Canadian undergrad b-schools: Schulich vs. Laurier vs. UofT Commerce/Rotman

A friend's little sister asked me for advice on which undergrad b-school program to pursue between the '2nd/3rd tiers' because she may not have the marks for Ivey/Queens/McGill (I came from one of those 3). So the choice was mainly between UofT Commerce, Laurier BBA co-op (not the double degree), and York Schulich. She'll also likely apply to Waterloo and McMaster.

She doesn't know what she wants to do yet. But banking and consulting are areas of interest. Not so much accounting.

I told her, just based on what I've seen, that Laurier kids (at least the top ones) seem to do well, because they benefit from the co-op program. I have met some Laurier alums on Bay St - but I don't know if this is rare. I have also met UofT alums. Don't know too much about Schulich.

Also I figure, with the Laurier co-op, she could potentially benefit from the work exp, and always apply to join Ivey in the final 2 yrs.

I was wondering if current or recent grads of these schools can comment, so I can direct her to this site?

Thanks

Edit: And yes, I've tried the search function, and read through a few of the prior posts. But there seems to be some discrepancies, and some posts are kind of dated.

 

Well school year's just started. She thinks she'll have high 80's (87 to 89) with a possibility of hitting 90 on the dot. So she'll have a small chance at Ivey and Queens if she can get 90, but in case that doesn't happen, she wants to know her alternatives.

 

Re. Ivey, she only needs to be able to get into Western (any program) and then from there be able to perform in first and second year such that she can pull a ~85% average. If she thinks she can do that, then Ivey's still on the table. Definitely a more risky strategy, but that's what I did. AEO, however, may be tough at this point.

 
PeterChao:
McMaster does NOT require 82%+

My friend had 72 average and got in (she obviously turned it down cuz it's a trash school)

Lol, that is bullshit. 82% is the absolute minimum, you're friend is likely made up. I have a friend who called and said my average is 76% and was informed he wouldn't be considered. P.S, McMaster was one of 4 Canadian schools to list in the globe n mails top 100 in the top 500 world university rankings, generally ranks top 100 in most yearly publications so I'd get my facts straight. Non of the schools he mentioned are rubbish. You, however, are a silly fool for finding pleasure in trashing schools for no apparent reason.

 

in respect to the business programs offered at the respective schools, macs business program is typically a backup and generally seen as inferior to the aforementioned ones. doesn't mean that its shit but it isn't top tier. their med school tho is top notch which is where their rankings typically come from

 

If she can't even get into ivey/queens/mgcill she probably can't compete for banking. Even most of the kids at the target schools fail, you are saying that your sister can't even get IN to one of them.

 
telus325:
If she can't even get into ivey/queens/mgcill she probably can't compete for banking. Even most of the kids at the target schools fail, you are saying that your sister can't even get IN to one of them.

Telus: Not my sis, man, my buddy's - attention to detail now. : ) And that's not entirely true. People don't just get into Ivey through AEO (90%+ in HS). They can also apply in their second yr univ. I've met a number of people who didn't get 90%+ in high school, but for whatever reason really stepped up their game in university and got in to Ivey and eventually banking/consulting.

But I do agree with your thoughts on UofT (# of students in commerce program vs. number hired seems kind of low).

What about Laurier vs. UofT (or Schulich, if it's attainable while the big 3 [I/Q/McG] are not)? Or if she plans to transfer to Ivey in 3rd yr regardless, which of the 3 schools would make the transition easiest?

 

From a Canadian in NYC with friends who go/went to all above schools:

Ivey and McGill would be best. True, if she doesn't have the ability to get into those, she will have a harder route into banking but it's not impossible. Networking and doing extremely well/getting some finance experience through internships would be necessary.

Queens is better than UWO overall but Ivey is pretty well-represented on WS.

UofT is probably next down the ladder; good placement since is in T.O. (whereas Queens is in Kingston aka Buttfuck and McGill is in Montreal).

Schulich - OK.

McMaster is shit.

 

Trust me bro, even tho rotman have the proximity to the street, the undergrads can't do anything about it cuz theres no organized job help in a coop program or otherwise and the school culture is so shit that networking is a bust

 
Best Response

Yes I agree, people do step their game up, but what I meant is that if your friend's sister has her game stepped up already and can't get into these schools (which are also filled with retards), then she might not be competitive enough (on a relative basis).

AEO is really easy to get into and it proves nothing, plenty of these kids don't even make it into Ivey. And on average, the transfers to Ivey outperform AEOs.

The U of T alums you know of on the street are mainly Rotman MBAs and MFEs, the undergraduate recruitment at U of T is not good at all, you need to really really stand out to get an offer even at the lower Canadian banks.

Laurier vs. UofT --> Take WLU imo, their co-op places at least as much as uoft (very likely more, although not a target). Also, grading at wlu isn't as cutthroat as it is at UofT, so she will have an easier time transitioning. Furthermore, the lifestyle is horrible at UofT and the commerce students here pay excessive fees (12k in 2nd year and up). Its really hard to fit in unless you are from an asian background and can relate to this atmosphere. It is not only wasting money, but also sacrificing many other things.

For Schulich you need a 90+, and its placements are also on the uoft-undergrad level, although there is more competition for finance there.


Placements: wlu > schulich/uoft * Do some linkedin searches, on the undergraduate level wlu beats both of these schools, although they are all very similar. The co-op program there does ok with getting kids into the lower Canadian banks (provided they are top performers)

Ease of transfering: wlu > schulich > uoft * I know that there was around 6 ppl who transferred from schluich>ivey this year, 2 from uoft, and 1-2 from wlu.

Lifestyle for 2 years: wlu > schulich/uoft * You are surrounded by international students who only relate to each other, its a personal choice, I'm personally not for it.

I personally attend 1 of these 3 (schulich/uoft) and will also be transferring (2013 year) so I know a bit about all of these schools / etc.

 
telus325:
Yes I agree, people do step their game up, but what I meant is that if your friend's sister has her game stepped up already and can't get into these schools (which are also filled with retards), then she might not be competitive enough (on a relative basis).

AEO is really easy to get into and it proves nothing, plenty of these kids don't even make it into Ivey. And on average, the transfers to Ivey outperform AEOs.

The U of T alums you know of on the street are mainly Rotman MBAs and MFEs, the undergraduate recruitment at U of T is not good at all, you need to really really stand out to get an offer even at the lower Canadian banks.

Laurier vs. UofT --> Take WLU imo, their co-op places at least as much as uoft (very likely more, although not a target). Also, grading at wlu isn't as cutthroat as it is at UofT, so she will have an easier time transitioning. Furthermore, the lifestyle is horrible at UofT and the commerce students here pay excessive fees (12k in 2nd year and up). Its really hard to fit in unless you are from an asian background and can relate to this atmosphere. It is not only wasting money, but also sacrificing many other things.

For Schulich you need a 90+, and its placements are also on the uoft-undergrad level, although there is more competition for finance there.


Placements: wlu > schulich/uoft * Do some linkedin searches, on the undergraduate level wlu beats both of these schools, although they are all very similar. The co-op program there does ok with getting kids into the lower Canadian banks (provided they are top performers)

Ease of transfering: wlu > schulich > uoft * I know that there was around 6 ppl who transferred from schluich>ivey this year, 2 from uoft, and 1-2 from wlu.

Lifestyle for 2 years: wlu > schulich/uoft * You are surrounded by international students who only relate to each other, its a personal choice, I'm personally not for it.

I personally attend 1 of these 3 (schulich/uoft) and will also be transferring (2013 year) so I know a bit about all of these schools / etc.

Telus - thanks man, very helpful. That's in line w/ my suspicion b/w the 3 schools, but not being from those 3 and only having a couple examples to go by (e.g., knowing a guy from laurier who transferred to ivey, and one other one from schulich), wanted to be sure before giving her baseless advice. I had met a kid who's from UofT who secured a big bank offer, but he had to put in a lot of extra effort on his own time to get it cause the school doesn't help polish the kids like at Queens/Ivey. I guess this is true...

Don't know about the transfers outdoing the AEOs. I think it's about the same... Hard to compare success since there's more transfers than AEOs at Ivey. Like you said, a bunch of AEOs don't end up at Ivey - either because they can't make the 80% or ECs to sustain their conditional offer, or just decide that business isn't for them.

The AEOs that stay smart and hungry throughout univ and Ivey do extremely well. And the transfers that really step up their game and continue throughout Ivey also do very well. I think it's all about how aggressive they are in the 1st yr at Ivey. After converting that sweet summer offer to FT, then they can ease up and coast a bit.

She's the type to do well (but not amazing) without trying 100%. So I guess she should do alright if she tried harder. But yeah, I agree, I've met a huge range of people at univ (some brilliant, and some who are surprisingly dumb...)

Anyone else got thoughts on this too?

 

Top 5, yeah definitely. Ivey, Queens, Mcgill, Waterloo, Laurier are the main ones now.

 

For what it's worth, Queen's does not consider the applicant's marks provided that it's above 87%+. Your admission is dependent completely on your Personal Statement of Experience. Also, I see many people who got Ivey AEO with 88%~90% averages so your friend still has a shot as long as her extracurriculars and essays are good.

 

I think what you said about that 87%+ thing is garbage, a 95% with the same ECs as a 92 will have a better chance. They rank people based on grades before they even look at PSEs, its the only sensible way. Nobody wants a bunch of idiots in their program.

 

Although most of the comments about placement is true. Rotman admissions are almost solely based on marks, and last years average admission average was 92%. So, if marks are the problem UofT is probably not a good backup plan.

 

Dinged at semi-target school ED.  Already applied to Queens and Schulich. What's the state of OCR at both now that the TN visa is somewhat suspect (according to rumors/reddit/WSO)? As a dual citizen, do I just send off CVs to companies directly that have recruited in past but don't come now because of visa issues?

 

I went to laurier and know lots of alum in IB at both the globals and CAD banks and PE/Pensions on Bay St and in NY. UofT is a place you go if you need help committing suicide, laurier on the other hand has an incredible culture, good placement, strong co-op that lets you get a feel for what you like and don't like, and strong clubs that teach networking/how to finance. 

 

1)UofT

2) Laurier

3) York

UofT has the best placement across Canadian IB for all of those schools as well as a very strong alumni network. Laurier has decent placement for its tier and has landed some kids in NY IBD. York used to be good but that's MBA not UG.

UofT can land you Big5, National, Canaccord & maybe a BB/EB in Toronto.

 

Really UofT undergrad above York and Laurier? I know Rotmans grad school kills but relative to York and Laurier I'm pretty sure UofT is dead last.

York is probably number 1 given they have a larger alumni network than Laurier but honestly in the past few years Lauriers pumped out a ton of people into banking and for what it's worth they're great to party with 

 

Quam aut aut doloremque adipisci quia. Ut delectus repellat ullam consequatur fugiat rerum eaque. Repudiandae dolorem saepe atque ad fugit quam sed.

Perspiciatis dolor sit officia magnam quod consequatur. Provident alias culpa nobis alias.

Commodi necessitatibus itaque suscipit. Eaque rem voluptatum aut nisi ut. Dolor est nesciunt quasi molestiae eveniet dolore. Iusto nulla ea voluptatem rem eaque. Laborum nemo sed reiciendis molestias labore.

Soluta ut deleniti et quos. Aliquam quia sint id omnis aliquam. Officiis dolores distinctio dolorem minima consequatur ut ipsa.

Career Advancement Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company 02 99.4%
  • Goldman Sachs 19 98.8%
  • Harris Williams & Co. (++) 98.3%
  • Lazard Freres 02 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 03 97.1%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Harris Williams & Co. 18 99.4%
  • JPMorgan Chase 10 98.8%
  • Lazard Freres 05 98.3%
  • Morgan Stanley 07 97.7%
  • William Blair 03 97.1%

Professional Growth Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Lazard Freres 01 99.4%
  • Jefferies & Company 02 98.8%
  • Goldman Sachs 17 98.3%
  • Moelis & Company 07 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 05 97.1%

Total Avg Compensation

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Director/MD (5) $648
  • Vice President (19) $385
  • Associates (86) $261
  • 3rd+ Year Analyst (13) $181
  • Intern/Summer Associate (33) $170
  • 2nd Year Analyst (66) $168
  • 1st Year Analyst (202) $159
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (144) $101
notes
16 IB Interviews Notes

“... there’s no excuse to not take advantage of the resources out there available to you. Best value for your $ are the...”

Leaderboard

1
redever's picture
redever
99.2
2
Secyh62's picture
Secyh62
99.0
3
Betsy Massar's picture
Betsy Massar
99.0
4
BankonBanking's picture
BankonBanking
99.0
5
kanon's picture
kanon
98.9
6
CompBanker's picture
CompBanker
98.9
7
dosk17's picture
dosk17
98.9
8
DrApeman's picture
DrApeman
98.9
9
GameTheory's picture
GameTheory
98.9
10
bolo up's picture
bolo up
98.8
success
From 10 rejections to 1 dream investment banking internship

“... I believe it was the single biggest reason why I ended up with an offer...”