I thought this might be helpful to all the high school students. Below is a general list (to my knowledge feel free to contribute people) of all the major feeder colleges for the BBs:
I tried to order them..
East Coast:
Harvard Yale Princeton Wharton
Gap
MIT Amherst Williams Swarthmore Columbia NYU Dartmouth Penn Cornell Brown JHU CMU Georgetown
Midwest:
Northwestern Chicago Michigan
Gap
Illinois Washington University Carleton College
West Coast:
Stanford Berkeley Caltech
Gap
UCLA USC Pomona Claremont McKenna Other UCs
South:
Duke UVA UTexas BSchool
Gap
UNC Emory Vanderbilt Rice
Generally from my knowledge the major feeders are the following: Ivys, MIT, Williams, Amherst, Swarthmore, NYU, Northwestern, Chicago, Duke, Stanford, and Berkeley.
Notice that cities will often come into play. If you goto a good school but away from a major city, its harder to get a BB job.
I hoped this helped. Please contribute to the list as I'm sure there are some (and possibly many) errors.
Canada:
McGill University of Toronto Queen's University
I'm pretty sure that the Kelley School of Business at Indiana University sends a good amount of analysts to BB's, maybe not in the same class as UMich, Northwestern, and UChicago, but I would say it's as good as Illinois and WashU in that category.
Tier II - Notre Dame
Why do you have Wharton listed in Tier I and Penn listed again in Tier II? Non-business majors?
Correct. Wharton different from SAS.
i would say uva belongs in the top tier. business week certainly thinks so and they send a very respectable number of people to the bb and top mm firms
Businessweek also thinks that Kellogg is better than HBS and Wharton...
UVA's ugrad B-School is very respectable, but I dont think they send as many kids to the top firms as say Duke.
that's because they only graduate about 325 students per year from their b-school. percentage-wise though, I'm pretty sure they hang with any school except wharton and harvard in terms of placement.
I would say BC definitely belongs on the list for placing students into analyst programs at BB.
Really? I haven't heard of this before.
Do you have a career placement pdf or something I can look at?
I don't have anything that you can look at, I am sure if you call their career services office that they could help you out. However, from my senior class BC placed many people into BB Banks, middle market and boutique banks, asset management firms, and a few consulting firms.
You forgot Western (Ivey) which has the best placement in the country including 10% of the class to the U.S.
Is Northeastern University any good as a feeder school? I know they have an amazing coop program.
Notre Dame is tier I. BusinessWeek ranked their business school at #3.
what is pomona? Does anyone have alink to there website?
Google "Pomona College."
I agree with an earlier poster that BC sends quite a few kids to BB. They have a solid program. As for the list of southern schools, I would advise adding Tulane onto the list of Tier II schools. They send a handful of kids to BB every year and have a great presence in the BB regional office setting in the south. Highly respected in the Northeast (NY & Boston) although not as actively recruited as other top southern schools so II is probably best fit for them.
no text
thanks!
is it bad to go to an extremely competitive school. cause when i looked up some of my schools data, it was good that Goldman Sachs was the 2nd biggest employer for graduates but over 1000 students applied for positions from Goldman Sachs. i mean doesnt that hurt your chances.......
A lot of schools on that list are very good and won't drag a person down, but do not really provide an edge or in-road. Many of the schools you listed are excellent and well-respected but don't really have the sorts of alumni networks to bring people onto the Street in droves.
In addition, most students at non-northeastern colleges don't really know what investment bankers do, nor do they see banking as a desirable career, nor do they know the first thing about pursuing a job in banking. If they wanted to be bankers, and learned how to pursue the career, their schools wouldn't hinder them, but on the other hand, aren't going to place them either.
Tier 1: H,Y,P, and Wharton.
Tier 2: Other Ivies, MIT, U of C, NYU, Gtown, UVA and Northwestern.
Are you counting Stanford and Duke as "other ivies?"
That's a better analysis. You might want to include the LACs: Amherst, Swarthmore, and Williams. Pomona, Carleton, and a few others are of comparable quality but aren't feeders purely on account of location.
I'd imagine that Caltech puts a fair number of kids into trading and hedge funds.
I hear that Howard in D.C. is a a feeder school
how about lse, would you consider it a feeder school?
jimmylse09: really, goldman was 2nd biggest employer?
thats wut it said on a times article, but i mean its probably true since more than 1000 students applies a year to Goldman Sachs so the chances of making it in is not that great, i mean i think they can take 100 students tops.
yeah..that's the plus and negative of feeder schools...hard as hell to get the goldman placements, but the lower banks will take a lower feeder school candidate than a higher non-feeder school candidate.
"In addition, most students at non-northeastern colleges don't really know what investment bankers do, nor do they see banking as a desirable career, nor do they know the first thing about pursuing a job in banking. If they wanted to be bankers, and learned how to pursue the career, their schools wouldn't hinder them, but on the other hand, aren't going to place them either."
well thats a load of crap seeing as how all my buddies from a non-eastern school went into banking/hedge funds/PE
Morehouse is also a core school for every BB. Except for Lazard, if you consider Lazard to be a BB bank.
I've met a few people from Morehouse, Spelman, Howard, and Florida A&M. Definitely not an abundance.....but pretty much the cream of the crop from those schools-those students that got into ivies but wanted to go to an HBCU.
The BBs all recruit at Howard, and most recruit at Spelman and Morehouse too. I haven't heard too much about Florida A&M.
I know Lazard and Greenhill visited Howard once, but I guess didn't take anyone and decided not to go back.
I went to a private liberal arts college (think Midwest). We graduate approx 40-50 econ students/year and about 5 goto BBs and about 2-4 to other banks. Translation = 10-15% of our graduates endup in banking. Not many schools compare. During '02 and '03, we still sent 2 to 3 kids to BBs.
Oberlin? Lake Forest?
most of these posts look more like just general college rankings than which schools are feeders into BBs...i interned at a BB and now work fulltime at another, and most of my friends from college went into banking, so i have a decently comprehensive impression...
to the guy who wrote: Tier 1: H,Y,P, and Wharton. Tier 2: Other Ivies, MIT, U of C, NYU, Gtown, UVA and Northwestern
there is no doubt in my mind that wharton places more ppl in BBs than any other school on the planet...sorry but if you are only looking at how many ppl from a school goes into BBs or what %, typically they are the schools that have the most ppl majoring in econ or business...places like wharton, uchicago, nyu, stanford, harvard etc...my problems w/ the above rankings are: 1) yale and princeton don't really compare w/ the sheer volume of bankers that come out of the top feeder schools 2) some ivies like cornell place a lot more bankers than others like brown 3) MIT, georgetown and northwestern are not banking feeder schools...MIT is still known for engineers, georgetown for poli sci, and northwestern churns out way more consultants than bankers, but they get their fair share cuz their class is much larger than other private schools...
just for kicks, my 05 training class facebook is still sitting under my desk, and here were the schools w/ the most representation: 1) upenn 2) cornell 3) williams 4) uchicago 5) nyu 6) babson 7) boston u 8) harvard 9) indiana 10) northwestern
some interesting names but you see the general trend...mostly schools that have top (or large) undergrad business schools or econ programs
Boston University?
Babson College?
These names are not familiar.
Is that the Wachovia facebook?
I disagree with kidxiao about georgetown. We send a lot of kids to Law School, Medical School. But...
Banks that recruited at our school: GS, MS, Lehman, UBS, Merill, Bear, Citi, BofA, JPM, DB, CS, RBSGC, Barclays Cap, Perella, HLHZ, Rothschild, Thomas Weisel etc. With Goldman taking the most every year. They interviewed about 100 first rounds and they hire at least a dozen kids for full time, not including those that got offers from working of the summer.
Total students hired in to Inv. Banking through our career center (not including those who got offers and took them from their summer stint) totals over 100 every year.
Just making the case for my soon to be alma mater...
I go to UfT (Rotman) as an MBA candidate. Based on my summer and full time recruiting experience, Canada is basically (not in order of priority):
Ivey (Western Ontario) Rotman (UfT) The above two send the most, then: Queens McGill Schulich
since when is Wachovia a BB? drop the ego dude...don't u think wachovia would get a lot of their ppl from places like unc, duke, etc? i don't really mind so...it's JPM's facebook from '05 cycle 1...also just fyi, these schools represented less than 1/2 of one cycle of analysts (there were 2 training cycles), so that's less than 1/4 of all analysts that year worldwide...
yeah granted boston u and babson don't get as much respect (obviously from the posts above), but my original point was that the list of schools that the most analysts come from don't always mirror college rankings...just because a school recruits somewhere doesn't mean they will take a lot of analysts from that school...every firm has its target schools (for ex. jpm is big on williams, which might have something to do w/ our vice chairman being a grad)...and larger schools will typically place more kids just because of the class size...
btw babson isn't exactly a crappy school...it's a private business-only school..you might know the graduate business school better, it's called Olin...and it's known as the best undergrad and MBA program in entrepreneurship...
and to the georgetown guy, i'm not dissing georgetown or anything...it's a great school...it's just i've only come across one person from georgetown so far in banking, and that was during my internship...
Babson would be one of the schools where the banks might recruit at, but they only take maybe 5-6 people from the entire school.
Entrepreneurship doesn't really mirror investment banking all that much in my opinion, but for those who are into the whole entrepreneurship thing it might make sense to go to a school such as Babson.
However, I wouldn't expect too many i-banking opportunities after making that decision.
then either all of the bankers from babson went to JPM that year, which seems unlikely, or there are more than 5-6 people from babson that go into banking every year...at a decent business-only school where the class is about 450 ppl per class, i doubt that only 5-6 ppl go into banking each year man... i just checked out their undergrad placement stats...they don't list banking but 1/4 of their class goes into finance... i'm not saying entrepreneurship exactly mirrors investment banking either, only that it's what the school is known for...for ex, uchicago is known for econ, but how many grads actually go to econ grad school? not that many...most of them go into banking, they just major in econ b/ there's no undergrad business...anyway, ppl go to a certain school for a lot of reasons...if you wanted to do business and don't want to go to a large school, babson doesn't seem like a bad choice...
for your info, babson was recently named "hottest business school", is ranked in top 25 overall and #6 in country for financial management. btw it is not just for entrepreneurship, there is an entrep. mindset that is emphasized, but kids go to BBs every year from there, look at the faculty and youll know what i mean, so don't assume that because theyre ranked first in entrepre. means that they are not great in finance (#6 in fin management, come on)
Target school simply means that banks find it efficient to send on-campus recruiters out there. It says nothing about the school. And the "target" list changes every year. If you attend a target school, it either means there is a higher concentration of smart people on your campus or it means your school is close to an airport with direct flights to NYC.
I think people place too much emphasis on the quality of the school determining target rankings.
I also think more state schools should consider moving their campuses closer to airports that have direct flights to NYC.
Thank you JBD for reviving a 2 year old thread. Ranking schools is futile and annoying. We all know what schools are targets and which are not.
Comprehensive List of Feeders? (Originally Posted: 05/27/2012)
Can you guys give me a list of undergrad colleges that are feeders in IB? I am currently an incoming senior and I want to be able to compare schools in terms of how they place in IB, most specially in NYC.
Mod (Andy) note: Thanks to user Blackid for this in-depth response:
Greendale College is the top IB feeder South Harmon Institute of Technology is also a good bet
do a search for "target schools"
thanks for the top duffmt6.
btw, what are the tier 2 and 3 feeders? i am sure i cant get into the ivies. haha
Are you looking at any colleges in particular? It'll be tough to give you honest advice without knowing anything about your stats/background/etc.
Best way to find out is to call HR at the banks you're interested in and ask for the schools at which they do on-campus recruiting. You can also find this on most of the banks' web sites.
It will generally be the usual suspects--HYPSW, Duke, Columbia, etc.--but there are sometimes weird idiosyncracies, especially outside of New York.
Shit man if you can't fucking use Google I wouldn't hire you.
The University of Montana Western, DeVry, Portland Community College
Ball State University - Tuscaloosa
what the hell is this "feeder" shit? It's called target schools
Tier 1: Harvard, Wharton, Stanford, Princeton, Yale Tier 2: Cornell, Columbia, Dartmouth, MIT, Oxford, Cambridge, LSE Tier 3: Brown, Amherst, Williams, Duke, Caltech, UChicago, Stern (NYU)
Tier 4: McIntire (UVA), Ross (Michigan), Haas (Berkeley) West Point, Air Force, Naval Academy, Notre Dame, Northwestern, UPenn CASRegional Targets (excluding schools already mentioned):
West Coast: - Anderson (UCLA), Marshall (USC), Claremont McKenna
South: - Vanderbilt, McCombs (UT), Rice, Emory,
South East: - Kenan-Flager (UNC). [Caveat: KF is technically a target but is a top target for Charlotte firms].
East Cost: - William and Mary, Georgetown
Hard to characterize the military academies as anything considering they have a commitment to honor before they can consider Wall Street. Georgetown places as many people on the Street as the Tier 4 schools.
Wouldn't agree with that characterization 100%, but fairly representative overall.
I get that Wharton is good, but no way Penn CAS is Tier 4. There are plenty of econ majors going to IB
no chicago/midwest love in that regional target list?
My school isnt there..... fml
blackid how did you come up with that list?
For another point of reference, here is Seedy Underbelly's list:
Tiers of IB recruiting:
Harvard / Penn-Wharton
Stanford / Princeton
Columbia / Yale / MIT-Sloan
Penn-College / Dartmouth / Cornell-AEM / NYU-Stern / UCB-Haas / Duke / Northwestern / UChicago
UVA-Mcintyre / UMich-Ross / Williams / Georgetown / Brown
The rest
The tiers are a joke. If you're a target, you're a target. Where did this whole tier thing come from?? It's almost like WSO-ers pulled a random ranking out of their ass to justify their own views.
FYI, I've visited a few BB offices. Most people I met are from Wharton/Cornell/Harvard/Columbia. I haven't met that many people from Stanford or Yale.
Comprehensive List of Feeders? (Originally Posted: 05/27/2012)
Can you guys give me a list of undergrad colleges that are feeders in IB? I am currently an incoming senior and I want to be able to compare schools in terms of how they place in IB, most specially in NYC.
Mod (Andy) note: Thanks to user Blackid for this in-depth response:
Dude you have Indiana University as one of your schools... I wouldn't being criticizing others. As far as the real world is concerned IU is basically on the same level as BSU, just a little more overpriced and your girls are about 5 pounds lighter.
BANKING FROM THE BREAD BASKET FTW.
@SECFinance: After you fulfill your commitment it shouldn't be difficult to get an IB job considering the military peeps tend to support each other pretty thoroughly based off this forum and some friends' experiences.
@3176401: I wouldn't pay too much attention to the tiers as they are pretty arbitrary.I wasn't sure where to put Georgetown so I just put it as a east coast target, which means, you know, Wall Street target. Your list is silly, the difference between Harvard and Princeton is marginal at best, same with MIT and Princeton, etc. You don't really believe that a financial econ major at MIT is at such a disadvantage compared to someone at Stanford that they're a tier below, do you? A student at both schools will be capable of getting the same jobs. It's true that there are a few places that only do Harvard/Wharton (like Blackstone I think), but other than a few cases like that, it's too small to matter.
I highly doubt Penn CAS is as good as Stern in terms of placement. Sure you might say the Econ majors, but Penn CAS is alot more than just Econ majors, and even they have a relatively hard time. I'm pretty sure there are more Stern students who go into IB Williams and Amherst place a higher percentage of their people (who are interested in finance) into top places.
The reality is, all of the schools (including regional targets) are sufficient. If you get into any of 'em the only thing to do is just network.
only pussies rank schools
Where would Carnegie Mellon/Tepper place? Tier 3?
I'm a veteran and a soon to be IB analyst. If you pick a service academy for its exit opps, I'm willing to bet you wont last in either the school or the following service commitment.
It's either target or non-target and a hell of a lot of networking regardless. US news rankings are about as likely to prognosticate your chances of getting into IB as they will any other future success you may aspire to.
I would rank USC marshall as tier 4, i know quite a lot of analysts from there (well in asia)
Indiana (Kelley) should definitely be on the list... IU places 50+ kids to wall street each year
Don't forget about the Correspondence College of Tampa. But seriously, who cares about 'Tiers?'
Go to a target school where you feel like you fit in and can be successful. Other than that, do not get so freakin' wrapped up in prestige. To be honest, a place like UVA or UNC places about as well onto Wall Street just as much as those expensive private schools and you will be $70-$80 grand ahead in terms of tuition.
On the subject of the service academies, it is probably worth noting that you cannot piss into the wind in an IB/PE/MC group without hitting half a dozen guys who went to one of them....
Why is Oxbridge/LSE tier 2?
Pretty fucking depressing how much you guys care about the ranking of schools
Mendoza = Booth's rejects.
We're talking about undergrad here.
IU destroys a lot of places in I-Banking, just check out their IB workshop placement.
We get every BB, several elite boutiques (like Lazard) every year, and several mid market places.
I mean hell, look at the IB club president this year. http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000024302
And yes, he'll be working at Blackstone.
IB Workshop kids = ballers.
Jesus people, the tiers are arbitrary, only thing that matters if they're targets or not.
Theres always one indiana or notre dame guy in every forum.
There's a pretty big difference between Notre Dame and Indiana.
Haha I was just sayin. One of those schools are always missing from the list and someone out of the blue always goes "what about Indiana?"
I can confirm Indiana is legit. I summered with and will be returning to an elite boutique, and Indiana has the biggest presence in my incoming analyst class (narrowly beating Wharton, Michigan and NYU).
Just one point of reference, but still a point of reference none the less.
From a nominal count, NYU Stern is definitely Tier 1. That being said, everyone from Stern appears to want to do banking.
Cornell Tier 2??????????
Funnily enough I've seen more Cornell (and Columbia) than Yale/Princeton on my trips to BBs.
thanks for the input. how would you compare duke and georgetown? which one is better in terms of campus, career opps(IB) as well as financial aid since i am international
Top feeder colleges (Originally Posted: 09/26/2012)
Poets and Quants is a pretty good site. And the guys there did an interesting thing where they looked at the facebook groups of incoming classes at various b-schools and did a tally of the top feeder colleges. It's not 100% accurate since there are a minority of students who are not in facebook groups, but by and large it's pretty accurate.
http://poetsandquants.com/2011/08/15/top-feeder-colleges-to-harvard-bus…
http://poetsandquants.com/2011/08/07/top-feeder-schools-to-whartons-mba…
http://poetsandquants.com/2011/09/07/top-feeder-schools-to-columbia-bus…
http://poetsandquants.com/2011/10/06/top-feeder-colleges-to-chicago-boo…
http://poetsandquants.com/2011/09/14/top-feeder-colleges-to-dartmouths-…
Shocker that all the Ivys feed into the other Ivys.
What about University of Phoenix? DeVry?
Might wanna talk to Prestigious Pete about that one.
OP - shitty consistency with links. I dock you 5 house points.
These links prove that going to an undergraduate biz program doesn't help you get into an elite b-school. Look how poorly NYU, Boston College, Indiana, and UMich do despite their highly ranked BBA programs.
10 accepted to HBS from UT-Austin and Michigan last year..LOLLERSKATES!
Feeders into Blackstone? (Originally Posted: 04/12/2012)
I am looking to learn what types of firms feed into Blackstone (or Lazard or Evercore) for Restructuring work.
Firms like Alvarez & Marsal and Alix? Where does firms like FTI Consulting fall?
What other firms should be in this conversation?
Thanks.
Firms like BX, Lazard, Evercore actually do take undergraduates into their rx group -- mainly Harvard graduates, and some Wharton.
Essentially none of them will have a background at a firm like FTI...I just don't see them in the same league as the aforementioned firms. It'd be much more common to see BB IBD (or something like LevFin, Distressed/Special Sits group) --> b-school (again, H/W/S) --> associate in rx.
Rothschild, perhaps Miller Buckfire (although slightly on the decline) HLHZ, GH, etc should be in the conversation.
You should also note that some elite boutiques structure their analyst (and maybe associate) programs as a generalist scheme. For example, GHL does this, while LAZ splits M&A and Restructuring more rigidly, at least in its Chicago office.
Alvarez & Marsal and FTI Consulting are definitely not in the same category as Evercore, Lazard, and Blackstone.
Houlihan Lokey Restructuring is phenomenal, surprised you didn't mention it. They're located in LA. They recruit analysts from the West coast targets. No idea if the Ivy kids have OCR for it.
I did mention it.
what about Rothschild HK, would you guys elaborate more about exit opps and deal flow in Asia?
HL and Rothschild are solid...should be added to the list. HL also has a restructuring office in Dallas....mainly pull from Texas schools but you should certainly try to drop lines there.
Thanks for all the comments.
I do view HLHZ in the same league as Blackstone, Lazard, and Evercore, but I understand their focus would creditor work, whereas the others focus is on debtor work..
In my question, I was looking to gauge the class of shops just below the top shops (above).
Tell me how these looks.... . 1. BX, Lazard, Evercore, and HLHZ 2. Greenhill, Rothschild, Miller Buckfire, Moelis?
3. A&M, Alix, FTI ?
Thanks
This is a common misconception and isn't their modus operandi.
you need to differentiate between balance sheet restructuring and operational restructuring... completely different field of work
For dealflow in Restructuring it usually goes:
Very helpful. Thanks.
Who is in the 5th & 6th Tiers?
Perella Weinberg and Greenhill also have very solid restructuring practices.
take a&m and fti completely out of this thread and your head. not even worth mentioning them.
Goldman Sachs
Rothschild perhaps...
jgx101 is a troll (if it isn't obvious). BBs can't do much restructuring, if any, since they're frequently creditors and there would be significant COI.
Both GS and MS have decent experience in RX (however both are winding down their franchise and or having trouble attracting senior level talent), and you don't think there are COIs when Blackstone are the sponsor and advising themselves on the restructuring while GSO are in the debt? But yea, BBs tend to stay away because it's not worth the effort.
I am curious who falls into the next tier?
Where do these firms fall? - AlixPartners - Alvarez & Marsal - Macquarie - Duff & Phelps
The best restructuring shops based on what I've seen are Evercore, BX, Houlihan, and Lazard. Don't think any are necessarily better than others. Have not seen Moelis on that many deals
To answer the OP's question. All of these places hire from undergrad just like regular banking groups. BX restructuring for example is like 60% - 70% wharton and maybe 1 or 2 harvard.
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