hey! was wondering for an incoming 2027 whether there's a large difference in analyst experience / exit opps between Wells and UBS?
i know that wells has a ton of momentum and UBS has the legacy reputation
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UBS still had various UMM/MF exits from some groups, think all of Industrials / LevFin / Tech had more than 1 UMM + PE exits with other groups like consumer, FIG, and M&A having one UMM exit too. Would still think UBS exits better though WF as a platform is clearly performing better.
Completely wrong, look up any reputable league table, talk to anyone in the industry, or talk to any recruiter.
The answer is clearly Wells Fargo over UBS.
You are comparing #6 in the Americas (Wells) to outside the top 20 in the Americas (UBS)
https://www.lseg.com/en/data-analytics/products/deals-intelligence/glob…
I’d honestly pick anyone inside the top 20 over UBS. Higher league table rankings means more deals to put on resume and more higher value deals you could talk to for exit ops
Agree if you mean the M&A league tables rather than going to some debt mill like bnp or MUFG
bump
Wells 10x better, UBS failing fast
WF is paradise
Wells Fargo for sure imo.
UBS doesn’t do/lead any real deals anymore and has a terrible culture now. Wells has crazy growth and does mega deals
Pick Wells — avoid this shit storm of a bank (UBS Associate).
Wells
Wells pays way better than UBS
Think of UBS as performing similar to Lincoln international now in the US
I’ve been in several corporate environments and UBS is by far the worst managed of them all
Heard a rumor they will completely exit US IB when the new CEO comes and are exploring lease options to downscale Manhattan footprint
WM side not too happy they have to subsidize IB pretty much every year
is this real? wow
Wells for sure, UBS is a value trap
In terms of exits... Clearly UBS? Wells shills crazy
Like obviously I would want to go to Wells for growth etc etc, but right now in terms of exits at top group at UBS vs Wells its clearly UBS
Hi Marco, everyone sees through you shilling UBS when they aren’t even top 20
Really group and city dependent. If you’re at a top group at both you would probably look slightly more attractive to headhunters at UBS.
The issue with wells if that you could end up in groups that are not investment banking at all so thread carefully as placement is particularly competitive.
The illusion of “headhunters say so” is completely wrong, look at real data. If you spoke to any they would set you straight. This isn’t your Dads UBS anymore
Ask your friends at wells how many got on-cycle offers a few weeks ago, you can also look at exits from last year for both banks and you can see who clearly placed better (even from some groups that would be considered weak)
I mean the data is out there I don’t think we need to get emotional about it it’s just a job lol not your football team
The pros for UBS are slightly better exit opps and slightly better brand (they’re known as a BB, wells is not), but the gap is narrowing for both.
All other things lean Wells. Better pay, better culture, more efficiently run, stronger leadership, etc. Wells is a better place to grow a career in IB imo.
It's a bit of the blind leading the blind on WSO.
As someone that interviewed almost a thousand ibanking analysts at this point, here's the truth.
No one's denying that Wells Fargo is probably a more stable institution, even for US "investment banking" and I put that in quotes which includes a decent DCM and Levfin group given the balance sheet. But as with most things in life, nuance and context are key.
As a senior Director or above, go with Wells Fargo and you'll clip $600k - $800k and probably get to raise a family in Charlotte and you can take advantage of what all the above posts throw around with charts and visualizations, which is league tables and pitch decks in order to live well and support kids.
Now for an analyst or 22 year old, think about what your goals are. If you are 100% sure you want to be a lifelong banker and you don't like interviewing and especially if you like Charlotte, you can prob choose Wells. Everyone else should choose UBS if they want the 2 year program for its main use case which is exit opportunities to either lateral to a better program (Evercore, GS, MS) or to the buyside.
This is because of two major things. When hiring analysts, no one cares about league tables as that doesn't affect the QUALITY of the analyst. We care about strong corporate ramp-up so that newly hired associates don't embarrass the seniors in meetings, and financial modeling training so you can grind and do your job before you head off to an MBA program or lateral once again.
Here, a quick screen on LinkedIn for ex-UBS alums can show you how important it is to network with thousands of people especially if you want to stay in the NYC area. The decades of exit opps via those who went before you takes a long time to dissipate, even if the bank itself is a former shadow of its 2000s hayday.
Since most analysts care about exit ops and networking into the buyside or a better position for their 24-30 career age, you'd be better off going to UBS and explaining how you worked your ass off to learn as much as you could from a legacy institution that still has a strong IBD process vs. what many older managing partners on the buyside still think of Wells Fargo, which is that it's a successful commercial and retail bank.
Do what you want as it doesn't affect me whatsoever, but I think the cross-admit in real life also proves this point despite all the negativity online about either bank.
Not at either firm but could speak from my own experience and 20+ years on Wall Street.
Wells is the better platform than UBS across any career level given its stronger U.S. franchise, a cleaner identity with clients, and more reliable internal mobility and long-term outcomes.
For analysts, the whole “UBS for exits, Wells if you want to be a lifer” line is backwards. If you want exits, you want a brand that consistently reads as U.S. banking plus balance sheet power plus credibility with corporates. Wells gives you reps in products that matter, real client relationships, and a pipeline that doesn’t depend on some “legacy halo” arguments from 20 years ago. UBS in the U.S. is still, to most people, a Swiss wealth manager with an IBD wrapper, and pretending that some old “LinkedIn alumni density” is a substitute for being in a stronger seat today is cope.
For Asos and VPs/Directors , Wells is even more clearly better. It has more stability, clearer lane to responsibility, and less internal identity crisis. You’re not trying to explain what UBS U.S. IBD actually is every time you talk to someone, and getting surprised looks when you talk about their IBD. You’re executing in a bank that the market already understands.
For EDs and MDs, the poster admits Wells wins, then tries to carve out a UBS exception for 22-year-olds using buzzwords like “process” and “legacy institution.” That’s not nuance. That’s spin. If Wells is the better place to be when outcomes matter most and comp is real, it’s also the better place to build the foundation that gets you there.
Wells is way better than UBS across all career levels. The rest of that post is just someone trying to sound authoritative while quietly arguing with their own conclusion.
This is spot on. I’ll contribute one additional example in response to the main thrust of the original commenter.
Via my sellside seat, I have worked closely with four buyside associates who recently left UBS (all of which completed the UBS analyst program). One of the associates was proficient. The other three admitted that they had never worked on a live deal before joining the buyside (!!!) and had skills that matched:
So in short - agreed that “what you know” is what actually matters. But it appears that recent changes at UBS might be seriously impairing their analyst program.
Makes sense but the proof is in the pudding when it comes to recruiting.
You're a MD in IBD, so I agree with your perspective.
I work at a large UMM PE fund. We've had ZERO wells fargo analyst hires. We have a few UBS.
Will end it there but I would recommend people use LinkedIn instead of listening to message boards as it's harder to misrepresent your career when people's legal names are attached to their profiles.
Lehman Brothers, Bear Sterns, Wachovia and Credit Suisse also had great reputations in IB…
UBS has been the worst decision of my life.. bad culture, bad exits, bad deal flow, bad people. Everything gets worse every month.
I had multiple offers and choose UBS. I regret that decision every day and it haunts me
what did you pick ubs over?
I have college buds at UBS trying to lateral to Baird…pick WF
UBS SA return offer rates are set to be 30-40% this year. Source: UBS Director in Industrials.
Makes sense, the group is bloated. I would expect ~50% return rate this summer bank wide.
If they are unwinding the US IB return rates could be as low as 10%-25%
Post CS acquisition, UBS went to shit. It used have an okay culture with a reasonably sustainable lifestyle but now it’s devolved into an incredibly toxic sweatshop where you’re constantly overworked and worried everyday about getting canned. Not to mention, the good MDs/EDs/ASOs/ANs all left so now it’s stuck in a doom loop with 1) toxic H1B hardos 2) incompetents 3) DEI hires who can’t/don’t do shit (especially the ex-CS ones). Your bonuses are shit, and go to subsidize non revenue generating MDs who don’t bring in fees (mostly ex-Barclays nepo hires) and groups like TMT who don’t do real deals. So as an analyst, the cycle gets worse and worse, your practical deal experience is shit, the culture is shit, the people are shit and you’ll be lucky if you can exit anywhere. The “good” exits from groups are from people who had elite credentials/network already who would likely have strong exits already. And the exits have been getting worse and worse every year. At UBS, you get all the negatives from investment banking (hours, pressure, toxicity) with none of the positives (deal experience, comp). Genuinely regret joining this bank every day and counting down the days until I can leave. Anyone who willingly joins UBS as an analyst today is genuinely braindead and deserves the pain and deadend career which will haunt them for the rest of their life.
I wouldn’t choose UBS for a 2 year analyst program you won’t get a live deal unless you are one nepo WASP hire
Marco and his gang of 8-10 loyalists did the equivalent of a white collar heist. Get all your (mostly incompetent) buddies massive paydays while driving the IBD performance into the ground
UBS has fallen off a cliff. You can argue the legacy brand still makes it slightly more attractive than Wells, but that’s not a place I’d want to work at right now. Their IB division is an absolute mess.
I was at CS, which became UBS, and then left. I honestly have no idea what UBS plans to do with their US investment bank. Too many of the heavy hitters have left and have not been replaced. Too much uncertainty. The situation you do NOT want to be in is where you're "in" investment banking but not really since you're only staffed on pitches because you're not winning mandates. If you want to go buy side, or even lateral somewhere later, the conversation is going to be about what deals you've actually worked on. I was fortunate that I had a couple MDs that I worked for who did bring in deals so I had things to talk about, and funny enough they left shortly after I left.
5 years ago I'd say UBS hands down over Wells Fargo, and now I say the reverse. Wells Fargo has been making moves and UBS I honestly have no idea what their plans are. At the very least if you go to WF and hate it, you at least likely are going to get some live deal experience that will better set you up to lateral if you need to, but you also might like it.
Wells 'Drake Maye" Fargo
Purely anecdotal and not meant to sway your opinion but I feel obligated to share the below every time someone brings up WF.
Wells Industrials ran the single worst SS process I have ever been a part of. The senior bankers who ran that process should exit the industry, it was truly pathetic. How did they get chosen, surely they did something right in the bake off, no? No, there was no bake off, WF was their commercial lender, so they went to them for M&A services as well, you cannot make this shit up
WF has growing pains. Some of the MDs who came over in recent years from GS, Credit Suisse, elsewhere are very good. Some of the legacy Wachovia ones couldn't run a lemonade stand. In aggregate the firm is making the right moves. That said, there is some dead weight that needs to get tossed as the firm works through its growing pains
Helpful context, can confirm the several MDs on the deal were all Wells lifers, had been there 20+ years. Its possible they were just phoning it in but looking back on it they really dropped the ball in several areas.
Damn with all that said imagine how much worse UBS is given Wells has significantly more US M&A revenue
Which vertical?
What did they do wrong?
If the groups are different, pick the stronger group over the bigger name. In IB, deal reps and team culture will matter more than the logo when you recruit later. I’d ask current analysts about live deal flow right now, how staffing works, and whether seniors protect weekends.
Analysts will lie research press releases from that banks group for deals announced. If the only example they give you is mid, assume that’s the groups landmark deal
True that’s a good reality check People will usually highlight the best deal they touched, even if it wasn’t that meaningful. It helps to look at press releases and recent mandates then compare that with what analysts are saying. If everything lines up that’s a good sign. If not it’s probably worth being cautious.
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Hey! Both have their perks. Wells Fargo might give you more deal flow and hands-on experience early on, while UBS carries strong brand recognition and can open doors for future exit opportunities. Honestly, it depends on what you value more—volume and learning versus prestige and network.
UBS has none of that, stfu ai slop
At a UMM (15bn+ in fund size), we did not interview nor give offers to WF analysts, we did for UBS. Take that as you will.
Your UMM fund must be full of idiots
Top quartile returns suggest otherwise. I understand you probably work at WF; but it is what it is. Seniors and HH's don't regularly change which banks they want to hire from for better or worse.
Wells for sure, UBS is collapsing (source: I work there)
Rumor they have a massive short on Silver and might legit collapse for real
that massive short paying off now
If in the US I would go for Wells. Large bs at least gives them a seat at the table with clients. Their Hudson Yards office is also quite nice.
Buyside perspective: As someone who worked at UBS as an Analyst in a coverage group, did only one sell-side deal and the rest just random financings and pitch work, I got interviews at most buyside firms. Also left in the middle of the CS merger so take it with a grain of salt.
Was it because UBS name or bulge-bracket legacy? I don't know. But are Wells Fargo Analysts getting interviews at $5bn+ hedge funds or $5bn+ PE funds? I don't know either, but I don't see many Wells Fargo guys in PE.
If you want to be a banker, go to Wells. But something to be said about brand, being in NYC, with institutional support. But banking analysts and people love to complain and their vent on online forums. Just go do your diligence, talk to recent analysts / former analysts, and get the facts and information yourself.
From what I’ve seen, Wells gives slightly more hands-on deal exposure early on, while UBS has the bigger brand and global network. Exit opps aren’t massively different, just depends on your long-term location goals.
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