RBS withdraws grad offer with 0 working days until start date
Hey guys. I was due to start a grad role in M&A with a BB on Monday. I got this role back in April last year. They called me (and the other grads) Friday at 7pm to cancel the contract.
Given I am now graduated (already with a Masters) and all graduate roles for anything in investment banking, commercial banking, big 4 or any other role for that matter were handed out last year to commence right now, what on earth should I do? I still want to work in IB, but I realise that may be increasingly impossible. Any tips for me?
Make sure you keep in touch with the people you interviewed with. The industry has a lot of turnover so you never know when a position might open up.
oh wow....that sucks man. Def stay in touch with ppl that you interviewed with and keep applying/recruiting. I would suggest to target the boutique/MM IB since most of the BB are on hiring freeze...
oh dear.. i'm very sorry to hear that. have you received any compensation? would they hire you back if things got improved in future?
i'm curious to know which BB was cruel enough to do that days before your start date.
you can still find banking roles at smaller firms. i recently watched a youtube video about a wharton kid whose BB FT offer got rescind owing to her being non citizen (visa issues), but she managed to find a job at a small firm and lateraled to another BB 6 months later.
Wow... did this happen in the US or UK? Is this a BB?
BB. In Australia. Networking is definitely nowhere near as fruitful a path to jobs here as it is in USA. In fact, when I read suggestions on how to effectively network written by Americans it's pretty funny. If you did the sort of things that are advocated in America here, you'd probably be arrested for stalking or at least thought of as very weird and pushy. As for who interviewed me last APRIL, I have no idea. I vaguely remember their faces but not their names and I have not seen any of them since.
Yeah the idea of getting in to a boutique is good, but again I face the problem of those jobs starting Feb 2013! But I need something now. Should I cold email all the boutique investment banks (that by the way also rejected me outright in recruiting season last year)?
Sorry to hear about your offer. Best I can say is that if you landed a BB offer in the first place you can land a job just about anywhere.
wow few aussies come out of the closet!
dude from exp with grad rectruiting here (also did masters/4 rounds of GR), networking strats need to be adapted from US. however, 100% false to say 'nowhere near as fruitful'. don't bother with hectic spamming, but just use warm links to get intros etc. ppl here love to help out a punter, and in general less kids are onto that sorta thing so peeps here will be flattered by your approach for advice.
lev'g your sh*tty situation too...i once had a similar renegged offer and emailed this conundrum (in very concise form) to various recruiters/HR. Got 3 interviews from it - once ppl know someone wanted you, they get a semi and put on their laciest panties
also, not knowing who interviewed you last april = severe fail. not only should you have retained their b-cards, but also added them on linkein (esp if younger assoc/analysts)...keep this in mind for next time
gl and PM if still need help
Dually noted. I did not receive any business cards at the time though. Perhaps I should have asked for them, but my mind was more focussed on answering the incoming questions.
God damn that sucks.
Prime example of why nobody should put too much stock in renegging on banks when they'll do the same to you without hesitation.
Weren't you at RBS?
Fuck bro, that blows. Wish I had something more substantive to say but good luck.
Damn this is horrible. What kind of protection does Australian law offer ?
Sorry to hear that, it's quite rude and I hope that you will be able to bounce back Also why don't you give the name of the BB ?
Obviously hundreds of people are potentially aware of that so no risk for you. Moreover the biggest reason why banks try not to renege on offer is because of reputation risk. Indeed any summer intern with return offer from such a firm will try everything to get a job somewhere else, if he knows that the bank can potentially renege on his offer. Therefore, the best way to avoid this lame behavior is to tell who is doing that imo...
http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/new-grads-in-ma-fearful-of-job-lo…
Looks like you've got some quasimodo skills going on, maybe S&T would be good for you....
Quasimodo was a borderline cripple that pulled the rope on the Cathedral Bells of Notre Dame. Nostradamus is famous for his seemingly uncanny ability to foreshadow future events in a cryptic nature.
Haha, right you are. I'll see myself out.
Wow your story really hit home because something like this happened to me as well (I've also graduated with a Masters) It just totally sucks that they did it to you so late in the game. Mine happened back in the autumn and it still caused me to miss out on grad recruiting completely in my home country.
I'm not sure how the system in Australia works and how rigid the hiring process is - For example in the UK you can still do an internship after you've graduated but not so in my home country. If you can, I think doing some more internships so you can "stay in the game" and apply next year for FT recruiting again. And there is always off-cycle recruiting.I've actually found quite a few postings recently, albeit not for the most ideal jobs.
Best of luck!
Can a company be sued for this? I'm not the suing type, just curious.
OP, have you considered applying to jobs in the US / UK?
I was wondering about this too when I was really bitter, and actually did some research (obviously without actually intending to sue). The answer is no
Since the companies can't be trusted, there is now nothing stopping me from doing whatever the hell I can get away with. Hoist the fucking pirate flag, I say. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_VgId6DkcpAY/TJZMHKVqrII/AAAAAAAAAk4/01K43T0bU…
I wouldn't even consider suing as much as the situation sucks. After you sue a company for revoking an offer most companies prob wont touch you with a 10 foot pole.
But the problem with accepting several offers if of course the risk of getting caught when you renege and losing all your offers. I hate that banks can do whatevr and you can't, but the reality is you're at their mercy.
lol exactly what Bernankey said
Explore options abroad as well as in other areas within finance (buyside, boutique, corporate, etc...). Be flexible. Getting & staying in the game is half the battle in finance.
The USA is much more open to aggressive / direct approaches to doing business than other parts of the world, e.g. being sold on the phone. I once cold emailed/called a billionaire and set up a meeting a with him and his team for deal that we were working on. In the UK this approach gets no answer or gets you a meeting with one of their mid-level guys and you have to find more common ground. American's don't generally let formalities get in the way of them doing business.
If you feel that a more formal style suits you better, you can write the front office person a letter and request an introductory meeting. Do consider some form of networking though, even if it means just contacting the head of recruitment at your target firms so you're not just a CV, but rather a CV who they've spoken to.
Contact HR and pester the hell out of them, see if they can help.
Yeah well the bank in question is the Royally Bankrupt Bank of Scotland. As you could probably have deduced given I started the 2012 RBS Analyst group on this forum! Dear god, this is painful.
I know it sucks.., I felt like someone had punched me in the gut as well when it happened. And I'm sorry you have to go through this, really. I agree that you should just take some time off this weekend (or even for the rest of the week for that matter) to forget about all of this for now, before you get back into the game.
All is not lost for us. If we could get a BB offer once we can do it again :)
god damn, dude. I am sorry to hear the news.
Can't you leverage your offer to get interviews elsewhere? or... maybe you should do recruiting process one more time?
I have just finished my 6th year of university...there is no way I can go through what would be my 4th grad recruitment process (plus 4 internship rounds). After more than 100 rejections I finally got this fucking offer in April, and now it has been taken away from me.
Sorry to hear this happen, RBS is really screwing you over. Hoping you find something soon.
Hey man, first of all, I can't even imagine how you are feeling at the moment. It's just absolutely terrible. I'm going to be a first year analyst starting in July, and I definitely feel vulnerable. I guess you have to always hope for the best and prepare for the worst.
All I can say is this: KEEP YOUR HEAD UP. You've gotten this far by landing an offer and there is no reason to think any less of yourself because of things beyond your control. This is RBS's fault, not yours.
I've always believed that people are defined by their actions and not their situations. How you react to this shitty situation will ultimately be what's important when all is said and done. Look, your career will probably span a few decades. This early hiccup will most likely be a distant memory 10 years from now, and will have hopefully changed you for the better.
It's probably hard to hear any of this right now and I'd probably be reacting a lot worse than you are. However, the quicker you get yourself out of this rut, the better.
OK - so what steps can you take now.
First, take this weekend off and do something you truly enjoy. Take a step back and remember what you do have, as well as all the things that are important to you in this life (friends, family, etc.). A healthy perspective can make all the difference.
Second, once the week begins (or whenever you feel ready; earlier is usually better than later) start pounding the pavement. All of this has been said countless times on WSO, but I'll say it again. Spread your net out wide and get in front of all BBs, MMs, and boutiques. Who knows, maybe they will have a spot available. If you feel the need to, explain to them your situation, so that they already know you've been vetted by another bank. If nothing works out for IB or high-finance, apply to a "regular job" and be extraordinary in an ordinary role. I'm sure the doors will open up once more.
I understand you are hesitant with the above advice, since the cultural norms of networking in Australia are much different than in the States. I've spent quite a lot of time abroad these last couple years and I absolutely agree. However, it baffles me that any reasonable person would disrespect someone who was trying to better their situation. There's a middle ground somewhere, you've just got to find it and not give up. Best of luck!
Yes it is very poor form from RBS. They will regret this in the long run I am sure.
That sucks man, best wishes.
Is RBS perhaps just closing down Australian IBD all together? That's the only situation in which I can imagine a bank cutting an entire class of incoming analysts.
Timothy,
I'm very sorry to hear of this news.
I work in IB in Australia and we're currently looking for an analyst. Please PM me your location and I'll see if something can be done to help you get into the industry.
Boom!
Yeah I haven't opted for the do something fun for the weekend thing. I am going hard at it, searching through endless jobs on job networks, trying to rework the CV, getting in contact with friends to see if they know anything and will cold call every bank in my country etc. To quote Phil from Modern Family, "you can't get back on the horse until you fall off". If I thought about my situation and the countless 1000s of hours I had spent pursuing my dream to enter IB for many years, and the amount of debt I had wracked up in the process, then I would be clinically depressed. But I shall not dwell on it. Blitz spirit the Brits call it. Just get on with it.
Paz.
Sorry but RBS is not a BB...good luck anyways
Debateable. I think you are probably thinking within the American context exclusively. They were, in fairness, the largest bank in the world by assets a few years ago. This was probably largely down to their retail/commercial banking departments I guess. Further, they were a big player in The City and in various departments in Asia also. But we digress...
What is the American context? Then BNP Paribas and SocGen are also considered BBs? RBS is not a BB. End of story :D
Sorry to hear what happened. You could reach out to recruiters here to get a feel for what's out there, apply to other banks (though market is pretty sh1t right now) or if all else fails go through grad recruitment again and do something worthwhile in between..
A similar thing happened to me, I received an offer with a BB in Aust. a few years ago. I was due to start in March, but they called me in Nov with two options. Either 1) Transfer to Hong Kong indefinitely or 2) Lose my offer. It sucked at first, but in the end I had an amazing time before returning to Australia in a better market.
You've probably seen the news that RBS is selling its business here. Anyway, there was an article in today's paper on RBS and it said " Sources close to the bank expect little more than half of its Australian employees – between 225 and 250 of 400 – to keep their jobs"
Half their staff may get fired anyway, you're better off elsewhere. Good luck!
Yes the bank is fucked, but I don't think I am better off employed in my dream job than unemployed. A trip to the dole orifice is in the wings.
not as bad as you'd think. they have great air-con
You make the Big 4 sound good. Sorry to hear about your situation. I can understand how crappy it is. It just reminded me I shouldn't feel guilty about keeping a few offers open. These companies are not loyal to us, why should we be to them.
that so unfair...sorry to hear that.
sorry to hear that. RBS sucks! This bank is done.
On an off tangent, all penultimate uni students should be seeking as many offers as they can before they graduate, especially in this market.
Yes. I would accept all offers from now on, and then renege on all but one at the last second. Have to play dirty.
@ timothy0
Did they call you previously and reassured that you offer was still on when the turmoil and bad publicity started?
That is precisely what they did; they systematically lied to me.
dude not sure you know what 'systematically' means. or 'dually'. i know this is just a msg board but if you used words incorrectly in interviews like this, i'd reneg on your ass too. read some books
More like Royal Bank of Suckland, amirite???
Took me 7 days to come up with that.
It was worth the wait
@timothy0: srsly though - that stuff matters
@duffman: please read the definition you posted. then read what you wrote...
This ryan kid is killing it.
so you're an idiot.
word is that a few people were moved to other locations, but the vast majority of RBS grads were let go
Really? I thought the European ones hadn't even started yet, and so far hadn't been let go.
Hic suscipit nobis molestiae ut. Dolorem architecto dolor esse molestias aut veritatis corporis. Ipsum suscipit esse aperiam debitis. Qui accusantium dolor odit adipisci corporis voluptatem.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Repellat et aliquam unde necessitatibus voluptatem. Quia quidem dolores magnam. Et voluptatem est expedita sunt sit est beatae vel.
Vel voluptatem ut recusandae voluptas voluptatum. Omnis aut qui unde nostrum neque qui ad.
Ut omnis ab corporis eius. Officia quaerat aut sint corporis minus. Asperiores nesciunt quia voluptas magni. Quae velit soluta itaque labore nulla voluptate voluptas. Hic aperiam enim voluptatum voluptas. Non tempora sapiente voluptates et et labore occaecati cupiditate. Et inventore amet quas magni vero rem sequi.
Accusamus eos itaque molestias qui voluptas porro aliquid. Provident inventore excepturi sequi magni. Possimus nisi consequatur aut et temporibus repudiandae temporibus. Doloribus tempore possimus sit doloremque. Autem et reiciendis delectus reprehenderit ex autem quis animi. Occaecati qui eum voluptas magni.
Ratione eos dignissimos itaque magnam quidem. Minima dolorem distinctio qui laudantium odit. Sit rem rem magni consequatur alias assumenda. Ipsum maxime harum enim aut hic ad. Ut assumenda rerum sed qui.
Porro accusamus omnis sequi ex voluptatum laboriosam rem animi. Eligendi hic ea velit reiciendis dolorem sit. Voluptas voluptates repellendus consequatur.
Consectetur magni quia fugiat quod accusamus eos. Quis qui facere quo magni blanditiis totam adipisci. Nisi vel iste qui maiores ut. Natus dolorem et sint tempora. Neque aut fugit voluptates nam vitae suscipit eos. Et necessitatibus quia optio architecto non qui enim. Facere pariatur voluptatem sunt voluptatem.
Facilis eius provident esse qui. Ipsam facilis asperiores officia sit. Velit eos et rerum totam qui vero repudiandae. Aut occaecati aspernatur quia. Fugiat voluptas quia rerum aliquam molestiae dolor. Illo doloribus sunt reprehenderit nemo sint neque.