High-Finance is Bullshit
PE? You mean playing with the financials of the company and moving a bomb from one hand to another until it explodes due to the high leverage at which the business gets? Nice job on getting that fat paycheck for fucking a business in the ass.
HF? Maybe the most useless out there. Better to be in a scene fucking the girl instead of looking from the distance and betting what their next sex position will be.
IB? You mean creating templates which will be sent around the world and nobody will give a flying fuck? Fuck, even the garbage man knows that his daily activity leads to a result.
Yeah, "it doesn't matter how someone puts food on the table as long as it's not illegal", but if you got into high-finance you are intelligent and capable enough to do other things which are worthwhile for your community.
Reaching your 70s (if you don't get a heart attack for grinding 80 hours a week) you will look back and realize that everything which you did was to get a house with the highest walls to be comfortable leaving the world without nothing worthwhile to be appreciated by society.
You're better than that, I think.
Says the burnt out 1st year analyst lol
can you please shut the fuck up thank you
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realize that as soon as possible instead of getting a mid-life crisis in your 30s
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I can’t wait until your first 4am night
lol
I almost pissed myself at this comment. Ty
As region you put France, which explains a lot on your degree of laziness and retard
These points are actually quite valid. Unfortunately mostly other careers out there are also bullshit with worse pay, so just do you.
Agreed, but I think the message was if you're smart enough to be in IB you can probably go into Engineering, Medical Research or something that will yield tangible and helpful results in your lifetime.
Medical Research can be very boring. Watching paint dry for years is a good comparison on how slow it progresses and how little impact it may have. But everyone's different.
I know a BB IB analyst --> medical research --> an average US MD school and he seems super happy with his decision.
Medical research is similar to entrepreneurship in that only a small percentage actually make it (find something of value). For those who don’t, their life is endless simulations and variations of an experiment along with a bunch of paperwork for regulatory/ grant-seeking purposes.
There’s plenty of BS in those fields too regardless of what you think…
Yep, most white collar jobs today are just pushing paper and office politics, TPS reports, etc. We have so much computing power that work that used to take 40 hours can now take 2-3. So what are people doing with the other hours? Looking busy with minimal tangible productivity
Dom Portwood : Hi, Peter. What's happening? We need to talk about your TPS reports.
Peter Gibbons : Yeah. The coversheet. I know, I know. Uh, Bill talked to me about it.
Dom Portwood : Yeah. Did you get that memo?
Peter Gibbons : Yeah. I got the memo. And I understand the policy. And the problem is just that I forgot the one time. And I've already taken care of it so it's not even really a problem anymore.
Dom Portwood : Ah! Yeah. It's just we're putting new coversheets on all the TPS reports before they go out now. So if you could go ahead and try to remember to do that from now on, that'd be great. All right!
Office Space characterizes the monotony of most jobs.
I agree. Also you'll have people who work majority of their time and you'll have coworkers who don't work and push work to others. That's how working is.
I must say, I strongly disagree, respectfully. I think if you take PE as an example, while there isnt value creation for the average Joe employee, there absolutely is for the shareholders of the PE fund. Currently working at a portco and we are growing insanely quickly and in totally new directions, and we are partially PE owned. However, the fund has given us the green light to grow as we see fit. Stating PE funds are passing along a ticking time bomb shows little understanding of how PE funds successfully operate. How does improving cash flow to the point where you pay down most / all of the company's debt and change the cap structure materially result in a "time bomb"?
I see the logic with respect to HFs, and have much less exposure to this industry. However, all top performing HFs objectively provide above average returns for their investor pool. How is this not a tremendous value add to high net worth individuals and entities like pension funds?
Finally, IB from an advisory perspective absolutely has an inherent value. Selling anything is complicated. Ever try selling a video game? You need to utilize a third party service to connect you with prospective buyers (e,g., Ebay, Craigslist, a specialty site, etc.). Now imagine the asset is not a $30 gently used video game, but a $500 mm company that has been owned by a family for generations. You absolutely want financial experts with industry specific knowledge to connect you with the best prospective buyers, and to help you negotiate the optimal purchase agreement.
OPs post is such a low effort attempt at simplifying some of the most important positions within Finance. If these jobs were deemed bullshit, our salaries would reflect that of BO roles, implying they can be done with relative ease, without deep analyses, and have little impact on the company's top line. None of this is true for PE / HF / IB roles.
Yeah, I don't totally disagree. That's my argument when people say how much more value there is in being a tech employee ("what, you spend all day programming a LIKE button while I'm helping firefighters with their pensions").
Most of what you are describing though is pushing paper. Nobody's arguing that it isn't value add to someone. But what value you're adding (money) and in what way (pushing paper, analysis paralysis, trying to get on the good side of your MD so you get good projects and get to attend the meeting) is what we're talking about.
Have to agree with this. Also at a PE-backed company (a few PE firms all-together owns majority, name-brand firms) that was a LBO but is currently growing rapidly. Already valued at 2.5X of what it was brought for ~5 years ago.
wow dude you are a retard. thinking that making ultra-high net worth individuals even more money is a valuable feat in life (and as a counterargument to OP saying that other careers produce more value from society, like healthcare). The people on this site are truly so out of touch and braindead.
Don’t disagree with any of the points. You are absolutely right. But we all paid enough to turn a blind eye so it’s fine. (Loved the HFs one)
Volatility is back....HF might not be as useless as you think it is
Wake me up when insider trading is back... then you guys might have a chance again
Sir, this is Wendy’s
While some companies get fucked up in the ass, they might like anal?
Jokes aside, most people don't care for meaning as long as they get top dollar or euro or yen or yuan or whatever currency.
I don’t care about making a difference.
I like making money and funding my hobbies and lifestyle
jesus christ you r sick
Agree burned out 1st year Analyst... PE is much more than playing with financial nowadays, the times of just investing with no value creation plan, trusting the management and expect a high return while leveraging the company to the ground are over. To make decent returns you have to provide strong value creation capabilities and develop a playbook over time.
Also agree on HF although volatility might change things. Well on IB in terms of knowing your worth or results its as with any other Sales job no? Do it for the money...
My question to you (pointing the finger at others) what are you gonna do about it? Cry here?
Who gives a shit about society - society doesn’t give a shit about you until you’re successful or have money. get yours as long as you’re not hurting anyone.
not to mention if you’re actually charitable or invest in businesses for the long term (not vanilla PE), you’re creating more of an impact in society than any work you do as a lower paid, but meaningful job in the societal machine
any other engineers wanna join me for some popcorn while we watch these finance bros duke it out for position of Top Chad?
I could give a fuck if my work is meaningful so long as it makes me a millionaire by my early 30s.
Good ol' Super Hans
😂😂😂😂
You've clearly never worked a full-time role in a job that you believe has meaning and will contribute something to society. Go talk to any of your non existent friends who work at non profits and tell me if they're making an impact on the world / that their job isn't complete bullshit.
Lol yeah, you think I care? I know my job has no purpose, still collect a fat check though and that's really all that matters. You do understand that like 95% of all white collar "jobs" are bullshit right?
This is such a narrow sighted, aggressive interpretation of the investment banking analyst. Must reflect underlying #trauma… do tell, plz
I am pretty sure having an additional 10 minutes of sleep is more important for your sanity than typing a post that objectively does nothing
You ok, buddy? Sounds like you're having a tough day.
Bruh come join us in commodities. Its stressful yes. Long hours yes but not like IB. Having to deal with BS yes. But at the end of the day you are moving physical product A to B to make money.
Transaction-oriented high-finance (IB, PE, and VC. Big Law or Accounting doesn't really apply here because you NEED legal advice and AUDITING. Those are hard requirements for companies) is really a resource game. The brain drain is there because of the mundane bullshit those who do not possess resources need to go through.
That is why nepotism exists in the first place:
Daddy or Mommy can pull strings? Great ! I'll take your son/daughter as my analyst who can leave any day at 6pm and won't get staffed on shit deals or work past midnight, in exchange I'd like that sell-side M&A or IPO mandate please. Lead advisor and left lead sponsor. Actually, co-lead is fine.
That is also why MDs/Senior VPs are essentially sales people:
You develop resources and hopefully by the time you rise to senior VP you know your fucking shit, or you are born with golden spoon.
That is also why shitheads might be making millions while the bright kids are crunching numbers complaining:
Those whining kids do not possess resources.
I've seen this gal going from Analyst to senior VP in 3+ years because her dad is really high up in the government. That is essentially her dad monetizing on his personal resources. It's not easy for the government official to play business games because eyes are watching, but it's very natural and straightforward if George Bush's second cousin's niece is asking a CEO to lead on this hot IPO deal.
OP might still hold the thought that people who have made some money (let's say over $1mn as a humble threshold) are smart.
No, actually a lot of them aren't. A lot of them are though.
High-finance is no different in this split.
It hurts, doesn't it? Realizing that our society is inherently fed with bullshit.
No worse than higher ed. Sure a few are curing cancer, but the vast majority are not. Same with finance. A few are funding new cancer drugs that actually work, but most are not.
I’ve been thinking about this post and one thing you’re missing is that jobs that have a well defined positive benefit on society can quickly have a well defined negative benefit if things go south. This means these jobs by definition carry far more risk than is palatable for most on the finance path.
Engineering: If the design goes poorly or the building is not met to standards the structure can collapse, potentially even leading to several fatalities (such as the recent Miami condo collapse)
Medicine: One small twitch of your hand in a surgery can lead to serious permanent disabilities or even death of the patient. A misdiagnosis can also lead to serious issues if it was a disease not found quickly enough. Besides potentially losing your job there is the mental trauma that goes with that.
Others such as firefighters and cops are clearly operating in unsafe situations almost daily, putting their lives at risk.
All jobs are bullshit, though I’d rather deal with bullshit for 40 hours/week than be submerged in bullshit for 80 hour weeks with no life.
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I really think this just shows you dont understand Finance in a lot of ways.
-Any investing is to allocate capital to the places where it should be so businesses that benefit society can grow.
-Credit for instance is needed for the economy to expand and if allocated well it shouldn't blow up like 2008.
You are paid a lot in Finance because you can be doing things in the 100s of millions or billions. You're job can impact far more people than someone digging ditches or even a doctor. Yea you may not be curing cancer but you can sure put a ton of people out of business or help a ton of people prosper.
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