, but standalone JDs aren't super common in our practice (JD/MBA much more so). Just surprised to hear that lev fin would get a substantial amount of recruits from JD programs.
If you just want to get 'elevated', go the T10 MBA route. You've proven yourself worthy of a top LSAT score, the GRE/GMAT should be well within your reach. Only go to law school if you love love the law. Most lawyers say they wish they weren't lawyers. You can stay on the business side if you want.
So this is fairly simple, but you'd be surprised how many people don't really understand it:
DO NOT GO TO LAW SCHOOL UNLESS YOU WANT TO BE A LAWYER
You've got all of these questions about how it might elevate you in your current role or whatever. None of that matters. Do you want to be a lawyer, and what kind of law do you want to practice? Answer that question first because too many smart kids go to law school because they can't be bothered to ask themselves what they actually want to do.
delete
Glad other people recognize this. If you want to be general counsel, go ahead. If you have even the slightest hesitation, don’t do it. Why do you think so many lawyers seem like they’re always depressed?
with those stats you can go to harvard / yale / stanford law and to skadden after that... honestly you have a great shot at a full ride from a school like georgetown.
Most of these comments are complete bullshit. If you have a good legal background and want to stay in BO (many reasons to, and don’t let anyone tell you otherwise) you can have a super lucrative career in compliance. The opportunities and ability to move up the ladder quicker is available to those that have JDs.
As an attorney in a dual-hatted legal/compliance role, I agree. Compliance with a JD can be a good life. You move up the ladder more quickly, but more importantly, you're much less likely to hit a ceiling. Almost all Chief Compliance Officers (and obviously all General Counsels) I have known have been attorneys. On the plus side, work-life balance is pretty good. My team's standard workweek is 40 hours and anything above 50 is rare. The obvious downside, I don't make as much as my friends who are grinding it out in BigLaw, IB, or PE. However, I'm also less miserable than many of them. If I can make 75% of the pay for 50% of the work, I'm personally comfortable with that tradeoff.
I wouldn't necessarily advise away from it but it's also a matter of knowing what you're getting into ahead of time. It's not "super lucrative" but it can be very comfortable. I also wouldn't advise anyone take on debt to go to law school. Go to the best school you can for effectively free. Paying sticker, you'll be shackled by debt for the early parts of your career and then stuck in your firm's golden handcuffs while grinding to hopefully make Partner.
JD/MBA at a top program -> Top shop Rx Banker?
Idk, generally the "Don't go to law school unless you want to be a lawyer" advice is what I would advise. That being said you have a killer LSAT so I would agree that a top program is within your reach.
.
I always hear the mantra "don't go to law school unless you want to be a lawyer," but a lot of very successful leaders in industry, finance, and politics have gone the law route. Romney, Blankfein, Powell, Lew, Orszag, just to name a few. Most big names in politics as well. Many weren't necessarily lawyers, either.
So what's the beef? Curious.
In the 1960s to 80s when the folks mentioned above when to school (and really for most of American history), law school was seen as a natural next step for bright undergraduates who had basically any sort of liberal arts background. As a result of the diverse pool coming in, there was pretty wide distribution in terms of eventual career (academia, politics, finance, law). Also why so many older executives seem to have law degrees (Rubenstein, Blankfein, etc..).
Nowadays a JD is comparatively less versatile, hence the not repeated enough advice- only consider law school if you want to become a practicing lawyer.
Yeah, I see that, but I don't get why it now is considered "less versatile." Like what about the law degree changed.
Similarly, back then, it seemed that everyone had a liberal arts degree. Few people recommend that path now. But I have a liberal arts degree (in addition to a more useful degree) and have appreciated the level of thinking that it brought about-- much more so than my other degree. That's what attracts me to law school-- I find the type of critical thinking in that environment exciting.
Not sure if others have a different take, but I have no problem with the work that lawyers do. I took a few law classes in school and loved them. The problem that people run into is that most of the top laws schools send people to big law, which like banking, is a hard job, and burns people out.
So if you work in banking out of undergrad, and hate it, there are any number of possible options to go pursue. Lawschool not so much, and you've spent 3 years on schooling incremental to undergrad. People get stuck with debt (even though big law pays well), and they can end up being stuck doing something they hate.
The difference between law and b school is more of a selection bias. B school requires a few years of work experience, and, while most people in b school are clueless on career choices, I think a few years of work experience at least gives you an idea of what kind of work you enjoy.
So its not so much that being a lawyer sucks (the bankers > lawyers circlejerk is obnoxious), but that going to law school is a big commitment for a job that really is very hard (not a lot of people make partner for a reason). And that going into law school without thinking about what you want to do happens disproportionately more often than for other options.
Just my $.02
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