20 Company Interviews Later...No FT Offer looking for Advice

I need some advice. I'm a recent graduate from a nontarget looking for FT roles. About me: sub 3.5 overall GPA, Over 3.5 finance GPA. Was in school's honors program for finance majors. Did some IM work. Received school's highest honors for finance majors. FO IB experience at top MM bank in strongest group last summer. Furthermore, my resume has been reviewed by people in industry, so it's 100% crisp. Now that I've introduced my background, I can delve into my current problem.

I've been pretty good at getting interviews. I've also gotten to final round about 95% of the time. I've interviewed with HFs, top IM shops, and even BBs (made it to final round for most of them). All in all, I have interviewed with about 20 companies. I send follow up/ thank you emails and yet no offer. I ask for feedback, but no one ever seems to have any. I've done mocks with my career center, did interview stream, and even used career coaches. Every time I get a call, it's always the same thing from HR "You know they [the interviewers] really loved you, but there was ONE candidate who they decided to go with."

I've also had multiple instances when HR said that we would like to keep you in the pipeline for future opportunities and I get emails with the personal contacts of the recruiters. I'm definitely thankful for being able to stay connected, but a job opportunity 2 or 3 years down the line does not pay for my college loans now.

I recognize that fit is really important...that's the reason I didn't get a return during my previous summer role. But how do I fix myself? I'm getting interviews that I know people would KILL for, and yet I'm not closing. Why? What's wrong with me? I know it's a numbers game. But I feel like with all the opportunities, I've had in my hand, I'm just one big fuck up. Advice would be amazing and great...

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Comments (166)

Jun 20, 2014

Anyone who graduates college without a FT offer in hand has like a .05% chance of getting an investment banking job.

The large banks have already extended offers to juniors and seniors, and the small banks only take on people with 2+ years of relevant experience.

It's time to move on to something more your speed.

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Jun 20, 2014

Shhhhhhh.... lol

Jun 20, 2014

I could have gone with the classic "never give up" but I think the other 100,000 clueless undergrads on here could use some motivation/pressure.

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Dec 18, 2015
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Jun 20, 2014

I was tempted to respond with:

"I know its a little late in the game to start looking, but I was really hoping there would still be time to land an internship this summer at (Insert the finance equivalent of Cravath), OP what is your secret for landing these interviews??"

But I am turning over a new leaf and trying to be more positive.

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Jun 20, 2014
ArcherVice:

I was tempted to respond with:

OP what is your secret for landing these interviews??"

I've submitted well over 300 job applications, and I've been networking since freshman year. Also, I've been doing informational interviews, attending conferences, reaching out to alums, cold emailing people/calling people and using my career center.

Jun 21, 2014
ItzWhitneyBItch:
ArcherVice:

I was tempted to respond with:

OP what is your secret for landing these interviews??"

I've submitted well over 300 job applications, and I've been networking since freshman year. Also, I've been doing informational interviews, attending conferences, reaching out to alums, cold emailing people/calling people and using my career center.

Likely it's something with you. Got a speech impediment or something?

Jun 20, 2014
Mr. Hansen:

Likely it's something with you. Got a speech impediment or something?

No speech impediment or any physical deformities.

Jun 21, 2014

There has to be something that you're not doing right. 0/20 are pretty bad odds. Something obviously isn't right.

Jun 22, 2014

I have a pretty much identical story to yours. I have decent experience and a good school on my resume and have completely struck out after final round interviews. Probably similar numbers to yours.

Ive had final round interviews with IB, PE, and ER since graduation so I think it definitely is possible to land a FO job after graduation. I think your in a similar predicament as me, been so close to great FO jobs that it makes it hard to take a BO/MO job, but at the same time I dont know how much longer I can take being unemployed. It would just suck to take a job i dont want, due to the fact that I spent so much money to go to the great school I attended.

Ive been interviewing/applying for everything at this point. IB, Valuation/TAS, ER, Corp Fin, PE, Consulting, S&T. Sucks dude, hope you land something soon.

Jun 22, 2014

Damn, that is a scary situation to be in. I pray to God that you are exaggerating some of those numbers, if not it could definitely be that you are robotic or that you give off an off putting vibe. You mentioned fit, so that's the first thing that comes to mind.

Here are some personal questions related to 'fit' that I would love for you to answer because it might help us understand your situation a little better:

Your user name is Whitney, unless that is a meme that I don't know about, it would mean that your a girl, are you?
Do you have tendency to get too excited and get cocky?
Would you consider yourself socially awkward?
Do you get too relaxed and start mentioning strange hobbies/tendencies/things?
If you could only give us three reasons, why do you think you didn't get the MM offer?

Feel free to tell us anything else you feel that is hindering you. Honestly, I've never heard of someone going to 18-19 final rounds and not get an offer, so you will have to tell us more for us to be able to give you any meaningful advice.

Jun 20, 2014
jss09:

I have a pretty much identical story to yours. I have decent experience and a good school on my resume and have completely struck out after final round interviews. Probably similar numbers to yours.

Ive been interviewing/applying for everything at this point. IB, Valuation/TAS, ER, Corp Fin, PE, Consulting, S&T. Sucks dude, hope you land something soon.

Thanks. I wish you the same.

redrocksky:

Damn, that is a scary situation to be in. I pray to God that you are exaggerating some of those numbers, if not it could definitely be that you are robotic or that you give off an off putting vibe. You mentioned fit, so that's the first thing that comes to mind.

20+ company interviews, no, I wish I were exaggerating. It gets very frustrating when people say, "oh you're probably not applying enough."

redrocksky:

Here are some personal questions related to 'fit' that I would love for you to answer because it might help us understand your situation a little better:

Your user name is Whitney, unless that is a meme that I don't know about, it would mean that your a girl, are you?

Yes, I'm female.

redrocksky:

Do you have tendency to get too excited and get cocky?

Would you consider yourself socially awkward?

Do you get too relaxed and start mentioning strange hobbies/tendencies/things?

If you could only give us three reasons, why do you think you didn't get the MM offer?

Feel free to tell us anything else you feel that is hindering you.

I'm not socially awkward (from my perspective). I have no problem talking to strangers and meeting new people. I'm also comfortable talking to people anywhere from the custodian staff to C suite.

I don't mention strange hobbies because I don't have any. I do slam poetry which I don't feel is strange. But I did get someone who asked me to freestyle rap during an interview...to which I refused. For a point of clarification, had he asked me to perform an old piece of poetry, that wouldn't have been a problem and I would have done so.

I feel like I get really excited, but I've been told during an interview that I was pretty mellow (in the sense that it would take a lot to make me angry). I was talking to an S&T guy. I'm a pretty chill person when talking about myself, but a lot more intense when talking about work related things. I feel that what I can do is more important than who I am which could be a bit of problem. I am failing the airplane test. I interview with a lot of athletes and I think it maybe obvious that I'm not one (size 10 don't know if that's important).

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Why I didn't get the MM offer?

1. Too quiet. It was a complaint on my midsummer and end of the year reviews. One of the people that interviewed me from the role said he wasn't too surprised I didn't get an offer because of how quiet I am and I was in a more rowdy group.

2. I think a lot. I asked questions about what I was working on not to sound like a smart ass, but because I genuinely curious. I could make things a bit more complicated than necessary. One situation ex: Analyst: pull some comps for company X. Me: is there an example on the drive? What should I be looking for? Analyst: Whatever. *Does what I think is a good job.* Analyst: There is too much information and too many comps. You should have looked on the drive.

3. Bad networking. The senior people loved me b/c I was personable, could hold a good conversation, and genuinely cared about their backgrounds. Junior people...not so much. (You could PM me more about this if you want I suppose). I would ask questions and get ignored by them. I try'd to ask for help only to be told, "Oh I'm busy." But then see the same analyst go help another summer on a deal THAT WASN'T EVEN HIS.

As far as the end of the summer review, I had people who I did work for not even go to the meeting, although I did get thank you emails for a job well done after the review was over. The assumption was that everyone would get an offer. A director who I worked with closely even promised me a deal toy. So no one cared enough to really advocate for me.
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Honestly, I've never heard of someone going to 18-19 final rounds and not get an offer, so you will have to tell us more for us to be able to give you any meaningful advice.

Well some places only have one interview for the entire process. Final rounds all in all is 17 so the 95% should have been 85% don't know if that makes a big difference. When companies have you interview 4 times before the superday it seems like you're doing a bit more. I've interviewed across the structure BO, MO, FO. When I got rejected from BO and MO or Corp Fin. I could feel it often at the end of the interview. I would usually get something like, why don't you go back to FO or I don't think you would be happy here.

For one of my interviews for MO at a lower tier BB, my technical question was "what is EBITDA?" And after saying what the words meant (earnings before interest taxes depreciation and amortization), he got really excited and said they had hired some people that didn't know what that meant. I can't promise you that I had a poker face. He then basically said you should work somewhere else based on your level of knowledge.

During one corp fin interview, the person on the other end was in a real bad mood and she told me so. She preceded to grill me and basically said, you're applying to us late in the game. You're interviewing b/c you want a job not b/c you want to be here.

So in terms of MEANINGFUL final rounds that number is 7.

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Dec 20, 2015

Trust me I had friends with 30+ interviews and no offer, it can happen in certain industries...

Greed is Good!

Jun 23, 2014

Did you have any interview practice (e.g. WSO offer this)? They may be able to figure out why you are not closing.
Also, be a bit more positive and think of it this way: the fact that you got interviews, and got through to final rounds, shows you can 'do the job'. Perhaps there is something you are overlooking and I'm sure a WSO mentor etc can help you with that.

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Jun 20, 2014

I've recorded myself. I also did mocks with my career center, a few industry professionals, and with two paid career coaches. None of them came from WSO however. I feel like the way things are looking getting a WSO mentor may be my best bet.

Dec 20, 2015

No way to tell if/what you're doing "wrong" but I can tell you that the job market is still sluggish, especially for mid-level. My firm has sat on an associate level opening for the past year and a half. We've interviewed a ton but refuse to move forward until activity picks up. We have since hired two analysts and one MD, however. Hang in there and keep networking.

Dec 20, 2015

Sometimes, they don't take anyone for the positions. Just stay positive, because if you start being negative it may come across during the interviews and lose you the position. Stay with it and continue to show your interest.

Dec 20, 2015

Complete wild guess but you probably have poor social skills.

Dec 20, 2015

You obv look good on paper but...24 interviews and no hit...you must be doing something wrong. I strongly urge you to reach out to at least half of them and ask for feed backs.

Baby you're the perfect shape, baby you're the perfect weight. Treat me like my birthday, I want it this way and I want it that way. It makes a man feel good baby.

Dec 20, 2015

Thanks for the answers so far.

Evidently I'm not completely anti-social as I've been promoted twice at my current firm in a couple of years and all my reviews (informal or formal) have been very positive. But I'm definitely an introvert--no question about that.

Could I be being too modest? I don't toot my own horn much and when I do, it's quite subtly (and maybe a bit bashfully). Could that come across as a lack of confidence?

Maybe I should speak with my school's career centre for some interview coaching.

Dec 20, 2015

And regarding reaching out for feedback, they either ignore my email/call or just give me some platitude about lots of other qualified candidates. Only once did the person go over what I did wrong and that was a lack of enthusiasm. At that point I had already had a lot of interviews (though less than today) and was beginning to get discouraged--I brought the enthusiasm level up again for subsequent interviews.

Dec 20, 2015

Two more rejections today. Awful. Just awful.

Dec 20, 2015

did you ask for feedback? is it because you dont have the technical skills or just no fit? it's always worth a try asking for a feedback

Dec 20, 2015

It couldn't possibly be technical skills...for the 3 banking interviews I just did I killed the technical questions--the interviewers even said so. (Plus completing the CFA program and competing against undergrads means I'm at an unfair advantage, technically speaking). For research I also usually send a report and model and have been praised on numerous occasions for them--including with respect to one of the rejections I had today.

I'm just so puzzled. I read somewhere that employers might not be giving proper feedback these days for fear of lawsuits.

I suppose it does come down to fit. I'm someone who has a few very close friends, and a few very solid relationships in the workplace (and from what I've heard, a general respect from others). I think my "likability" comes out after meeting me a few times, since I am an introvert. But I never get to that point with interviews.

Dec 20, 2015

just a guess but maybe your shy / introverted nature is making you come across poorly in some way. Either a lack of confidence, or if you are coming across as smug when answering all the questions, nail all of them and aren't smiling / likable, then that could be why. Or maybe you have a weird tick you don't even know about...ever video tape yourself? maybe your answer to why you are leaving your current shop isn't very convincing and it's raising a red flag?

Tough to say without meeting you in person. Our Wall St. Mentors can give you a mock interview to try and diagnose the issue, but 24 interviews isn't THAT many...I did about that many before getting my first offer - that was in a bad market as well (late 2001).

Either way, just look to keep improving and try to get as much feedback as possible (preferably not from career center people but from professionals in the field that you are targeting). Stay positive - at least you have a job and are interviewing from a position of strength.

Good Luck!
Patrick

Dec 20, 2015

Thanks Patrick. I would have difficulty discussing this in person but hiding behind the wall of anonymity that is the internet, I have several "weird ticks" that I'm well aware of...sniffling a bit, wiggling my eyebrows...it's probably some form of minor Tourrette's (never diagnosed) but obviously hasn't held me back at my current employer or kept me from forming meaningful relationships with people (including my lovely wife). It certainly keeps me humble so I would have a hard time believing that I'm coming across as smug. Could this be an issue? I know people are more superficial than they fancy themselves, so could it be? Maybe I could "teach" myself to stop, at least long enough for people to get to know the real me.

I always tell interviewers that I'm looking to leave my current shop because it's marketing/sales focused and doesn't support research super-well, hence my desire to find a firm with better support for research and a longer runway for growth ahead. It's always seemed convincing...

Dec 20, 2015
analyst2012:

Thanks Patrick. I would have difficulty discussing this in person but hiding behind the wall of anonymity that is the internet, I have several "weird ticks" that I'm well aware of...sniffling a bit, wiggling my eyebrows...it's probably some form of minor Tourrette's (never diagnosed) but obviously hasn't held me back at my current employer or kept me from forming meaningful relationships with people (including my lovely wife). It certainly keeps me humble so I would have a hard time believing that I'm coming across as smug. Could this be an issue? I know people are more superficial than they fancy themselves, so could it be? Maybe I could "teach" myself to stop, at least long enough for people to get to know the real me.

I always tell interviewers that I'm looking to leave my current shop because it's marketing/sales focused and doesn't support research super-well, hence my desire to find a firm with better support for research and a longer runway for growth ahead. It's always seemed convincing...

I have similar issues as you but hasnt stopped me from interviewing very well. You might be too senior for the positions you're applying for. You said you got promoted a couple times so the pay grade might not be matching your experience level. Maybe you want to communicate that you can take a pay cut or something along those lines.

Dec 20, 2015

You are clearly not interviewing well. Patrick mentioned coaching, which is what I would have suggested as well. If you can't do that for some reason, you need to find a friend who can help you with honest feedback.

Most of your friends won't give you honest feedback. You need to find a friend that most people consider a little bit of an asshole to deliver criticism. You have to be receptive for it to matter. Ideally, the asshole is in your industry as well.

Dec 20, 2015

Thanks. I'm definitely going to get some interview coaching.

Dec 20, 2015

Thanks HarvardOrBust--I'm glad to hear that there are others out there like me for whom this isn't any impediment. It's never affected anything else so I would be surprised if it seriously hindered me in interviews.

With respect to pay, one interviewer thought I could be around $200k--try closer to $50-75k (which is a long way from where I was when I started). I'm way underpaid for my title, but the differential would not be sizable if you considered me a second/third year buy-side analyst, adjusting for the fact that I'm at a small shop. Is this something I should clarify in my cover letter and/or in interviews?

Dec 20, 2015

It sounds like you have most of the raw materials so you just need to carve them into a package that you can sell to potential employers. An interview coach would help, as well as some kind of therapy for your tics. Finally, make sure your fundamental game is really tight. After all, if I thought that a kid could make me money, I wouldn't really care that much if he saw shy or was a little weird. I'm a pretty strange guy myself, but I was able to demonstrate the potential of making money for my boss, so here I am.

Dec 20, 2015

Thanks. It's been a long and brutal slog but maybe I've invested in everything but the "soft skills", so it's time to make an investment in that.

Dec 20, 2015

Hi everyone,

As a quick update, I'm happy to report that I'm moving onto the next round in two interviews, one for investment management (buy-side) and one for management consulting. Evidently the very modest attempts I've been making to build a connection in the first few minutes (something I wasn't doing at all before--I'm someone who likes to get straight to business) have been paying off as I haven't had this level of success at all through my job search. With that said, in one of the two interviews the honest feedback I received was that there was some concern about my interpersonal skills; even so, they're advancing me.

While there are no guarantees I'll have an offer in the next few weeks, I can feel I'm getting closer and it's only a matter of time from here.

Thanks, everyone, for your feedback.

Dec 20, 2015

What exactly was meant by "...concern about [my] interpersonal skills"? That sounds like bs made up by some human resources drone so she can justify her job.

Dec 20, 2015

Good to hear about your success so far. I would like to about how your building a connection in the first few minutes in the interview? If you don't mind answering or you can pm me. Good luck on your search.

Dec 20, 2015
analyst2012:

Hi everyone,

As a quick update, I'm happy to report that I'm moving onto the next round in two interviews, one for investment management (buy-side) and one for management consulting. Evidently the very modest attempts I've been making to build a connection in the first few minutes (something I wasn't doing at all before--I'm someone who likes to get straight to business) have been paying off as I haven't had this level of success at all through my job search. With that said, in one of the two interviews the honest feedback I received was that there was some concern about my interpersonal skills; even so, they're advancing me.

While there are no guarantees I'll have an offer in the next few weeks, I can feel I'm getting closer and it's only a matter of time from here.

Thanks, everyone, for your feedback.

Hey Analyst2012,

Congrats on your progress; hopefully things work out with the invest mgmt/ mgmt. consulting gig.
I am in a similar boat as you (more or less), so I definitely know how you feel. Just to give you a better idea of my background; I graduated from university 4 months ago; I have had a couple of internships in PE & advisory and I am currently looking for an entry-level position in investments/IBD.

I think for me, my initial problem was b/c of behavioral questions. I spent more time preparing for technical questions and I found that I had to really wing it for some of the behavioral questions. Since then, I have adjusted my approach and my feedback has gone a lot better.

But still, I can't get an offer. It has been a couple of months now and it's becoming more and more frustrating. The comments I get from most interviewers are: you have really impressive experiences, insightful answers (esp. for an undergrad), good knowledge of our company and industry, but we decided to go with someone with a little bit more experience who can hit the ground running from day 1. If experience was a factor, why did you decide to interview me in the first place?

I was recently interviewed for an analyst position in a fairly sizable REPE shop (through networking and referrals) and I had a good conversation with all the interviewers. After getting rejected for the job, I spoke with one of the interviewers: he mentioned that they really liked me as a candidate. I had a good sense of humor, was able to give very insightful answers to the questions and had a good understanding of the industry & company. But there were concerns that I wouldn't be challenged at this job and I would get bored and might want to switch afterwards; and they want someone who will stick around. I asked them if there is something I said that might have given him that impression; he said no, it's purely based on my experiences.

I don't know what I am doing wrong guys? I definitely took the time to prepare for the behavioral (why this position/firm/strengths & weaknesses) and commitment (see myself in 5-10) questions...but why is it not working out? Should I dumb down some of my experiences? Is there anyone who is the same position as me?

Any advice or feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Dec 20, 2015

Hi everyone

Sorry for not responding sooner--the board was supposed to notify me when I got new responses but it hasn't been doing so.

Isuckatlife, it was actually a Manager-level person (Project Leader/Engagement Manager level at MBB?) who said this so it wasn't BS at all. Frankly, this person seemed like one of the few who has had the guts to speak the truth.

acelion, I've been simply smiling, paying attention to the all-important first-impression-forming "how are you?" question, and then doing my best to make a point of contact based on what I know of their biography (e.g. shared interests, mutual acquaintances etc.).

monkey in suit, I've had similar experiences. Often people tell me how smart and accomplished I am, and then tell me why the job might not be for me after all. Well, if Goldman and McKinsey were beating down my door, I might agree--but they're NOT! My feeling is that this is a function of a few things:
1) They just don't like me, and this is a kind way to say it. (This probably isn't always the case.)
2) They're intimidated and scared I'll steal their job or make them look lazy.
3) They're blissfully unaware of the state of the labour market and the fact that hiring is way down and that people who will traditionally go to the MBBs or BBs (consulting and banking respectively) will happily settle for a Deloitte or Wells Fargo or even a mid-market or boutique in this climate--and won't be able to easily leave even if they want to for the foreseeable future.

If it comes down to #2 or #3, maybe the fact that I haven't landed something yet is a blessing in disguise. I'm employed and making reasonable money so I can afford to wait. monkey in suit, you're just out of school so my guess is you can afford to wait a bit more too--especially if you've "boomeranged" to the parents' house. I could be wrong but I can't see any long-term impact on your resume if you have a bit of trouble landing the first real gig, especially with your internships (which sound like they're front-office, so all the better). Just think of it this way: once you make the right move, you're set--at least for a while.

On the topic of those rejecting you because of inexperience, it could be that you're flubbing the technical questions, but if you're absolutely nailing them then it could be a "fit" thing (see #1 above!). If you're anything like me, you become more likeable with time, like a fine wine, so you're naturally at a bit of a disadvantage in interviews. In that case, see SirTradesaLot's comment above.

As for me, I'm sitting here anxiously awaiting two possible offers (or, conversely, two even more disappointing rejections)...

Regards

Dec 20, 2015
analyst2012:

Hi everyone

monkey in suit, I've had similar experiences. Often people tell me how smart and accomplished I am, and then tell me why the job might not be for me after all. Well, if Goldman and McKinsey were beating down my door, I might agree--but they're NOT! My feeling is that this is a function of a few things:
1) They just don't like me, and this is a kind way to say it. (This probably isn't always the case.)
2) They're intimidated and scared I'll steal their job or make them look lazy.
3) They're blissfully unaware of the state of the labour market and the fact that hiring is way down and that people who will traditionally go to the MBBs or BBs (consulting and banking respectively) will happily settle for a Deloitte or Wells Fargo or even a mid-market or boutique in this climate--and won't be able to easily leave even if they want to for the foreseeable future.

If it comes down to #2 or #3, maybe the fact that I haven't landed something yet is a blessing in disguise. I'm employed and making reasonable money so I can afford to wait. monkey in suit, you're just out of school so my guess is you can afford to wait a bit more too--especially if you've "boomeranged" to the parents' house. I could be wrong but I can't see any long-term impact on your resume if you have a bit of trouble landing the first real gig, especially with your internships (which sound like they're front-office, so all the better). Just think of it this way: once you make the right move, you're set--at least for a while.

On the topic of those rejecting you because of inexperience, it could be that you're flubbing the technical questions, but if you're absolutely nailing them then it could be a "fit" thing (see #1 above!). If you're anything like me, you become more likeable with time, like a fine wine, so you're naturally at a bit of a disadvantage in interviews. In that case, see SirTradesaLot's comment above.

As for me, I'm sitting here anxiously awaiting two possible offers (or, conversely, two even more disappointing rejections)...

Regards

Thanks for your feedback analyst...Best of luck on your potential job offers!
Let's keep in touch

Dec 20, 2015

I just got an offer! It is--to the day--a year since I started my search. It's for consulting and I'm still waiting on the details (comp/level), but I'll probably take it instead of trying to hurry along a couple of other interviews I still have on the go (both in investment management).

Thanks everyone for your advice! Evidently it helped.

Dec 20, 2015

Congrats man.....

analyst2012:

I just got an offer! It is--to the day--a year since I started my search. It's for consulting and I'm still waiting on the details (comp/level), but I'll probably take it instead of trying to hurry along a couple of other interviews I still have on the go (both in investment management).

Thanks everyone for your advice! Evidently it helped.

Dec 20, 2015

Congrats.

What do you think led to you getting an offer? You sort of touched on it above but could you elaborate?

Thanks,

Dec 20, 2015

Thank you. I think several things came together at once. For one, I was definitely more personable at the outset (asking how the interviewer was doing, doing my best to make a connection etc.). For another, I think this firm is a particularly good fit (and my former boss was able to make a call to an ex-colleague which probably tilted the scale in my favor). Thirdly, I've probably been barking up the wrong tree for a year--consulting seems better suited to me than finance. And finally, I got lucky. I made my own luck, but in the end I was lucky.

Jun 23, 2014

It sounds like an issue could be that because you're interviewing across such a wide spectrum, your reasons for wanting X position don't line up with what your past experience is. Particularity with HFs and Top IMs, the interviewers are looking for unwavering passion and someone who's future they can take an investment in, and this would especially hold true for someone coming from an IB background. It is really bad for you in those interviewing situations to give off the vibe that you're just looking for a job, and don't necessarily care if you're apart of X firm or Y firm.

Having an impeccable resume only matters to an extent, and knowing the technicals, like EBITDA, aren't a game changer - that stuff can be taught to anyone. From your OP and comments I couldn't even get an idea of what type of job you even want or prefer, just that you're shotgun interviewing wherever you can.

I think you need to take a step back, figure out what it is you REALLY want to do, and then re-craft your story to illustrate how you want nothing more to work in IB/PE/ER/etc, and how your past experience has prepared you to hit the ground running.

Jun 20, 2014

My ultimate goal is to go to a HF. But it's a lot easier to get into a HF with the 2 years of IB. It would be crazy for me not to apply for IB with IB experience although I know I would be miserable for two years. @"Stryfe" yes the wide spectrum is killing me. Before I'd been taking any interview that was offered, but now I'm getting (ironically) more selective. For the record neither the HFs or IBs had a hard time believing that I was passionate about the field. But other roles corp fin, credit risk, ops, this always came up as an issue.

Jun 22, 2014
ItzWhitneyBItch:

My ultimate goal is to go to a HF. But it's a lot easier to get into a HF with the 2 years of IB. It would be crazy for me not to apply for IB with IB experience although I know I would be miserable for two years. @Stryfe yes the wide spectrum is killing me. Before I'd been taking any interview that was offered, but now I'm getting (ironically) more selective. For the record neither the HFs or IBs had a hard time believing that I was passionate about the field. But other roles corp fin, credit risk, ops, this always came up as an issue.

If your end goal is HF, i think it would benefit you to just target HF and ER and sell your passion in the public markets. I posted earlier in this thread with a similar problem and was able to find something recently. Just keep applying, networking and interviewing with firms you really want to work for and youll make the right connection. Its really impossible to actually fake an interest in a job. I was interviewing for ER and never could find anything due to not having a passion for the markets, people know when your lying, and people know when your just fishing around for a job.

Dec 20, 2015

Quick diagnosis: You are likely butchering the "why did you leave your last position" question which is getting you an auto-ding.

If you are vague, it will usually come back to haunt you -- first off, why were you actually fired?

Dec 20, 2015
WallStreetOasis.com:

Quick diagnosis: You are likely butchering the "why did you leave your last position" question which is getting you an auto-ding.

If you are vague, it will usually come back to haunt you -- first off, why were you actually fired?

I've made the changes.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

That is very surprising. I'm guessing that since you've applied to 330 positions, you've probably applied to positions you weren't very interested in. All I can tell you is that this is a tough market for new graduates.

My only suggestion is to branch out and network.

It is not about the title that you have, it is about how much money that you have.

    • 1
Dec 20, 2015
StrongMan:

That is very surprising. I'm guessing that since you've applied to 330 positions, you've probably applied to positions you weren't very interested in. All I can tell you is that this is a tough market for new graduates.

My only suggestion is to branch out and network.

All the positions I have applied for fit my background. I was interested in all the positions and these are basic finance positions. I was in that company for 2 years. I'm networking using all my resources and nothing is working out. I just got another rejection email.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

Any chance that they are calling your boss after interviews and he/she is saying something negative?

Dec 20, 2015
MinneBanker:

Any chance that they are calling your boss after interviews and he/she is saying something negative?

Nope. I've only given references of coworkers and managers who know me well and wouldn't say bad things about me. Good question though.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

You paid $250 for a cover letter? Nobody reads those anyway.

"Anything less than the best is a felony"

    • 1
Dec 20, 2015
Get_Yield:

You paid $250 for a cover letter? Nobody reads those anyway.

Regardless of whether people read cover letters or not, I can definitely see the resume and cover letter are making a positive impact on me.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

Nobody quits because of lack of career growth (contradictory) or bored. Since you are unemployed you have to say you we're laid off or quit for a job that fell through last minute or something. I would bet that like .com said, you're butchering that
question. Hang in there and spend as much time networking as possible. Also work on your post interview follow up maybe. If its not ib etc than like cover letters this can be vital.

Dec 20, 2015
sk8247365:

Nobody quits because of lack of career growth (contradictory) or bored. Since you are unemployed you have to say you we're laid off or quit for a job that fell through last minute or something. I would bet that like .com said, you're butchering that
question. Hang in there and spend as much time networking as possible. Also work on your post interview follow up maybe. If its not ib etc than like cover letters this can be vital.

Not just lack of career growth, but sometimes I say that wasn't the work I wanted to do or that I wanted a more finance oriented duties.
From now on, I'm just going to tell the interviewers that I was Fired. I'm not going to make things up. But I'll provide strong supporting arguments to make them think that this guy is a winner.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

not doing anything wrong - I think its just the FUCKING ECONOMY!

Dec 20, 2015
couchy:

not doing anything wrong - I think its just the FUCKING ECONOMY!

LOVE YOUR ANSWER!!! You are right (I'll add some more)...IT'S THE FUCKING FISCAL CLIFF, and Housing, and Europe and fucking China.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015
Callus:
analyst1609:
couchy:

not doing anything wrong - I think its just the FUCKING ECONOMY!

LOVE YOUR ANSWER!!! You are right (I'll add some more)...IT'S THE FUCKING FISCAL CLIFF, and Housing, and Europe and fucking China.

I can now clearly see why you are such a loser!

What you talking about?

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

Look, I agree that 10 interviews at 10 different companies is not something to be proud of.
But look, in 2006 straight out of college, knowing nothing I spent 1 months getting 3 interviews and 1 offer at IM/HF. I now have professional qualifications, a masters degree in finance, 4 years of great works experience, stellar references, yet have spent 6 months, 100 applications, networking and ZERO interviews.

I was the same person then, just clueless... it seems to me it is exactly what he says it is, THE ECONMY, THE FISCAL CLIFF, THE OVERHANG OF DESPERATE FINANCE EMPLOYEES FROM CREDIT CRISIS, EUROPE etcetc

Dec 20, 2015
analyst1609:
couchy:

not doing anything wrong - I think its just the FUCKING ECONOMY!

LOVE YOUR ANSWER!!! You are right (I'll add some more)...IT'S THE FUCKING FISCAL CLIFF, and Housing, and Europe and fucking China.

My father used to tell me the following:

"If you can't sink the free throw don't blame the fucking rim"

Cheers mate.

Dec 20, 2015
analyst1609:
couchy:

not doing anything wrong - I think its just the FUCKING ECONOMY!

LOVE YOUR ANSWER!!! You are right (I'll add some more)...IT'S THE FUCKING FISCAL CLIFF, and Housing, and Europe and fucking China.

First thought I had when I read your original post (esp the part about you not meeting performance at your old job) and then when I saw this comment was that your attitude could (mostly likely) be getting you dinged. Most of us recent grads are/have been in the same position, with an awful job market, due to both the number of jobs available (way down) and number of people applying (way up). It sucks, but there's nothing you or any of us can do about it, so stop blaming your unlucky job search on it and get over it.

My advice, think about lowering your standards, look into other career paths that could provide a stepping stone to IBD if that's what you really want to do. At 25, your probably not going to get into a career that you'll hold for the rest of your working life (you have 3 years down, 40 more to go). If you want to be in IBD, why not call it quits on the analyst hunt (it's not that great anyway), focus on getting into a good MBA program and then make a run at IBD as an Associate hire.

Dec 20, 2015

First off, don't lie about being lay off / let go because if they make a job reference check they are allowed to ask if you are fired or you voluntarily quit. This will come back and fuck you like no other.

Tell them that there were differences in expectations and ultimately the firm have to let you go. Briefly go into a couple of points in terms of how you and the previous firm's expectations were not on the same page. Be specific on those and be very prepared.

Dec 20, 2015
ST Monkey:

First off, don't lie about being lay off / let go because if they make a job reference check they are allowed to ask if you are fired or you voluntarily quit. This will come back and fuck you like no other.

Tell them that there were differences in expectations and ultimately the firm have to let you go. Briefly go into a couple of points in terms of how you and the previous firm's expectations were not on the same page. Be specific on those and be very prepared.

They gave me the reason because I was not meeting the performance of my department. Do you think in your opinion by saying there were differences in expectations and ultimately the firm have to let you go, is the explanation to give to either a recruiter/interviewer? Thanks

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015
analyst1609:
ST Monkey:

First off, don't lie about being lay off / let go because if they make a job reference check they are allowed to ask if you are fired or you voluntarily quit. This will come back and fuck you like no other.

Tell them that there were differences in expectations and ultimately the firm have to let you go. Briefly go into a couple of points in terms of how you and the previous firm's expectations were not on the same page. Be specific on those and be very prepared.

They gave me the reason because I was not meeting the performance of my department. Do you think in your opinion by saying there were differences in expectations and ultimately the firm have to let you go, is the explanation to give to either a recruiter/interviewer? Thanks

The moment you say "I was fired" without preface it with reasoning will immediately put up a wall in any interviewer and recruiters mind. They will see this as a huge negative and judge you that way. It will not do you any favors by saying that.

Your last company said you weren't meeting the performance of the department and let you go. Performance expectation of the department can be different than the work you have done. For example, my department expects me to bring in volume and new clients. Somehow I was able to bring on board a shit ton of new clients but volume is taking some time to develop and my company decides to let me go.

Do you think any recruiter or interviewer will not want to take it further if I tell them "my focus of my last job was two parts and I had placed priority in sourcing new clients before developing volume, but unfortunately my MD and I had differences in judging those two. It was decided that I should move on, since my volume production did not meet expectation and over shadowed my performance in sourcing new clients." I will of course be interviewing with a company/job that highly emphasize on sourcing new clients.

You have strengths and weaknesses, play on those and make sure you end with a strength that is complimentary to the job you are interviewing for right after you say why you were let go.

    • 1
Dec 20, 2015

The moment you say "I was fired" without preface it with reasoning will immediately put up a wall in any interviewer and recruiters mind. They will see this as a huge negative and judge you that way. It will not do you any favors by saying that.

Your last company said you weren't meeting the performance of the department and let you go. Performance expectation of the department can be different than the work you have done. For example, my department expects me to bring in volume and new clients. Somehow I was able to bring on board a shit ton of new clients but volume is taking some time to develop and my company decides to let me go.

You have strengths and weaknesses, play on those and make sure you end with a strength that is complimentary to the job you are interviewing for right after you say why you were let go.[/quote]

Thanks man! I like this. Use the strengths and weakness answer. I'll definitely do this next time.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

Don't despair. I too had the worst time finding a job after college back in 2002, it was a really bad year for many college grads. I moved to New York in hopes of striking it big. I sent my resume to lot more places and got fewer interviews than you did. Six months later I was left with $100 in my account and no job offer. I moved back home and got a job through a family friend. I worked hard and tried to learn as much as I could. I also took some evening classes. Two years later I moved to New York again with an offer from a mid-level financial institution and few months into the job I got an offer from a BB bank.

Not suggesting that this is the way to do it, but merely offering to put things in perspective. Your situation is temporary, one way or the other you will find a way in.

    • 1
Dec 20, 2015
Paul B:

Don't despair. I too had the worst time finding a job after college back in 2002, it was a really bad year for many college grads. I moved to New York in hopes of striking it big. I sent my resume to lot more places and got fewer interviews than you did. Six months later I was left with $100 in my account and no job offer. I moved back home and got a job through a family friend. I worked hard and tried to learn as much as I could. I also took some evening classes. Two years later I moved to New York again with an offer from a mid-level financial institution and few months into the job I got an offer from a BB bank.

Not suggesting that this is the way to do it, but merely offering to put things in the perspective. Your situation is temporary, one way or the other you will find a way in.

I don't want to sound like a wuss, but I just got teared up when you said "Your situation is temporary, one way or the other you will find a way in." Appreciate it. Good story.
FYI, I live with my folks and I know I've saved a shit load of $$$ by not paying rent.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

Keep on trucking.

Dec 20, 2015
tmur:

Keep on trucking.

Appreciate it. But for how long? How long is too long?

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

Hey man I'm not sure what you can do to land an offer, especially because I'm still in college, but I just wanted to drop by and wish you the best of luck. However, one piece of advice I have for you is to take the CFA if you're unemployed because the material is really relevant to any "finance" job, and if your interviewer has taken the CFA, or has passed all 3 exams, he'll probably give you a leg up.

Good luck!

Dec 20, 2015
AQM:

Hey man I'm not sure what you can do to land an offer, especially because I'm still in college, but I just wanted to drop by and wish you the best of luck. However, one piece of advice I have for you is to take the CFA if you're unemployed because the material is really relevant to any "finance" job, and if your interviewer has taken the CFA, or has passed all 3 exams, he'll probably give you a leg up.

Good luck!

Taking Level I in 3 weeks time. What else do I have to do to look good on paper?

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

[/quote]Taking Level I in 3 weeks time. What else do I have to do to look good on paper?[/quote]

Word of advice, do NOT underestimate level 1. If you've prepared it is definitely passable, but you can't slack off. Passing level 1 will help get some interviews, but it's not as good as having more experience. If you pass it, go take Level 2 in June and crush that one, then that's when employer's will really start to take it more seriously. It still won't get you much of anything over someone with more/better experience, but it's great for getting interviews and showing your commitment to finance.

Dec 20, 2015

Hang in there bud. Some job hunts are harder than others. Best advice I can think of is this: before going into an interview, think about where you may have gotten derailed in previous interviews and prepare well for those questions. Always be honest in your answers, but be artful. Remember that you are just a stranger with no attachments for the person who is interviewing you. Put yourself in their shoes as you think about what answers are appropriate.

If you don't get what you're looking for, consider what other jobs you can take now that will build up your skillset over the longer term. Accept that you might not get that job during this search process but don't accept the idea of not being able to get it down the road.

Dec 20, 2015
yyooo123:

Hang in there bud. Some job hunts are harder than others. Best advice I can think of is this: before going into an interview, think about where you may have gotten derailed in previous interviews and prepare well for those questions. Always be honest in your answers, but be artful. Remember that you are just a stranger with no attachments for the person who is interviewing you. Put yourself in their shoes as you think about what answers are appropriate.

If you don't get what you're looking for, consider what other jobs you can take now that will build up your skillset over the longer term. Accept that you might not get that job during this search process but don't accept the idea of not being able to get it down the road.

Nice, well funded.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

sorry to hear. and yes, i can definitely relate. try giving this a read:

http://blogs.hbr.org/bregman/2009/02/need-to-find-...

    • 1
Dec 20, 2015
Moneyball:

sorry to hear. and yes, i can definitely relate. try giving this a read:

http://blogs.hbr.org/bregman/2009/02/need-to-find-...

Yep, I've read this before and I like it. I don't spend too much time looking for jobs per day. Rest of the time I'm prepping for CFA and SQL. Good read!

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015
analyst1609:
Moneyball:

sorry to hear. and yes, i can definitely relate. try giving this a read:

http://blogs.hbr.org/bregman/2009/02/need-to-find-...

Yep, I've read this before and I like it. I don't spend too much time looking for jobs per day. Rest of the time I'm prepping for CFA and SQL. Good read!

I've been also preparing for the cfa, but it hasn't been a big help at all with making me stand out. trying doing some pro bono equity research for someone or a modelling course?

Dec 20, 2015

how did you even find 330 jobs to apply to?
I'm currently unemployed just like you, and I barely see any new job postings. Any advice?

Born in hell, forged from suffering, hardened by pain.

Dec 20, 2015
brianklk:

how did you even find 330 jobs to apply to?
I'm currently unemployed just like you, and I barely see any new job postings. Any advice?

I started in March and I made a detailed Excel spreadsheet of all the company names and with a table displaying how many jobs I applied in a week. On average I find about 10 jobs a week. Good solid jobs. I use LinkedIn (My #1 go-to tool) and Doostang. Networking is also huge. Good luck, and I know I'm busting my chops. We'll get the job!!!

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

I can definitely relate to how frustrating it must seem. I also applied for ~300 jobs last spring (senior in college though), got a handful of interviews/superdays, and not a single offer. It only takes one, though, don't give up. Best of luck!

Dec 20, 2015
chicandtoughness:

I can definitely relate to how frustrating it must seem. I also applied for ~300 jobs last spring (senior in college though), got a handful of interviews/superdays, and not a single offer. It only takes one, though, don't give up. Best of luck!

Yep, I know....just all I need is that one yes. That's all I want. Wow not getting a single offer must have sucked. What was going through your mind not getting anything. Demoralizing?

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

I can relate to how shitty it feels to not get an offer, I was fully expecting a return offer to come from my SA position this past summer, but they weren't looking to hire at the moment, which they told me at the very last minute. Since then I've only gotten one interview for a FT and was dinged from that. I'll be graduating next spring and I need to find something ASAP. That being said, I've only applied to listings on my school's career site, so I definitely need to step up my game.

Jun 20, 2014

Look at your dilemma from a bank's perspective.

Hire a 22 year old from a target school, who we can pay less money, or we can hire a 25 year old who "left" his job in what are soon to be the worst economic times in this nation's history, because he was bored, and wants to go forward in his career.

I'm not sure if banking is what you want to go into, but 1) They don't like people to work 2 years and just bounce and 2) Banking at the analyst level is boring/easy as hell... they probably think you can't handle it mentally with that story.

Just my .02

    • 1
Dec 20, 2015

I think you have to focus a little more on networking, as it seems that most jobs are won based on some connection or recommendation. Spend the time you would use to send 10 more cover letters in cultivating 10 fresh contacts. Go from alumni lists in schools, job boards, career fairs, mutual friends, information sessions, cold calling, etc...I believe you will see more concrete results that way.

To the starving man, beans are caviar

Dec 20, 2015

This job market absolutely sucks, but philosoraptor is right, you should probably start working on getting quality contacts instead of a lot of contacts. You might try adding tiers to that spreadsheet you said you made. For example, have a level 1 tier where you focus on like 10-20 jobs that you would love to get, and really work on making solid relationships with the people in those firms. Then do a tier 2 where you have maybe 40 or so jobs that you would be satisfied with getting, and just throw out generic emails to people with your resume. Then do a tier 3 where you just throw out random applications. Since you are currently unemployed and supposedly have time on your hands, you obviously want to try and spend as much time with the personalized networking as you can, but this will keep you focused on which ones you really want at least.

Dec 20, 2015
MonkeyWrench:

This job market absolutely sucks, but philosoraptor is right, you should probably start working on getting quality contacts instead of a lot of contacts. You might try adding tiers to that spreadsheet you said you made. For example, have a level 1 tier where you focus on like 10-20 jobs that you would love to get, and really work on making solid relationships with the people in those firms. Then do a tier 2 where you have maybe 40 or so jobs that you would be satisfied with getting, and just throw out generic emails to people with your resume. Then do a tier 3 where you just throw out random applications. Since you are currently unemployed and supposedly have time on your hands, you obviously want to try and spend as much time with the personalized networking as you can, but this will keep you focused on which ones you really want at least.

Ah, this interesting. A tiered system. I'll modify my spreadsheet to include this. I've done networking and from that a coworker got me an interview, but of course I didn't get the position. Thanks for your input.

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

I did several hundred more applications/cold emails/cold calls in aggregate than you during my final year of school. I ended up graduating unemployed, but got an offcycle offer about a week after graduation.

Dont give up. The non-target curse can be overcome.

My suggestion is to supplement your search with internship/part-time work. Try this, for example (it starts in January, if I recall correctly, but need to apply this week): http://www.bankerswithoutborders.com/careers. Those dumb HR chicks eat that shit up.

Dec 20, 2015

I know exactly how you are feeling! I have just begun actually getting interviews. For a while I felt as though I was applying to phantom jobs openings. What I have learned being from a "non target" (I hate that word) is that you have to show that you are hungry for the position. Follow up until they actually tell you no flat out and then don't be afraid to ask why. I am humble enough to know that I may have to get the door slammed on me quite a lot because I don't have experience however I have enough confidence to know that I CAN do the job and I can't be easily intimidated. Also interviewing is an art in and of its self. Don't get too discourage just try different methods (cold calling, linkedin, follow ups, online apps, etc). I just look at it like a game that I refuse to lose. Good luck and you'll get something soon just keep thinking positive!

Dec 20, 2015

Just out of curiosity, what's your experience in terms om previous WE, school etc?

Dec 20, 2015

I def understand your frustrated. I've had full time positions throughout my career but each has not been challenging or fulfilling as I would like. I wasn't to sure what I wanted to do within Financial Services so I bounced around mid to large BBs always searching and looking for jobs. Hindsight is 20/20 but as a piece of advice going forward, which I'm sure you heard already is "its easier to get a job when you already have one".

For the past 2-2.5 years, I have applied for over 3,000 jobs across various roles within Financial Services -- Investment Mgmt, IB, Finance, Accounting, Consulting, etc. (I checked my trash folder to confirm the amount of rejection emails). With the job market the way it is, I have come to the conclusion that it is all about the numbers game. With applying for 3k jobs, I've had hundreds of phone calls and maybe 20-25 in person interviews. As someone previously said, keep trucking. Keep filling up your inbox with rejection letters. The more recruiters you're resume gets in front of the better and higher chances are that you get the call/interview. Be very methodical in your approach to interviews. Write out a script and stick to it even on the calls when it may sound robotic. The interviewer is not paying close attention anyway and is only looking for keywords here or there so make sure to drop those words relative to the job. Then when you are called for an inperson interview, memorize that script. Spend the couple days before the interview visualizing the script and embed it into your brain so it rolls off of your tongue and into the ears of the hiring manager effortlessly.

Hope this helps.

Good Luck!

Dec 20, 2015

I def understand your frustrated. I've had full time positions throughout my career but each has not been challenging or fulfilling as I would like. I wasn't to sure what I wanted to do within Financial Services so I bounced around mid to large BBs always searching and looking for jobs. Hindsight is 20/20 but as a piece of advice going forward, which I'm sure you heard already is "its easier to get a job when you already have one".

For the past 2-2.5 years, I have applied for over 3,000 jobs across various roles within Financial Services -- Investment Mgmt, IB, Finance, Accounting, Consulting, etc. (I checked my trash folder to confirm the amount of rejection emails). With the job market the way it is, I have come to the conclusion that it is all about the numbers game. With applying for 3k jobs, I've had hundreds of phone calls and maybe 20-25 in person interviews. As someone previously said, keep trucking. Keep filling up your inbox with rejection letters. The more recruiters you're resume gets in front of the better and higher chances are that you get the call/interview. Be very methodical in your approach to interviews. Write out a script and stick to it even on the calls when it may sound robotic. The interviewer is not paying close attention anyway and is only looking for keywords here or there so make sure to drop those words relative to the job. Then when you are called for an inperson interview, memorize that script. Spend the couple days before the interview visualizing the script and embed it into your brain so it rolls off of your tongue and into the ears of the hiring manager effortlessly.

Hope this helps.

Good Luck!

Dec 20, 2015
MBACFApending:

I def understand your frustrated. I've had full time positions throughout my career but each has not been challenging or fulfilling as I would like. I wasn't to sure what I wanted to do within Financial Services so I bounced around mid to large BBs always searching and looking for jobs. Hindsight is 20/20 but as a piece of advice going forward, which I'm sure you heard already is "its easier to get a job when you already have one".

For the past 2-2.5 years, I have applied for over 3,000 jobs across various roles within Financial Services -- Investment Mgmt, IB, Finance, Accounting, Consulting, etc. (I checked my trash folder to confirm the amount of rejection emails). With the job market the way it is, I have come to the conclusion that it is all about the numbers game. With applying for 3k jobs, I've had hundreds of phone calls and maybe 20-25 in person interviews. As someone previously said, keep trucking. Keep filling up your inbox with rejection letters. The more recruiters you're resume gets in front of the better and higher chances are that you get the call/interview. Be very methodical in your approach to interviews. Write out a script and stick to it even on the calls when it may sound robotic. The interviewer is not paying close attention anyway and is only looking for keywords here or there so make sure to drop those words relative to the job. Then when you are called for an inperson interview, memorize that script. Spend the couple days before the interview visualizing the script and embed it into your brain so it rolls off of your tongue and into the ears of the hiring manager effortlessly.

Hope this helps.

Good Luck!

3,000 job applications and only 20 in-person interviews - you're clearly in no position to be giving anybody advice.

My quick diagnosis of you guys is that you're morons. There's no other explanation for so many applications and no jobs.

I did one application to the best firm in the industry, went through interviews, and then got in. 1 application, 4 interviews, 1 job.

Give up and get some 30k/year accounting job at a paper company - you're clearly not cut out for this.

I'd like to see some silver bananas for keeping it real.

    • 4
Dec 20, 2015

Logan?

Dec 20, 2015
expenseaccounts:

3,000 job applications and only 20 in-person interviews - you're clearly in no position to be giving anybody advice.

My quick diagnosis of you guys is that you're morons. There's no other explanation for so many applications and no jobs.

I did one application to the best firm in the industry, went through interviews, and then got in. 1 application, 4 interviews, 1 job.

Give up and get some 30k/year accounting job at a paper company - you're clearly not cut out for this.

I'd like to see some silver bananas for keeping it real.

My silver seems to be a little bit more brown. Sorry about that.

OP, have you considered contracts/staffing firms to get back in?

Dec 20, 2015

[/quote]

I did one application to the best firm in the industry, went through interviews, and then got in. 1 application, 4 interviews, 1 job.

Give up and get some 30k/year accounting job at a paper company - you're clearly not cut out for this.

I'd like to see some silver bananas for keeping it real.[/quote]

Assuming my own quick diagnosis, I'm pretty sure if we matched resumes and bank accounts, this moron will surpass yours without question. But whose here to bicker. I wish prosperity for you too, clown. Have an efficient day!

Dec 20, 2015

Assuming my own quick diagnosis, I'm pretty sure if we matched resumes and bank accounts, this moron will surpass yours without question. But whose here to bicker. I wish prosperity for you too, clown. Have an efficient day!

Dec 20, 2015
expenseaccounts:
MBACFApending:

I def understand your frustrated. I've had full time positions throughout my career but each has not been challenging or fulfilling as I would like. I wasn't to sure what I wanted to do within Financial Services so I bounced around mid to large BBs always searching and looking for jobs. Hindsight is 20/20 but as a piece of advice going forward, which I'm sure you heard already is "its easier to get a job when you already have one".

For the past 2-2.5 years, I have applied for over 3,000 jobs across various roles within Financial Services -- Investment Mgmt, IB, Finance, Accounting, Consulting, etc. (I checked my trash folder to confirm the amount of rejection emails). With the job market the way it is, I have come to the conclusion that it is all about the numbers game. With applying for 3k jobs, I've had hundreds of phone calls and maybe 20-25 in person interviews. As someone previously said, keep trucking. Keep filling up your inbox with rejection letters. The more recruiters you're resume gets in front of the better and higher chances are that you get the call/interview. Be very methodical in your approach to interviews. Write out a script and stick to it even on the calls when it may sound robotic. The interviewer is not paying close attention anyway and is only looking for keywords here or there so make sure to drop those words relative to the job. Then when you are called for an inperson interview, memorize that script. Spend the couple days before the interview visualizing the script and embed it into your brain so it rolls off of your tongue and into the ears of the hiring manager effortlessly.

Hope this helps.

Good Luck!

3,000 job applications and only 20 in-person interviews - you're clearly in no position to be giving anybody advice.

My quick diagnosis of you guys is that you're morons. There's no other explanation for so many applications and no jobs.

I did one application to the best firm in the industry, went through interviews, and then got in. 1 application, 4 interviews, 1 job.

Give up and get some 30k/year accounting job at a paper company - you're clearly not cut out for this.

I'd like to see some silver bananas for keeping it real.

Tool.

Jun 20, 2014
expenseaccounts:
MBACFApending:

I def understand your frustrated. I've had full time positions throughout my career but each has not been challenging or fulfilling as I would like. I wasn't to sure what I wanted to do within Financial Services so I bounced around mid to large BBs always searching and looking for jobs. Hindsight is 20/20 but as a piece of advice going forward, which I'm sure you heard already is "its easier to get a job when you already have one".

For the past 2-2.5 years, I have applied for over 3,000 jobs across various roles within Financial Services -- Investment Mgmt, IB, Finance, Accounting, Consulting, etc. (I checked my trash folder to confirm the amount of rejection emails). With the job market the way it is, I have come to the conclusion that it is all about the numbers game. With applying for 3k jobs, I've had hundreds of phone calls and maybe 20-25 in person interviews. As someone previously said, keep trucking. Keep filling up your inbox with rejection letters. The more recruiters you're resume gets in front of the better and higher chances are that you get the call/interview. Be very methodical in your approach to interviews. Write out a script and stick to it even on the calls when it may sound robotic. The interviewer is not paying close attention anyway and is only looking for keywords here or there so make sure to drop those words relative to the job. Then when you are called for an inperson interview, memorize that script. Spend the couple days before the interview visualizing the script and embed it into your brain so it rolls off of your tongue and into the ears of the hiring manager effortlessly.

Hope this helps.

Good Luck!

3,000 job applications and only 20 in-person interviews - you're clearly in no position to be giving anybody advice.

My quick diagnosis of you guys is that you're morons. There's no other explanation for so many applications and no jobs.

I did one application to the best firm in the industry, went through interviews, and then got in. 1 application, 4 interviews, 1 job.

Give up and get some 30k/year accounting job at a paper company - you're clearly not cut out for this.

I'd like to see some silver bananas for keeping it real.

LOL

Dec 20, 2015

Maybe you suck at interviewing? After 30 it's shocking to be batting .000

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Dec 20, 2015

The boardies bring up a good point - seems like you've had quite a few in-person interviews (chances to prove yourself!). You're getting opportunities, but not converting.. There must be a reason why and it cannot simply be the story regarding your last job. Potential employers have looked past that - as they've already screened you and subsequently brought you in for in-house interviews.

Do a mock interview with an acquaintance/mentor/alumnus. If you can, film it.. You'll be surprised to see what tendencies you have (facial expressions, body language, quirks, etc.) Get some honest feedback! Can you take a stepping-stone job for now? Resume gaps suck..

Good luck to you and do not give up!! The economy may suck, but there are still jobs out there for the hungriest. Stay hungry bro!!

Dec 20, 2015
drew.spencer.stevens:

The boardies bring up a good point - seems like you've had quite a few in-person interviews (chances to prove yourself!). You're getting opportunities, but not converting.. There must be a reason why and it cannot simply be the story regarding your last job. Potential employers have looked past that - as they've already screened you and subsequently brought you in for in-house interviews.

Do a mock interview with an acquaintance/mentor/alumnus. If you can, film it.. You'll be surprised to see what tendencies you have (facial expressions, body language, quirks, etc.) Get some honest feedback! Can you take a stepping-stone job for now? Resume gaps suck..

Good luck to you and do not give up!! The economy may suck, but there are still jobs out there for the hungriest. Stay hungry bro!!

Definitely good advice.
And if you can't find someone to mock interview you or just feel uncomfortable doing it, record a video of yourself on your comp answering some typical interview questions and then have someone look at it. Maybe you have a random twitch or something that you don't know about when you answer questions. Sounds funny, but I've seen it happen. I mock interviewed one of my buddies last year and he kept stroking his chin. Probably not the only thing that kept him from a FT offer at first, but still weird.

Dec 20, 2015

Thanks to those who gave positive feedback.
Here is what I figured from this post: Be persistent, don't give up, and suck it up.

Appreciate it Monkeys!

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

I can only speak from personal experience but I'm in the same boat as you. 3.0 GPA, non-target, History major but I'm still getting interviews. I have yet to get an analyst offer though.

Even at 25, I would start as if I was a sophomore in college. Start out at a PWM firm as an intern and in the meantime sign up for Breaking into Wall Street-- Financial Modeling. (It would show your level of dedication to learning the skills necessary to be successful without spending 1,000 on the CFA).

Then next, I would sign up for Linkedin and search all alumni and send out e-mails like crazy for advice or if they heard anything that was pocket job listing. Build relationships with these people, I talked on the phone with someone at a major investment company every sunday for hours.

My next advice is to not blow it when the opportunity comes. I've done this multiple times but learning from my own mistakes. Keep remembering that you want to be an analyst and that's the only thing you want to do. You never lose unless you give up.

The cards are stacked against us but people have beaten odds far greater than ours. Just keep trucking and be tactical in everything you approach. Finding perspective in everything is key to keep trucking on no matter how bad it gets.

Dec 20, 2015

And for those who are thinking about writing for the CFA, I'd advise against it. You are spending 1,000 on a test where there is no guarantee in passing. If you fail (60% chance of doing so), you're back at square one. I've been getting the same amount of interview replies as I was when I was a CFA Level 1 Candidate. You can learn all the material without spending that amount of money (not even including the prep materials). And not to mention the pain you feel when you receive a high band after all that work.

Dec 20, 2015

Just out of curiosity what is your race ?

I am in the same boat , a shit load of interviews , and no Job .
I even had a Phone Interview with the FED .

I trade now to make some chump change while I look for a Job . I started with Binaries its weird but I found a platform in the USA , and its ok once you get the hang of it .

Dec 20, 2015

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The Auto Show

Dec 20, 2015

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Dec 20, 2015

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The Auto Show

Dec 20, 2015

Maybe you just got dinged because you didn't have the "hot pants" skills. Read more about how a candidate lost against a Hot body girl

Dec 20, 2015
Financier4Hire:

Maybe you just got dinged because you didn't have the "hot pants" skills. Read more about how a candidate lost against a Hot body girl

Dec 20, 2015

Who are your references?

Also, don't lie about getting fired. Your answer sounds like a huge cover up. No one leaves a job because of lack of challenge/growth prospects in a shitty economy if they have no new job afterwards. I would ding you just because of that. Be honest; yet you can embellish the truth a little by changing the point of view (see below).

People get fired in downsizings (usually). Do you know how many people got fired that month/quarter? You should mention that it's a tough economy and that cuts happened, and you were on the wrong side of things.

Dec 20, 2015
Themistocles:

Who are your references?

Also, don't lie about getting fired. Your answer sounds like a huge cover up. No one leaves a job because of lack of challenge/growth prospects in a shitty economy if they have no new job afterwards. I would ding you just because of that. Be honest; yet you can embellish the truth a little by changing the point of view (see below).

People get fired in downsizings (usually). Do you know how many people got fired that month/quarter? You should mention that it's a tough economy and that cuts happened, and you were on the wrong side of things.

I know it's stupid of me to lie, but in the past 24 hours I received 2 phone interviews and for both I said I was let go, BUT I gave a solid reason why. Now on, no more cover ups, just the truth. Let's see the difference this will make. Thanks!

No contract means I have all the power. They want me, but they can't have me. - Don Draper

Dec 20, 2015

I know what your problem is....it's that you have applied to 330 positions. Now we all know that's an awful lot of supply for such little demand. I bet they google you and can draw a road map of all the online "job search" accounts you have created. I say that's one red flag. The other is that applying online isn't what it used to be. You need to network better. I hate the term "network" because it's used too often but stop applying online and start using LinkedIn. Even it you can find the slightest connection that is a friend of a friend it will help you get in the door easier than if you are just dropping resumes left and right online. Stop dropping bombs and start connecting the dots with your friends and family.

I pity the man who has dreams of success yet lacks the hunger to turn those dreams into reality

Dec 20, 2015

OP, I can relate. I've been searching for almost a year. I was laid-off from my pervious position as part of a major downsizing. Even with that explanation, and strong references, it has been very rough.

The economy is bad and the IB market is particularly week. Many believe it's in a secular downslide. So take that for what it's worth.

Dec 20, 2015

Also, while I agree it makes sense to have a glass-is-half-full explanation for getting fired, I'm not sure I would volunteer it. Keep it in your back pocket. Rather, try to keep the conditions vague and imply it was due to the economy, without lying. Most interviewers will immediately understand and assume you were laid-off given the time period. Only if they ask about why you were let go, should you explain why.

Dec 20, 2015

Look, I agree that 10 interviews at 10 different companies is not something to be proud of.
But look, in 2006 straight out of college, knowing nothing I spent 1 months getting 3 interviews and 1 offer at buy side IM/HF. I now have professional qualifications, a masters degree in finance, 4 years of great works experience, stellar references, yet have spent 6 months, 100 applications, networking and zero interviews.

I was the same person then, just clueless... it seems to me it is exactly what he says it is, THE ECONOMY.

Dec 20, 2015

Should try to focus on getting the interview part right. When the questions of your old company comes up, make sure you have a good story and can recite it effortlessly. Tailor your answers to the that specific job that you have and what the company is looking for. Engage your interviewer and know everything about the company. Overall fit questions are more important than technical ones, but if you know them both, then great. Work harder and smarter and you should land a job.

You're walking around blind without a cane, pal. A fool and his money are lucky enough to get together in the first place.

Gordon Gekko

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Best Response
Jun 23, 2014

I remember being in the same boat in my senior year of undergrad. Crap ton of interviews at high-end, highly competitive companies, but no offers....

I didn't understand what I was doing wrong. Experience was top notch, nailed all the technical questions, I'm physically appealing as hell (okay, getting cocky now..), well fuck, what gives?

I was out in LA on a final interview and I was sitting in the lobby waiting for my end of interview lunch meeting. I could overhear the HR woman down the hall, talking to one of the consultants, "he's a really nice guy, very professional, just sometimes... too professional and formal, I think he'd be better for a business dev role.."

That was a crusher, but it also made a lot of the sense, given the same assumptions my friends were telling me the whole time, I was being overly formal, and that can look very 'douchey' during interviews..

Be honest with yourself and ask, "am I not being me?". Cause I'm telling you, the second I was myself, and was more relaxed, was the second I was getting offers left and right.

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Jun 20, 2014

Solid advice.

Dec 20, 2015

Im not earning 50m a year. Im 23. Any suggestions?

Dec 20, 2015

Dude, your first several interviews are going to be rocky. The more you do, the better you get. Also, it's hard to land a job as a sophomore.

Dec 20, 2015

get 96 more before you start asking this question

pick up the interview guides, memorize them

and keep plugging away at it

Dec 20, 2015

youre a sophomore! i had 0 success in applying for the sophomore rotational programs at the BBs. they accept like 4 out of a few thousand applicants! dont worry about it though and dont get discouraged (i got offers at every BB i applied to for this summer)

Dec 20, 2015
bankersa329123:

youre a sophomore! i had 0 success in applying for the sophomore rotational programs at the BBs. they accept like 4 out of a few thousand applicants! dont worry about it though and dont get discouraged (i got offers at every BB i applied to for this summer)

What did you end up doing for your post-sophomore summer?

Dec 20, 2015

Only two were at a BB. The other two were at relatively easier companies to work for with much lower standards.

Dec 20, 2015
ToughStreet:

Only two were at a BB. The other two were at relatively easier companies to work for with much lower standards.

You need to chill out and come back after you have failed 30 interviews

Dec 20, 2015

Awesome- you got interviews with BBs as a sophomore. Most people who land in banking didn't get them until they were juniors.

Dec 20, 2015

Am I the only one who thinks this is an obvious bad signal?

If you got interviews as a sophomore you obviously had a good resume and sufficient experiences. Walk us through your interviews and let's see where you fucked up.

Dec 20, 2015

When you say 0 for 4, do you mean you get dinged after 1st round, or dinged after several rounds each time? If the former, maybe you can re-evaluate what you've done right and wrong in your interviews... If the latter, then chances are you're just up against more experienced candidates and it may be out of your hands.

But really, like the others have said, I think you're over panicking over a few tries.

Dec 20, 2015

You have to be a superstar, not just on paper, to land a BB SA.

Dec 20, 2015

I hate to sound insensitive, but how the fuck are we supposed to be able to help you when you haven't told us anything about yourself or your interviews?

But like others have said before me, it does get easier the more you do it. I had 8 interviews this year and only got an offer on the last one. After each interview, I focused on improving where I could have done better. I'm about 100x better now than I was at my first interview.

Dec 20, 2015

Dinged 1st round for iBanking, dinged 2nd round for another interview, dinged phone interview, dinged in-person interview.

I was confident about 2/4 of the interviews. The 3rd was so-so. The Banking interview went ok but I was stumped by a question.

Dec 20, 2015

OP, I saw a stat once, that on average it takes 5 interviews to get one offer. In other words, going 0/4 is not that bad...

Dec 20, 2015

Bro I got dinged for FT offers twice ... at the same company. To put it into perspective: I'm still currently interning at this company. Granted, now I know about plan Bs.

Dec 20, 2015

I was 0/10 at some point, chillax

Dec 20, 2015

I hit a triple digit number before getting the SA offer.

Dec 20, 2015

0/4.4 ... maybe the next 0.6 will go well

Dec 20, 2015
Blue Baller:

0/4.4 ... maybe the next 0.6 will go well

LOL!

Dec 20, 2015
Blue Baller:

0/4.4 ... maybe the next 0.6 will go well

second this lol

Dec 20, 2015

0 for 4 means zero for four?

Dec 20, 2015

Relax, I failed between 30-40 interviews before landing something.

Dec 20, 2015

3/60 back in my recruitment days and you wont be getting offers after 1 interview. keep on grinding, its gonna get better from interview to interview and its a numbers game

Dec 20, 2015

This is terrifying. I have my first interview coming up and didn't realize the chances were so low. It's only this difficult at the bulge brackets correct? I mean if I'm interviewing for a regional boutqiue, for an off season internship, do I really only have a 5% chance of getting in. This is what you guys make it out to be.

Dec 20, 2015

You can't worry about odds, chances, etc.. I know this sounds corny but you'll get the job you get. 0/4 as a sophomore is nothing.

Dec 20, 2015

If you need to ask us what went wrong, then you clearly can't overcome it. Yes, that's mean, but it should be helpful... one of the things you need to master is self awareness. If you can't go to 4 interviews, fail and realize what you're doing wrong then you have bigger issues.

Dec 20, 2015

L0l. I went 0/5 in BB superdays this year... Dont hear me complaining.. Get out there and work on it.

Dec 20, 2015

Some of the stats here are wild...I don't know if that's really the norm-- or maybe my stats are just the exception. Regardless, self-awareness is key. If you don't know, we can't really help-- since the only ones who do know are the interviewers, you COULD ask for feedback on your interviewing/qualifications from those guys. People don't do this often (not often enough, in my opinion), but if you reach out and frame it as though you'd like to get better and become a stronger candidate down the line (NOT as though you're asking them why you didn't get it.. definitely DON'T do that), they usually see it as a sign of maturity and are willing to give you some insight.

But seriously, you're a sophomore. That's probably the feedback you're going to get from them. Chin up, you're young yet.

Dec 20, 2015
NYCSA:

Some of the stats here are wild...I don't know if that's really the norm-- or maybe my stats are just the exception. Regardless, self-awareness is key. If you don't know, we can't really help-- since the only ones who do know are the interviewers, you COULD ask for feedback on your interviewing/qualifications from those guys. People don't do this often (not often enough, in my opinion), but if you reach out and frame it as though you'd like to get better and become a stronger candidate down the line (NOT as though you're asking them why you didn't get it.. definitely DON'T do that), they usually see it as a sign of maturity and are willing to give you some insight.

But seriously, you're a sophomore. That's probably the feedback you're going to get from them. Chin up, you're young yet.

The stats on here are better than average. Most people cant get 30+ interviews like the posters on here. Many people that I've spoken to with finance/consulting internships and better GPAs than me are shocked to here that I've had a double-digit number of interviews. Most people are hard-pressed to get one interview, even if they are "well-qualified." Even if they do get in the interview room, they probably have approximately the same chance of landing the offer as us.

In sum, the rates on here for these past 2 years are better than your average college graduate.

Dec 20, 2015

double post.

Dec 20, 2015

2/800 as a sophomore.

"I do not think that there is any other quality so essential to success of any kind as the quality of perseverance. It overcomes almost everything, even nature."

Dec 20, 2015

I almost freaked out for a second there when I saw MMM post. Thought he was back then I looked at the date and almost cried.

Follow the shit your fellow monkeys say @shitWSOsays

Life is hard, it's even harder when you're stupid - John Wayne

Dec 20, 2015

You're at least getting interviews! I'm getting 0 interviews.

Dec 20, 2015

As a sophomore I got 1 offer after about 20-25 interviews.
As a junior I went through about 10-15 interviews including superdays and took the first offer I got.
As a senior (currently) I only did 4 interviews (first round and super day at two BB IBs) and got 1 offer.

So 3 out of 40+ interviews. And now I'm going to be a IB Analyst. You can do it.

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Dec 20, 2015
energycox12:

As a sophomore I got 1 offer after about 20-25 interviews.

As a junior I went through about 10-15 interviews including superdays and took the first offer I got.

As a senior (currently) I only did 4 interviews (first round and super day at two BB IBs) and got 1 offer.

So 3 out of 40+ interviews. And now I'm going to be a IB Analyst. You can do it.

why..

Dec 20, 2015
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