What do you wish you knew when you were younger?
wanting to get some perspectives from other more senior folks. this is a question I've been asking clients, family members, etc., and I hope this proves to be a place we can visit for years to come.
so, ladies and gents that have been around the block for a decade or more, what do you know now that you wish you knew when you were in your college years, 20s, early 30s? can be career, life, financial, however you want to answer it
Layne Staley WallStreetOasis.com CompBanker InfoDominatrix m8 neink CuriousCharacter earthwalker7 IlliniProgrammer labanker wsa007 TechBanking SSits ArcherVice Martinghoul brotherbear
will keep my comments short since I've already regurgitated the same shit 100x on the forum
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think long term is easier said than done but is incredibly important
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on investing, how to think is more important than being up to date on the news
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distrust all forecasters who don't manage portfolios
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your life won't suffer for leaving social media (wish I'd done this at 25 instead of >30)
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conspicuous consumption only leads to credit card debt and shallow friendships, skip that phase of your life (from which I carry zero memorable moments)
Following.
Been a looooooong time since I've seen some of these names come up. Hope everyone is well.
I seem to remember you're a bit senior as well, don't be shy sharing your insights! plenty of people I could've tagged but just didn't have immediately top of mind
College - I went to a target, and thought grades didn't matter (didn't know any better). Rude awakening come recruiting, but thankfully recruited into a bull market
Career - Each job will have difficult (sometimes extremely difficult) people to work with. How you manage and deal with those relationships can sometimes make or break you. I like to "kill them with kindness" and hard work. Don't let it affect you, but if it does, leave.
Life - Don't spend your time complaining about things. Work on ways to fix it, come up with a plan that addresses the issues and start executing on it. Find a solution.
love your can do attitude and kill em with kindness was one of the first lessons my grandmother taught me, it's a wise one.
thank you
I presume you're talking about situations when you're working with, not working under, said difficult person?
100% agree on the "working with" part - someone in another team / department being difficult - however the power dynamics in a typical office hierarchy don't allow for that if "working under". You'll just have to be a doormat / play politics to get out from working under them / or leave. Being a kind doormat doesn't do anything.
'killing with kindness' is a wonderful philosophy
Good advice here, just sometimes worry how this field will go for me whenever I think about the future.
On top of my head, might add more later:
- pick a goal, something like winning an Olympic gold medal. Pick a model, someone who's good at what you want to be good at. Copy what he does. You aren't supposed to reinvent the wheel as a kid.
- it's better to try and fail than not to try at all. You'll learn something that other don't know, it'll help you succeed later
- education is overrated, this is particularly true for higher levels. Most educators need ''satisfaction'' that you give credit to their discipline, don't expect to make much of it
- learn some self defense. Helps with confidence in male dominated environments. You won't likely get in fights, nor want to, however we aren't really that far from animals. Other males do smell danger and fear.
- learn one difficult language from birth: Mandarin, Russian, Arabic, Hindi. It'll make you stand out like no other.
are you working on one of those difficult languages? I know you're already trilingual (maybe more?), curious to see which one you're picking and why if any
Well there are a few things.
1) Grades matter.
2) What people with blue hair say does not matter.
3) Network over everything else.
4) College doesn't really lead to a career
5) You are far better off doing your own thing over working for other people
Hahaha -- point 2 is very accurate!
1. Hard work crushes intellect when it comes to career. You can't be a moron, but I know plenty of 'smart' people (you can find them at bar trivia or posting on Reddit) that are just lazy or not very practical. If someone is hard working & coachable in their corporate job then that crushes raw ability almost every single time, even if that person is much less intelligent. Someone with a 105 IQ that busts their ass will go further than someone with a 125 IQ who is lazy. I didn't believe this at all when I was in college but it's evident when getting into the 'real world'
2. Take ownership for everything. Growing up, my dad would always blame others. Late consistently? It's traffic. No money? It's because of the stock market. Cant get a promotion? It's because of the president. Step back in life and you will find people like this all the time - and it can be anything. Oh you lost a game of tennis? The racket was bad. Oh your pitch at work didnt succeed? Clearly it's bills fault for XYZ. If you are always blaming others you basically admit that you have no control/agency in your own life - which is pathetic. Take ownership. Late to work? Leaver earlier. Cant get a promotion? Get the skills needed to get another job. Lost a tennis match? Get fucking better at tennis. Whether you fail or succeed is on you and on you alone. But with all that pressure how do you prioritize? Leads me to my last point...
3. You can have anything you want in life. I sincerely mean that. But you cant have everything. Our generation (millennials) were coddled by basically being told we can have it all. You cant, you really cant. Realize and understand the trade offs with EVERY major decision you make. Compare those trade offs to your personal values , goals, and ambitions. Then you can make decisions and be happy with the ones you made. Example being you love being close to family in Ohio but got a important job offer in NYC. Staying vs leaving there is no right answer, but be aware of the tradeoffs. Or you have a career that will involve moving several times throughout your 20s and early 30s. Dont be surprised if you are single at 35. Want kids and to drive little johnny to soccer practice? Then understand the professional tradeoffs and dont think it's unfair when janet gets a promotion at work over you. People think they can have it all and get discouraged when expectations dont hit reality. You can achieve ANYTHING you want in this world (travel to 50 countries, start a business, financial independence at 35, sleep with 100 women, become VP before 30, have a loving family, have a six pack, etc.) but you cant have EVERYTHING. Think on your values and pursue them accordingly.
More around developing good study habits while also recognizing that schools wasn't the end-all-be-all. But mostly just appreciating being young in the first place and taking chances, trying out more new things vs staying rigid in a sphere of self-prescribed competence.
thebrofessor, I appreciate getting looped in this! This is a question that at first seems cliché but when I sit down and think about it, I'm flooded with a host of things I wish I had been equipped with mentally/emotionally/philosophically many years ago that would have saved me a tremendous amount of time and suffering. Some of these I've known all along yet never really took the time to digest. Others I have picked up only after many years.
Here is what I come up with (in no particular order). These apply to my teenage years and the decade of my twenties and will probably stay relevant throughout my life:
That's what I have for now! I could probably spend an entire day digging these out of my brain and it was actually very helpful to put these on here so I am appreciative of the opportunity to partake in this! These are my thoughts and platitudes thus far in life. They may not be for everybody but they are things that I live by and most certainly wished I knew at least a decade ago.
Thank you! Happy to see what I've experienced resonates with others on here.
This is what I come here for. Thanks for sharing.
My favorite reply of all time
Should be on the Mt Rushmore of WSO posts - thanks. What did you mean by your matrices within a matrix comment?
This might be something that only makes sense in my brain but I'll do my best to embellish. To me, the matrix is a set of narratives and constructs thrust upon and widely adopted by society. We have all fallen victim to this matrix and have participated in it in various degrees through the systems we partake in such as the educational system, healthcare system, financial system, etc.
With the advent of tech and things like social media, you get another layer to the matrix where you've got people trading real, tangible time from their lives in exchange for interacting with digital projections in order to mostly live vicariously through the lives of other people, fully believing that what they're seeing is an accurate representation of reality. To me, something like social media is a matrix within the matrix because it's such a unique layer that only removes you further from what is truly real.
Please expand on 1, it's based AF and I want to hear more.
Basically don't focus your attention on getting a woman. Focus on a real goal, whether it's your GPA or recruiting or a hobby. Become an accomplished person through your real goals, and the women will follow.
The more you shower a woman with attention, the less she will want to be with you. This is the Fundamental Law of Vagina. Just don't give too much of a shit about them and I promise it will boost your confidence and likability. If your relationship with one women doesn't work out, don't worry, there's another one out there who you will like just the same. Just don't give them more attention than they deserve.
The gist of that point was that most women are fairly generic. Hell, most people are fairly generic, hence why the very successful have very small circles. As such, sinking large amounts of time and energy into pursuing women when you can instead be focused on building a business, building yourself, etc. is simply not worth it. It's easier to distance yourself from people not going anywhere in life, but women are much harder since you're fighting biology. You can replace the word "women" in that point with "people" and it applies just the same. Don't sink massive amounts of time on people who won't amount to anything who are more/less the same as everybody else. iercurenc also did a great job on summarizing my point. Don't give your power, time, and energy chasing after most people, be they women or men because odds are, there's another person just like them around the corner. Highest and best use in all areas of life is important, especially your time.
"Women bad", admits to being a failed pickup artist
47 silver bananas, 0 monkey shits. Sad post!
Interested as well
Hahaha yes, I must be oozing bitterness, so much so that you picked that only point to harp on from the entire post and took the time to give MS for it and leave multiple replies attacking it. I am the bitter one, yes.
Another thing:
This is patently wrong. Sure, being a better man will make it easier to get dates, but the best way to get better at talking to women is.... talking to women. Lifting weights will make you a better athlete but to do well in football, you'll have to practice playing football. That's why you see so many people here scratching their heads and wondering why they're still virgins even though they're successful by other metrics.
this is really good!
Based
I will revert back this reply often. I could read it all day
This is why I love this site. Thank you for this sir
i rarely comment on this site, but I just wanted to say this is one of the greatest things I've read, period (in or outside WSO). Thanks
+SB
I will echo the comments on Robert Greene - that book had a massive effect on me too and I credit it as one of the reasons I went from being outside of Banking/Finance to being at a BB now. For anyone reading this, if you take just one thing away from this thread, then pick up the Robert Greene book and read it.
Love your advice. Thanks
Happy to hear that it has been helpful to you!
Get it in writing.
This advice gives me flash backs to working with attorneys. Is this mostly for AN/ASO or higher level deal makers?
Not a boomer like everyone else in the thread but...
1. Mentors are key, whether its upperclassmen or alumni. Everyone at your school will want to help you.
2. Grades matter, fuck that 3.5+ mentality. Go for a 4.0 so you fail into success. Hard work is hard.
3. TALK TO PEOPLE, same as #1, but network with alums, network with upperclassmen, these are the people who're gonna hire you 2, 5, 10 years down the line
5. Culture matters more than prestige IN THE LONG RUN, of course you should prioritize prestige for your first job out of college in finance because you aren't gonna stay there (99 times out of 100), but keep track of the bigger picture.
6. Old(er) people are often wrong. Take everything everyone says with a grain of salt, and understand that your life is different from theirs.
7. Never listen to a college student on an online forum because he is most likely just spewing BS.
lol ironically I believe the opposite. Fuck the 4.0, go for the 3.5. I was a 4.0 student and regret it because it came at the expense of other areas.
It's better to be good at everything than to be great at any one thing (grades, work experience, hobbies, social skills) but deficient at the others. IF you can be 4.0 student with a healthy social life, captain of the club rowing team, good internship experience, volunteer on weekends, etc. then more power to you. More isn't worse. But for many - the difference between a 3.5 and a 4.0 is negligible on a resume as well as later on in life. What matters is making sure you are well rounded
Not a boomer like everyone else in the thread but...
1. Mentors are key, whether its upperclassmen or alumni. Everyone at your school will want to help you.
2. Grades matter, fuck that 3.5+ mentality. Go for a 4.0 so you fail into success. Hard work is hard.
3. TALK TO PEOPLE, same as #1, but network with alums, network with upperclassmen, these are the people who're gonna hire you 2, 5, 10 years down the line
5. Culture matters more than prestige IN THE LONG RUN, of course you should prioritize prestige for your first job out of college in finance because you aren't gonna stay there (99 times out of 100), but keep track of the bigger picture.
6. Old(er) people are often wrong. Take everything everyone says with a grain of salt, and understand that your life is different from theirs.
7. Never listen to a college student on an online forum because he is most likely just spewing BS.
Says the college student posting on an online form...
for whatever it's worth, I'm not a baby boomer and nor is anyone I tagged to my knowledge. mostly older millenials, but I'm unsure if that changes your dismissal of advice from people older than you.
Don't do heroin, pharmaceutical or otherwise.
Business is War - The best companies (that is, the companies that pay the highest wages, offer the most room for advancement, and are stacked with the most talented people) are EXTREMELY political environments, and anything you say can and will be used against you, so don't bring your personal baggage to the office, you're there to do battle.
Cash is King - Life is non-linear for most people, and if something unforeseen happens, having two years worth of living expenses in the bank is the best thing ever.
Think Long & Hard Before Taking on Debt - *Getting* to work a high paid prestigious job can be a dream come true... HAVING to work a high paid prestigious job can be a true nightmare. Act accordingly.
Don't Rush Into Marriage + Children - I didn't make this mistake, but I have plenty of friends who got married and had kids in their early/mid 20's who are now stuck with spouses and children they hate, or lost 50% of their net worth plus x% of their future earnings in nasty divorces... it's not a good look.
Opportunity favors the prepared mind - I've interviewed at dozens of companies over the last decade, and only 3 were true standouts... that's one every five years. I see one amazing investment every 12-18 months. I am many millions of dollars poorer today and missed out on some potentially fantastic relationships because I wasn't ready to act when opportunities presented themselves. When you see it, you HAVE to be ready.
Sales is an S-tier Skillset - The talented sales reps I know in big tech are all pulling in 500k-1.5mm per year working *very* reasonable hours. Even if you don't want to be a career salesperson, the skillset is extremely valuable.
Get Rid of Toxic People Post Haste - I held on to toxic relationships from my teen years into my late 20's, and it was a terrible mistake. If you want to move up in the world, you're going to have to leave people behind, and that might mean kicking your own family to the curb.
The part on sales is incredibly true. How would you recommend approaching sales to acquire it as a skill if you already have a high-paying job that isn't necessarily geared towards sales?
If you have a high paying job just hire the best sales trainer you can find.
There is not a magic switch that will make your life amazing, try to live every fucking day instead of thinking that there is that magic thing that will completely change your life. I used to think that entering a top university, making xx money, relationship were magic switches they are ok-ish but it is nothing magic. Why is so important that I learned this from my young obsessed/A-type personality? First, you start to live in the moment. Second, a natural consequence of this thought is that there is not a magic switch that will make your life the worse thing ever either so in bad moments if you live everyday trying to be as good as possible you can be quite happy.
Disclaimer: if you are living in REAL materal/health poverty I do not think that this applies, if you can not eat 2 thoudand calories a day or you have Malaria it is hard to be happy..
Your well being should be your number one priority over anything. Take care of of yourself first so you can give 100% of yourself to your cause (job,family,relationships)
There will always be stress. Learn to cope early. The farmer will worry about rain. The engineer that the bridge won’t fall down.
Focus on things that you can control. Anxiety is born is out of things out of our control and the unknowns. The further out you project or forecast the more unknown variables. Trust that doing your best is all you can do and ask of yourself. Most of the time, it will be more than enough. Sometimes it won’t be enough, and that’s ok.
If you want to make money. You need to take risks. If you want to make lots of money, you need to take lots of risks. Unfortunately, a stable job in something like M&A is as riskless as it can get so you're defn not maximising your potential or coming anywhere close to making the money that you otherwise could.
Sure you may make more than other risk-averse people who have less pedigree in a lower paying job, but you're never going to make as much as someone taking risk (whether it's gearing their eyeballs out and buying the biggest property they can afford or doing business). The recent rise in US home prices is case in point.
M&A careers at big BB doesn’t attract risk takers by nature
Thank you. You say the things I need to hear
go back to tiktok
Cringe as fuck, calm down
cringe
Open a business in a growing industry.
Can you elaborate more on point 5?
sure thing. I wish I realized the shallowness of conspicuous consumption, which I define as spending money without a purpose that's meaningful to you or showing off. things like grabbing random people's drinks at the bar to try to impress people (even when you're in a committed LTR so why tf would you care), buying clothes you don't need, and so on. I had a lot of pride in my early 20s and had not let lost my ego nor gotten to intrinsic validation instead of extrinsic validation
I carry no regrets, my point is if I was speaking to a younger version of myself, I'd drive this point home and say "hey man, in 10 years no one is going to give a fuck about _____ you bought but AMEX is still gonna want their money, and I know you don't have it right now. so stay home this weekend, crush a couple workouts, and spend time with your REAL friends at the house, it'll be more affordable and give you way more memories."
I would have still lived, but been way cheaper, saved way more, and dumped as much as I could into ETFs in brokerage not 401k/IRA
Can you elaborate a little bit? I think I understand what you mean but not sure.
Nothing matters aside from the moment. You don't take it with you when you die. Invest invest invest, car car car, house house house house. Buried
Delete delete delete
I'm probably not qualified to give advice, but here is one thing I wish I knew 8 years ago:
Be willing to be patient with answers to your questions. You may not know all the answers right away, but that is not the excuse for not doing the right thing. If you read Rainer Maria Rilke, this kind of saying might ring a bell.
Background: 4 years ago I got an interview from MIT for a master's program. I didn't get a spot in the program. Thinking back, other things aside, my coding skills were definitely below average. I actually started out as a computer science major in freshman year but hated it so much because I didn't know what I could do with it. I didn't want to devote all weekends writing dumb programs that I didn't like.
Now: I spend my weekends --- when I have time since weekend work is a real thing in investment banking even in a relatively chill group that doesn't have a maniac MD --- self-studying coding because I've realized how useful it is and how interesting it is. I'm paying my dues 8 years later. I also have ideas to start a business, but coding is a prerequisite.
Man, I wish I knew.
Why can't you just hire someone for coding?
Two reasons.
Assumption: talking about a scalable software/tech business here.
1. It's a skill I want to learn and learn well.
2. I don't think outsourcing source code is a good idea. It's okay to outsource certain parts. Might be a perspective thing. Anyway, for me it's important o know how to code or get a tech co-founder.
I know that Patrick outsourced coding, but WSO's websites and mobile apps could really get some uprades...
Thanks for the thread brofessor. These aren’t my words, but those of a much more notable Wall Street character that I’ve found practical. This was a letter Richard Jenrette left on his desk before passing in 2018 (one of my favorite parts of Wall Street is its history).
“What I learned (How to Succeed)
(and how to live a long & happy life) -Richard Jenrette (1929-2018)
a. You can’t get enough of them
b. Don’t leave old friends behind – you may need them
opportunities for change – people are willing to consider change when there are
problems.
don’t blindly follow it. USE YOUR HEAD – COMMON SENSE.
Richard Jenrette co-founded the investment bank Donaldson, Lufkin & Jenrette in 1959. The legendary banker spent four decades on Wall Street and died in 2018 at age 89. He left behind on his desk, these 24 rules to succeed in finance. DLJ was originally a research firm, and was taken over by Jenrette in 1973. In the late 80’s DLJ acquired Drexel’s high-yield bond team, which gave them an advantage in high-yield trading and underwriting. The slow dissolution of DLJ resulted in a sale to Credit Suisse, however many of DLJ’s alumni left for UBS. Famous DLJ alumni include Ken Moelis, who left for UBS before founding Moelis & Co.
I wish I wasn't so money centric.I graduated from an ivy in 2014.
I went into IB like everyone else and now am in PE.I've made 100k, 200k and even 7 figures once.(Invested into a company that was acquired plus my larger salary). I also wish I didn’t go collecting Rolex Dayton’s and pateks. Try to save guys. Health issues can be a thing later.
I still have never taken more than 2-3 days off of work. I can crush my work but it's clearly unhealthy.
Just remember to take care of yourselves guys. Money and prestige are not as important. HCOL is not either when you're entering your mid 20s and can pull a CF position that matches IB (or within 20%).
Should have been more comfortable with raising equity. Could have raised a handful of times when younger but didn't think the businesses were VC appropriate (they were, I was just stupid). Would have been 3x - 5x further along career wise if I had...even if those companies tanked for w/e reason.
Demographics are destiny
Don’t ever become content, always stay working because happiness may be temporary but it will not last forever. Don’t beat yourself up because something didn’t work, use it as experience to grow and be better.
I want you (the person reading this). To tell your mother you love them today and also to the people you love and matters to you. Spend more time with them and not focusing on others that doesn't mean to you. Don't hurt the people that is kind to you to impress the ones that hurt you. Love your own kind. Make friends and be kind, and hardworking. Because there will always be someone kinder, prettier, and hardworking than you are. More life my friends :)
Luck plays a much bigger part in life than we would all like to believe, but how you respond to bad luck and circumstances will define you
Sex sells!
Following
I wish I never kissed a guy. Or else I wouldn’t be up tonight thinking about these situations
I'm not nearly as prolific as some of the posters called out in the OP but I am on "the back nine" of my career so I'll throw in a couple:
Like the advice but dont see how getting married at 40 and wanting to start / raise a family can coexist.
There are trade offs with everything. Aster enough women and experience you (and hopefully your partner) knows the fairytale stuff is BS and relationships take work. Sure by waiting you can develop career, experiences, have more freedom, etc. But you also lose out on being young and full of energy when your kids are growing up.
Just my 2 cents. No answer is the correct one per say. Just go into it eyes open and aware of the tradeoffs.
Yes, it's true that getting married later and having kids is tough proposition. But I would still prefer that over going through a divorce and putting your kids through a split home (and I'm assuming the custody battle would be amicable, otherwise its a whole other deal). So, yeah, there's a trade-off but I think most posters on WSO are smart enough to realize that.
Things I wish I knew when I was younger:
buy bitcoin .02 sell 60,000
Relationships are the biggest time sinks ever. No, you're not going to find your soulmate to marry at 21. Only time you should date is when you're dating to get experience, or to have fun.
I could probably write a book as an answer to this question, and I am only in my 30s. The answer would also vary a lot depending on the area of focus (career, women, you name it). Here are some of the most important lessons, subjective to me. I would say the core lesson revolves around time.
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shit man... how did that happened
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