Transfer from Lower Target to Higher Target
I know this sounds insane, but my parents want me to transfer from a lower target (Cornell/Brown/Dartmouth) to a higher target (Harvard/Princeton/Yale). They think it will boost my chances significantly, but I don't think this is true and would rather intern/network. How do I deal with this situation? PS. Also, for my own knowledge, is there really any difference in recruiting between a lower and higher target?
Bro your already at a target with an extensive alumni network. if you take the right steps you’ll be able to get plenty of intern experience and be set for full time. I’m making it work at a non-target. you’ll be perfectly fine where u are.
No difference at all especially when you are already at a target. Just use your time to intern/network
Please, don't. I wouldn't even consider it unless you are at Cornell. (I personally think Dartmouth and Brown are severely underrated on this forum when factoring in student interest and size). At all these schools, get good grades, have an interesting story, network well, and get some internships and you'll have a great shot at a bulge bracket- maybe even buy-side if you are lucky.
There is a stigma associated with transfers, like it or not. Alumni are slightly less keen to talk with you, and friendships have already been made. You won't be able to make as many meaningful connections in college and that will result in a weaker network down the road. People will see that you transferred from a low ivy to high ivy and assume you are materialistic and prestige obsessed. Alumni from your current school will assume you think you're too good for them, and alumni at your future school will think you weren't smart enough to get in as a freshman. I currently go to USC/Berekley and probably wouldn't transfer to Harvard if I had the chance.
Are they more prestigious- no question.. But there are more Cornell grads at Goldman than Princeton and Yale combined (around equal at 600 actually). And more Dartmouth grads at GS (per graduate) that Princeton and Yale.
Unless you are truly miserable at your current school and don't have any friends- I wouldn't do it. There is a slight difference in recruiting- while the placement numbers are roughly the same student interest in finance at Princeton/Yale is lower than at Dartmouth/Cornell. So you will have more competition at your current school. But that could also be a good thing since you'll have more college friends in the industry 25 years from now..
Graduate in the top 5% of your class, be sociable, network, and work hard and you'll be working at GS, MS, JP Morgan, CS, BofA 3 years from now
Graduate top 5%? What? I was under the impression that you just have to be above average if you’re at a target and that almost everyone who want IB gets it.
I don’t think that’s correct. Top 5% isn’t required, but you’d still need to have a 3.6 or above for most firms, which probably would be top 30-40% at most schools (a bit above average), with adjustments on the GPA requirement for places like Princeton which have substantial deflation.
I don’t think it’s fair to say that anyone who wants IB gets it. I’m not going to offer up a guess at the % that are able to get offers, but even from the top targets — Wharton, Harvard, Princeton, it’s not as high as you would think in terms of percent going to BB / EB banking. At Yale which is the one I’m more familiar with, it would be even lower.
As a point of reference, at my semi-target, we placed around 10-12 people a year into known banks out of a pool of around 40-50 recruiting for those roles, so about 20-25%.
do many nontarget kids think this is what recruiting is like at a target? lmao
5% may have been an exaggeration. Above a 3.5 in generally the rule- so that places you at top 40% of Yale or whatever to be considered for any BB. To have a solid shot, you need a 3.7 and then also factor in the 5 banks I listed are generally considered the very best.
Id say its more like top 10% and some recruiting effort
your parents are retarded
What year are you in school and are you at Cornell or one of the others you mentioned (Dartmouth / Brown). I don't really know much about the transfer process, how long it takes etc, but I would only really consider this if you're at Cornell, and even then I don't think it really makes sense. Assuming you've just finished your freshman year, by the time you transfer I guess you would be 2nd semester sophomore year? I would imagine this will leave you behind the ball on networking / recruiting, and just as a general rule of thumb I wouldn't suggest transferring. The people I've seen do it ended up in a sort of limbo with frankly weaker relationships at both schools (their earlier school and the newer one). If it is a huge leap up then sure, but you're already at a good school, just do your best there and you won't have an issue breaking into any industry.
Cornell does really well in recruiting, so if that's the school you go to then you are not using their alumni network/OCR resources at all
Seconding what was said above, Cornell's placement is very strong. Every BB (except CS/DB), and most EBs come on campus and take top prospects out to dinners/coffee chats in addition to firm-wide events. Transferring makes no sense at all for any for the schools you listed, including Cornell.
I dont go to Cornell
Lots of good responses above on why you shouldn't transfer. IMO the only reason you should is if you hate it at your current school and have no friends there.
No, that's not the case. (Or at least I don't think my social situation will become a ton better if I transfer lol)
If you can’t get an IB/Consulting job from Cornell, it won’t be Cornell’s fault. I can’t imagine the type of parents who would encourage transferring from Cornell just cause it’s a “lower” ivy.
Go to a ‘lesser’ ivy so I can weigh in- if you can’t land a top finance job from one of these schools, it’s your fault, not your school’s fault. You will have 99% of the same opportunities available to a HYP grad available to you- there might be 1-2 firms that only recruit from HYP, but every single BB/EB or top PE firm will take apps from all ivys.
If you hustle from a Dartmouth/Brown/Cornell, you can absolutely land GS TMT, PJT RX, or whatever you think the best possible internship/job is. Save the time on transferring and instead network and study technicals and you will be completely fine.
Agree 100%. The number of opportunities that are available at schools you consider a "lesser ivy" are insane. It is up to you at the end of the day to do well.
This was what I was thinking as well.
Agree, I would add that at a certain threshold- its your fault and not your schools. While Goldman TMT may be reserved for ivies and Stanford- at most semi-targets GS, JPM, MS is achievable with some effort.
Blaming a semi target, never mind a LOWER IVY, for not being prestigious enough to get you into your dream firm is immature and stupid
?? there are a ton of nontargets at Goldman TMT, just look on LinkedIn. A quick glance and I see representation from UIUC, University of Maryand, Penn State, SMU. definitely not just "reserved" for Ivies or Stanford.
For NYC, SF offices? Direct out of college? I'd be surprised- would have to have crazy connections...
Why are people shitting on Cornell so much here? It’s not Columbia/Dartmouth level but they do absolutely fine in recruiting and always place well...
priority is yes getting internships learning shit etc. and transferring should be a side thing.
should you fail, you’ve built actual tangible things that will still help. nothing wrong with trying and you have more than enough time actually. lot of people will tell you won’t but you can do it (I did, but transferred from a non target).
If you are serious and make it a goal you’ll find out how much time you really have in a day. At the same time, who cares (you’re in a good enough spot). if the goal is easier to get better job, try but don’t care too much.
if it’s insecurity, chasing the bigger Apple, etc. go for it and you’ll probably fail but it can happen. good luck.
If you can't get an IB job out of Brown/Cornell/Dartmouth, it's you and not your school that is the problem.
Yea dude, if you can't land a gig from a "lower tier" Ivy, it is a you problem.
Related question: Would it make sense for me to transfer from Georgetown to a better target? Also, is Georgetown roughly on par with Brown/Cornell/Dartmouth?
Georgetown definitely punches above its weight with respect to placement. Much stronger than I expected. Very well connected alumni network. Definitely in the same tier or thereabouts (from a placement perspective).
Do it only if you want a boost to your ego or if you are extremely unhappy. HYP will definitely give you a boost but probably not by as much as your parents may think.
I went to Cornell (AEM). Picked it over Dartmouth and another school “ranked” above it (think Duke, UChicago, Northwestern). Granted, money was a consideration for me but even then, many people on here would have called me a moron (I'd argue the three schools that get shat on the most by this website are IU, NYU, and Cornell).
I can assure you that if you want a banking job, even from lowly Cornell, you should be able to get one if you put in some modest form of effort. My parents worked really hard to save up the money to send me to school and I had zero connections entering school so I didn't take anything for granted. I took a bit of a head start on the prep and busted my ass off and ended up getting a job offer at the first bank I interviewed with and took it. I probably didn't need to do that (and there were a lot of kids who honestly didn't deserve those jobs who got them) but the point is, if you really want that job, you'll have the opportunity to land it. There definitely are a lot of people gunning for finance but nowhere near as many as the people on here crack there out to be - even in the business school (200-250 kids per class), about 50% go into finance (probably half of those go into PWM, S&T, research, corp fin, etc.).
Dartmouth has a very strong alumni network and is a small school. Will give you a very good chance at landing a gig at GS/MS. If you can't get a banking job from Brown, then there's a serious problem because everyone talks about how little interest in finance there is (people are more focused on consulting). While it may come off as a bit of a Cornell rant, the point is that even at the most "inferior" of the three schools, you should find yourself in a pretty good spot.
Good luck!
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