Are there investment banks known for having a less intense culture when it comes to the number of work hours?Something more reasonable like 60 hour work weeks, instead of 80-100?
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For sure, but they're typically really small boutiques. Examples of this in Chicago would be like Rush Street Capital, Pendo Advisors, City Capital, or other firms you likely haven't heard of. Be careful though, other small boutiques will give you reduced comp but still a full workload.
To be honest, even the MM banks here work their employees pretty damn hard (e.g., Baird, Lincoln, BGL etc.). In fact, they might be sweatier or as sweaty as their BB counterparts.
Stifel and William Blair might be two other options with decent hours.
Keep in mind I am a few years removed from IB and a lot of this is based on chatter from others, and it really only relates to the Chicago IBD scene.
Yes -- I'm currently at such a shop (small boutique). However, there is a direct correlation at my shop between lower than market comp and a "chill lifestyle". Not all shops price in hours worked the same.
Don’t go into IB if u want a job with chill hours. You can’t have both. We get paid what we get paid to essentially be available 24/7 and efficiently execute immense workloads.
If you’re looking for a chill finance job do Corporate Finance, FP&A, IR, etc.
Pretty delusional to say 60 hours a week is chill
80 hours is chill intern
Anything capital markets or public finance related is more chill
I have a friend who works/worked at PWP's fintech group, and boy is that what you call chill hours and good culture. Average ~60 hours / week, get paid within the same buckets as the other groups, and there's strong exit opportunities if you choose to leave (UMM exits in the past and and someone exiting for a Tech MF(ish)).
Makes me jealous esp when I work at a sweatshop churning 90+ hours for similar PE outcomes...
Out of curiosity, how is it possible to get good exits, good experience, and have good hours? Are the seniors just super efficient?
Can confirm - in a different group, but FinTech doesn't do shit. Alternatively, you can make any group you want not super sweaty by doing the bare minimum. Your bonus will suffer, but I don't really care. To the second dude's comment, you can still recruit and place very well even in a less "prestigious" group that doesn't do all that much.
What are the chances you get canned by doing the bare minimum?
Heard something similar about PWP’s tech SF group - pays extremely well, UMM/MF buyside exits with good hours… PWP as a whole is a good place to be at with better hours and culture vs comparable EBs like Moelis and Lazard.
On average across a lot of banks, I’d also say non-NY offices tend to be more relaxed with better hours and culture vs NY group counterparts
IB hours are so dependent on your team’s dealflow at that point. One week you could leave at 5 every day and then the next you’re pulling straight 3 AM nights all week.
Second this from my experience in IB so far
Left Lane
I work at a boutique. During live deals it can push the typical 80+ for sure. However, if nothing is super pressing typical days are 12 hours with very limited weekend work. Comp is around street with a smaller salary and larger than normal bonus (80-100%). Id say for all things considered its a pretty sweet set up.
The crappy groups at the mid tier or lower tier BBs are pretty chill. They make similar comp to the sweater groups via subsidy. But you get no deal reps and you get kinda stuck in no man’s land
TD Cowen. Deal flow is not super crazy and culture is great, so you can get good hours there. Heard comp is above street too.
Second this ^ made a similar post a couple months ago and this was on there a lot
It worked well for me - 1st year TC is around $190k and I think I averaged 50-60 hours, with a few bad stretches in between
Are you in a product group? Averaged ~90hrs a week and got paid significantly less
Consumer & Tech M&A believe it or not
This isn’t targeted at OP, more just advice for undergrad students about the job and the business. Undergrad students need to understand the realities of the IB world and the routes that the job creates. They also need to know that the IB world and corporate America in general are over romanticized. This is what no one in undergrad talks about or understands. Undergrad schools will continue to push IB onto students because it helps them by parading sexy bank logos and average graduate salary metrics. That is all fair. Students and IB prospects need not get caught up in that. Focus on the realities of the job and internationally decide what your goals are. Are you looking to cruise, coast, and walk into an average corporate job after a few years in IB and live the flashy NYC life? Or is your true goal to position yourself at nearly any cost to accelerate your career? I would argue that its about a 50/50 split at the analyst level in IB but many people are not honest with themselves. My best advice to a college freshman/sophomore/junior is deeply, deeply meditate on what life looks like after college and your goals. Don’t just assume you want to work long hours - it isnt about the time and everyone can easily say they can handle it. If you want to accelerate your career, the point of 2 analyst years and out is to sharpen your axe every single day. Are you willing to go to bed at 3 and wake up at 6 to hop on that next legal negotiation call? You are taking a 1:00 AM uber home, and halfway back you get an email from your MD asking for a book printed on their desk, are you immediately hopping out of the uber to walk back to the office to print? Are you able to wake up every day, no matter when you go to bed, and bring the energy, attitude, and sharpness of an eager beaver new first year? The point is not glory, fun, sleep, NYC West Village bars, work life balance, or anything. I’m not saying I like it and I bet you won’t either - but I believe the stone cold truth about IB is that if you are in the business, drive for 100 of the benefits. Reap the full experience - its 2 years of your life and you sharpen your axe every day. Taking the hell from your VPs-MDs builds you into a soldier. When you look up and go to interview duding your analyst years, your attitude, tenacity, mental fortitude, and sheer willpower will present themselves as rare, valuable assets. Having cold hard facts about your max-benefits-reaped analyst stint (best staffings, deals closed, efficiency, tech skills, modeling, responsibility management, etc) will accelerate the next step in your career. And then, do it again, and again, and your career growth compounds. If you study the best (truly self-made) athletes, the best trainers, the best entrepreneurs, billionaires, etc. none of them look back and say, oh yeah, I took the low road and i fell into this success. They live with a maximizer, growth-mindset worldview. Pouring passion into everything they do. Maximum input, maximum output. Define what being intentional means for you.
I heard laz real estate is like 40-60 hours and they sometimes travel to properties!
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