My thoughts, lmk what you guys think and why. Also any firms you see particularly rising to success in the coming 2 years (I think UBS and Guggenheim are promising imo).
Tech IB rankings (SF in order):
Tier 1: Q, MS Menlo, GS TMT (alot of core team left for Q and Evercore), JPM
Tier 2: Evercore, Lazard (the Dolins show), Moelis (Could be top of tier 2.5 but see everywhere with new build out, Auerbachs a real guy)
Tier 2.5: CVP, William Blair, BofA, Jefferies (picked up Ron Eliasek), Citi, Tidal*
Tier 3: LionTree, Raine, UBS (Basically now Barclays ex Freeland)
Tier 3.5: Rothschild, Guggenheim (More ERP deals recently), FTP, PWP , Barclays, RBC
Tier 4: PJT, Greenhill, DB, Piper/DBO, Harris Williams
Tier 4.5: Union Square Advisors, Oppenheimer, Lincoln Intl, Enfluence Partners, Cantor, Houlihan (Order is Irrelevant Here)
Where would you place ? :
- Lincoln Intl
- Union Square Advisors
- Enfluence Partners
Credit : turbo578
Bro what. Even after the departures Barclays is certainly above FT in the Bay Area. I know quite a few analysts at both banks and they shouldn’t even be in the same conversation.
Speaking from an ECM perspective, Barclays has been underperforming in the last few years. You will often see them in joint / passive bookrunner roles , alongside the likes of global balance sheet banks and strong tech middle markets.
Keep in mind, ECM positioning is particularly relevant when looking at the strength of healthcare and technology coverage teams.
What about all the discussion with the top MDs leaving (to UBS I think) ? And people saying Barclays is a mess on both coasts.
A note from 4mo ago said 3 Semiconductor MDs left. They've retained their Software/Internet guys but what deal flow are they having?
Qatalyst dominated the other tier 1s in 2023
— 1st year Q analyst
lmao 1 hour before 14B juniper Q sellside is announced what timing
Not an analyst at Q, just work at a BB in SF and almost every multi billion sell side I saw in 2023 was Q. Just run a deal screener on CapIQ and see for yourself
Deutsche SF is terrible.
Where would you rank it . And based on what , deal flow?
It’s tier 4 and yes they do nothing.
Q, MS, GS in that order
Gotcha
Oppenheimer Tech should at least be in a tier
Tier 4 , better than greenhill I assume? Not too sure
Yep, I think right in Tier 4 makes the most sense.
any updates on guggenheim?
Tech IB rankings (SF in order):
Tier 1: Q, MS Menlo, GS TMT (alot of core team left for Q and Evercore)
Tier 2: Evercore, JPM, Lazard (the Dolins show), Moelis (Could be top of tier 2.5 but see everywhere with new build out, Auerbachs a real guy)
Tier 2.5: CVP, William Blair, BofA, Jefferies (picked up Ron Eliasek), Citi,
Tier 3: LionTree, Raine, UBS (Basicaly now Barclays ex Freeland), Tidal
Tier 3.5: Barclays, Rothschild, PWP , Guggenheim, FTP
Tier 4: PJT, Greenhill, DB, Piper/DBO, Harris Williams
Tier 4.5: Oppenheimer, Cantor, Houlihan,
Better list. I'm wondering if WB is above BofA / Jefferies / Citi though.
And I think HL may be too lowly ranked here, imo
It seems like JPM is gaining momentum. Combined with their fortress of a balance sheet and the overall movement in the sector (ie bankers moving firms), I wonder if you think it’s appropriate to include JPM in Tier 1
Agreed.
If MS Menlo is tier 1, then JPM should be too. They are everywhere nowadays. When IPOs start picking back up maybe that will change and MS MP will reclaim its glory, but they just posted a huge turd for bonuses today
What is MS Menlo Park good at? Curious because I'm aware of a few post MBA tech founders who did their summer internships or pre-MBA IB stint there.
They dominate tech IPOs
I’m looking at this from a sell side m&a perspective with a bias towards software as that’s where I work and have spent last 8 years of my career. Blair out competes Citi and BoA in this area. Chris lane is a solid banker and they have robust sponsor market share. The big deals that boa or Citi get on, they aren’t leading and are just getting a tip for financing. Really don’t see houlihan SF anywhere but could be wrong as I don’t compete in that area of the market that often
Gotcha. That definitely makes sense, and I appreciate the insight.
Where would you place RBC on this list if you dont mind me asking?
Rbc is probably tier 3.5 towards the end. They lost their good software bankers to Citi a couple years back and haven’t really been that active. A lot of the M&A they get is financing relationships. They do have a few solid fintech bankers though. I think I have maybe competed against them once or twice in last 4 years
Agree with this. BoA lost some team-members to CVP (who are also struggling incidentally).
.
To your question on Barclays being successful. Freeland is a great security banker but they have struggled to build a team around him. The truth is that any bulge bracket bank will be decent in the future as it’s probably one of the most stable MD positions in banking if you are looking to make 1-2m a year with a bit of upside. These banks have huge financing relationships that basically provide them some level of m&a fees but outside of GS and MS and a couple of JPM guys the real M&A bankers don’t stay at these shops cause the tax is too high if you are a real producer.
Could see PJT moving up in tiers in the coming years with the recent pickups of legendary software bankers, but their team is still too small right now to really compete
Where is BMO Tech?
Havent heard many talk about their SF office. Where would you put them?
Non-existent. The MDs they had are there no longer (Kratus runs KeyBank, Lee at Deutsche, Talwalker at BofA etc. etc.)
BMO in SF is the Christopher Marlowe, FSG show
how is citi doing recently with the new software hires in 2022? any potential to move up in the BBs now that Barclays, CS, and BofA lost a lot of seniors
Citi definitely made a few strong hires over the past year for their software group and has picked up some major sell-side mandates, but have heard they're extremely understaffed at the analyst level with basically a 1:1 MD to analyst ratio. Their broader TMT team is verticalized down to the analyst level (software, internet, semiconductor, IT services, fintech, comms), so would imagine the software analysts getting some great deal reps but horrible WLB if they maintain this team structure.
Nonetheless, their software group is much stronger than the other sub-groups like internet, semiconductors, or IT services so should try your best to place into the software group if you're a new analyst there. Will get you much better deal experience and PE exits, but expect to get absolutely crushed in terms of workload assuming they maintain the same MD to analyst ratio.
Have a friend in the tech group and heard much of the same about Citi's software team. They've grown their presence significantly in software M&A over the past years especially after poaching some rainmakers from JPM/CS/BAML, but can't say the same about their semiconductor or internet teams.
Citi's IBD as a whole has shifted their focus from traditional, asset-heavy industries like industrials and P&U towards growth sectors like software. They now have ~10 MDs in the software group, whereas the other TMT teams like semiconductors or IT services have only 1 MD. Don't think they even have 10 analysts on the software team so agreed that they're very much understaffed at the analyst level, but the software analysts are definitely getting great deal experience. Yet again, very different story for their tech teams outside of software.
If you're an incoming SA / FT looking at their tech team, would note that your experience and exit options will be extremely group-dependent based on which sub-group (software, internet, semis, IT services, fintech, etc.) you'll verticalize into. Their software group is by far the best in terms of deal-flow and exits, as 90% of Citi tech's M&A deal flow comes from their software group. WLB is horrible at the analyst level for software just given the lean deal team structures, but they've sent analysts into top buyout shops like Silver Lake, Thoma Bravo, Elliott Management PE, Hg Capital, TA Associates, and Permira, as well as value-oriented PE funds like STG, HIG, and Platinum Equity. The internet group, in contrast, does almost no M&A and is more focused on ECM, with much better WLB if that's what you're looking for. The semiconductor and IT services teams have only 1 MD and don't seem to be the group's focus. Don't know how the verticalization process works but would try your best to place into the software group if you can.
f
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Move LionTree up
Why? And to where?
Is Piper/DBO that low? I thought they did some big deals in the past.
Great banks for that reason, but the rankings are relative ofcourse.
On top of the tiers, the distinction between T1 and T2 is blurred because BBs and EBs are not directly comparable. Also, each bank in T1-2 is quite different in its own ways.
.
.
Definitely. But i think the goal of these rankings would be to provide a perspective the prospects looking for the best company overall when considering :
Comp, exit opps, and deal flow within tech.
Each bank has their own unique set of pros and cons for sure though
.
CVP should be around tier 3 or 3.5 since they seem to be struggling since the shakeup with seniors to Tidal. But even with those seniors I wouldn't compare Tidal to LT or Raine given how new they are. Would move LT to 2nd tier if basing on the other TMT banks. PJT could be moved up to 3.5 if the software group works out
Great organizations:
Tier 4
Tier 3
Tier 4
USA at tier 3? Interesting.
What are some reasons you’d say so?
And i agree for the other two firms
Any info on WF? I know they’ve got an office out here, I imagine it’s not great but curious if it’s the type of place I could potentially lateral from and potentially recruit off-cycle
bump this, would also like to know
WF SF is the worst of the satellite offices. Terrible culture and it doesn’t do anything.
Source?
Would say 4
DC Advisory?
should ubs really be that high up in any of the rankings here
e: thanks for the ms ubs sf intern
The credit suisse deal hasnt fully materialized. They also swept Bofa PA and Barclays guys on both coasts i believe
Think theyre a solid shop with a lot of upward trajectory imo. Would love to hear other opinions
Is SF Laz actually good? I heard many mixed reviews about them, especially from past posts.
Good deals and elite exits, probably not as strong as NYC though
Any thoughts on BAML for both coverage and M&A?
Where does Lincoln land in all of this? Heard their head of tech sits there.
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