I am enjoying my winter break now, so I have some time to answer any questions that you may have. I read many posts on the MIT MFin program when I was considering it, so thought I would give back to the WSO community. Ask away!
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What firms and jobs show up for OCR?
All major and lots of boutique firms show up (only major bank that wasn't there was JP Morgan). Variety of fields including IB, S&T, HF (lots of quant funds), prop trading (every prop shop that matters is there), etc. Also a lot of corporate finance roles at large companies (GM, Caesars Entertainment, Apple are a few examples). It is nice because MFins are able to go through graduate level OCR through Sloan and also the MIT main campus OCR.
How would you rate the program for someone who wants to break into quantitative finance? (As compared to other top MFE programs)
What do you think the Adcoms focus on while selecting candidates for the 18-month variant of the program?
I would rate it as a top MFE program. The program can be as quanty as you would like it be depending on your electives. For instance, I took a quant finance course this semester with a professor that used to run his own quant hedge fund. I could have taken more quant focused courses, but I am not trying to break into that area of finance. Lots of OCR for quant roles, as employers view MIT as a quant heavy school.
Oh, and I can't really give too much insight on what the admissions staff is looking for, but I would say try to stand out as much as possible. Everyone here has amazing GRE/gmat scores, undergrad GPA's from great schools and top notch internship/full-time experience. Just try to make yourself stand out from the crowd.
Do you have your ft job lined up for next year? Also how was the recruiting and what did you do this past summer?
I currently do not (I do have 2 final round interviews scheduled atm), as what I am looking for is more off-cycle. I would say the OCR is nice, however you will likely still need to network. Going through the MIT and Sloan alumni database is outstanding, as you are likely to find at least one individual working in the area or company you are interested in.
I graduated in December and was working at a fundamental long/short hedge fund until I came here. Looking to go a different route in finance.
Why did you decide on the MFIN instead of an MBA or other graduate programs? Also thanks for doing this.
A few reasons: -wanted a degree focused on finance and didn't require general business MBA requirements that I wouldn't use -1 year vs. 2 years of tuition payments and missed salary -I may be biased as I am in the program, but it is relatively young (8 years oldish?) and so far has stellar class profiles. 7% acceptance rate (not online but they told us that when we came for orientation), 3.7 average GPA and 690-770 80% GMAT range. Compare that to Sloan's MBA class of 3.6 GPA and 670-760 GMAT or HBS 11% acceptance rate, 3.66 GPA and 700-760 GMAT. In my opinion, the selectivity, quality of the program and reputaiton will continue to improve in the coming years.
Sswag Do you mind commenting on your stats? GPA, GMAT/GRE, caliber of undergrad, internship experience, etc. You don't have give explicit names or geographical locations if you don't want. Also, are most people in the program older (25-27ish) or are there a ton of young guys (21-23) who just graduated from undergrad? Thanks so much for doing this.
I went to a top 40 undergrad. Dual degree in engineering/economics. 170Q 159V. engineering, wealth management and hedge fund internships. 80% of individuals come from undergrad directly or have 1 or 2 years of experience.
Thanks for doing this OP. Do you advise people without any finance experience to consider this program? Do the people who place into BB IBD or Investment Management generally have some sort of prior finance experience like an internship?
It would be a great program for individuals without any finance experience as you learn a lot, however it would be tough (possibly impossible) to get in the program without any experience in finance whatsoever. I can't think of anyone I know that didn't at least have one quality finance internship in the program. I don't know what the admissions staff looks for so I could be wrong. That is just my personal opinion.
For the 2018 intake, a Russian female student was among the 25 students worldwide admitted to the highly selective (4% admission rate) to Princeton University's Master in Finance (M.Fin) program.
Her work experience only involved McKinsey & Google Marketing internships.
No previous finance-related relevant experience at all.
If Princeton admitted her, surely MIT would have as well.
So maybe that required finance experience you bring up isn't that necessary after all, in terms of eligibility. :)
Your stats? Do you have a stem background? What is their prerequisites requirement for business undergrads like? I read on their website that they have this special course mandatory for all students who don't have sufficient quantitative background, is that true?
Look at my other post for stats. You will need the required math courses they list online. The mandatory course (unless you test out of it) in the summer goes over probability, statistics, linear algebra and stochastic processes among other things. It is very worthwhile to take, even if you believe yourself to be an expert on the subjects.
Why establish such heavy quantitative testing if the possibility of tailoring a Corporate Finance Concentration is included in what appears to be an very flexible program.
The requirement page also refers to coding proficiency and cites examples of coding programs to master as a prospective student.
Seriously? Even coding?!
Placements for competitor LBS (MFA) are just as impressive and the curriculum isn't half as demanding. For individuals looking to pursue the classic BB IBD route, It seems like a big portion of what this program offers is regrettably irrelevant.
Would welcome any input on this, please.
Should MIT offer a two year option so students can get internships?
They already offer 18 month option, with extra time for internship. 2 year is unnecessary, MIT is not Princeton. Plus that program is not that quantitative, geared towards different people. I think it's perfect program.
MIT has a pretty darned good program especially when you've got Merton teaching classes. Trust me-- my younger brother did his MFin there and I'm incredibly proud he got into a graduate program at MIT. (He is also very smart and has a better work ethic than me so it didn't come as a complete shock that he was a good fit.)
But I get the sense that MIT might have over-engineered the schedule a bit. In order to get you out of there in a year, they take your summer. Other students are using that to intern and forge relationships with employers.
I really wonder if everyone would be happier with a three semester fall/spring/fall program with an optional fourth (spring) semester. Students can spend the summer interning or getting a much-needed break before grad school; professors can enjoy a slight let-up in the schedule during their summer, too. You only give up 6 months of work (less if you count a summer internship or two), but you get an extra dice roll on the job market. Given that you're spending $100K after tax and forgoing a decent amount of savings on top of that for your career, six months of salary may be worth it for an extra shot at a good placement. MIT does not do badly on placements with a one year program-- they might blow everyone out of the water with a two year program.
Great program. If this program were around when I was younger, I definitely would've applied for it.
It seems like much of the placement has been into banking, consulting, and corporate finance, as opposed to prop trading, quant funds, sellside s&t. I wonder if that's because MIT MFin is not as quantitative as Princeton/Berkeley/Columbia/Carnegie Mellon/NYU and because the students are much younger?
Do grads from the MFin program start at the associate level or at the analyst level?
Mostly analysts. But depends on how much experience you have.
Hmm I'm not sure I'd call Princeton a specialized quant program. Stochal and Econometrics do get taught, but about one third to half of placements are IBD, management consulting, and PE. Maybe a better generalization (and this is a sweeping one) is that MIT is 2/3 MBA 1/3 MFE; Princeton is 1/3 MBA 2/3 MFE.
Sorry let's get us back on track, which is MIT. I think they could do better if MIT left more room for an internship. But I'd like to know if there's something I'm missing.
Both Berkeley and MIT make it tricky to do summer internships. Berkeley has Linda Kreitzman who is INFAMOUS for twisting people's arms, cracking skulls, placing 2AM phone calls, and doing whatever it takes to place people. If off-cycle internships were hurting Berkeley recruiting, Linda would be willing to call in a mob hit on people to fix that if necessary- so far that hasn't happened. MIT's program director is almost certainly a brilliant person and I'm just trying to figure out how a 12-month program works better for students overall than a standard 2, 3, or 4 semester program.
I am surprised and impressed by how aggressive career placement people at top mfin/mfe programs are. They personally reach out to companies, travel, and knock on people's doors to get people hired. I wish MBA career services was even one-tenth as helpful and aggressive.
I remembered greeting her at Berkeley. She handed me two resumes and said "you're going to hire these people." Ummm, OK? I'll think about it. "Don't think too long. They have final round interviews at BlackRock next week. This guy wrote a paper that extended one of [your coworker's boss's] papers. And everyone I know likes working with him."
Ok, make sure he stops by??
I'm exaggerating slightly, but if you ever recruit Berkeley MFEs, expect her to do a massive amount of homework on your firm and show up with one or two resumes that are a custom fit. She will then make her pitch with a personality that rivals Donald Trump, and you're not sure if the statements she's making are predictions or orders. And yeah, they're great fits at least on paper, but your arm is gonna hurt when you pick up that resume.
Either way she is awesome... but if you are a recruiter at Berkeley's MFE program... or a Berkeley MFE alumnus, just get ready to get Linda'd.
@OP, do they require interviews in person?
Yes, I don't believe you are allowed to skype interview.
Do you have any doctors (like MD) in your class?
LOL! MBA is best for career changers. A lot of these MSF and MFin programs require prior knowledge and prerequisites, which MDs don't have.
Completely inaccurate statement. Students With medical backgrounds are perfectly eligible to apply to pre-experience M.Fin. Programs.
They're highly sought after by the healthcare, pharmaceuticals, and/or life science practices in all sorts of financial services companies, especially for equity research positions.
Although, many M.D. Graduates from top national medical schools do begin careers in FO Healthcare IBD straight out of medical school, instead of matching for a clinical residency position in a hospital setting.
For an applicant X, how would you rate the probability of getting in the regular 12 month vs 18 month variant of the program? (which would be easier)
12 months has more spots available so it is easier
Some things I will mention: Placements in the program range dramatically. The curriculum is very flexible and you can make it as quanty as you would like. I have friends going into IBD, some going to hedge funds and others going into quant equity research and prop trading. In addition, I believe for this upcoming year 2,700 people applied for a class size of 120 (compared to 1,700 last year), so it is getting more competitive each year.
May I ask how you got that number: 2,700 people applying. That makes current applicant like me really scared.
It could just be a rumor, but I heard that number thrown around
Hi OP thanks for doing this,
I would move from IBD to wealth management/client relationship roles. as info I'm not in BB but elite boutique and in Europe not US so lateral is harder.
Would you suggest a Mfin or an MBA? considering that I'm looking only to US market/schools
Thanks!
It depends on your experience level. If you have been working 3+ years, I would recommend an MBA, however the MFin is only one year vs. two years for an MBA.
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