Change My Mind: Banks Shouldn’t Hire Foreigners at All
Why don’t investment banks in America prioritize American workers? Every H1B or OPT hired is an American who didn’t get the job.
Since COVID, new data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics household survey shows that approximately 88% of all employment growth from January 2020 to January 2025 went to immigrants (foreign-born workers, legal and illegal combined), totaling about 4.7 million jobs, according to Center for Immigration Studies analysis of Table A-7. Native-born employment gains lagged dramatically. This pattern continues the displacement trend in professional sectors like finance, where investment banks have ramped up H-1B sponsorships significantly.
Illegal immigration and the broader post-COVID inflow surge have driven housing cost increases by adding substantial demand pressure. A Dallas Fed working paper estimates unauthorized immigrant worker flows contributed to roughly 30% of home price growth and 20% of rent increases in affected metro areas during the boom period, exacerbating affordability issues for American families in bank-heavy cities. And that’s just illegal immigration. It makes zero fucking sense to increase the population of the country (and demand for housing) while not increasing the supply of housing. Illegal and legal immigration is driving the “cost-of-living” crisis in our cities which is 100% downstream of unaffordable housing costs.
It is immoral for investment banks to hire H-1Bs, OPTs, and even Canadians when there aren’t enough jobs open for qualified Americans. These visa programs allow firms to bypass domestic talent pools. I worked in a group with lots of internationals—they were on average less competent, efficient, and personable than Americans. American white or Asian men are generally the competent people in this industry. No more foreigners in IB—banks must stop this betrayal and hire Americans first. If you want to make money in America and profit off of Americans, you need to create economic opportunities for Americans first. Fuck every single baby boomer and foreign-born boss who are importing these people and driving down wages for the American people.
Why wouldn't the banks prioritize who they think would be the best hire? Oftentimes at more cost to themselves?
It’s cheaper to hire foreigners and they are easier to control.
1) they are actually cheaper in terms of real wages - F-1 students on OPT are exempt from FICA taxes (social security and Medicare) for their first five calendar years in the U.S.
2) When their immigration status is 100% tied to their job, you can pay them below market wages and employers have almost total leverage over them.
why the fuck are we as Americans, putting up with any of this? It’s madness
At 110k base employer fica savings are like 4.5 percent of the total comp they are paying that analyst it’s negligible at best. On top of that, what reputable bank is paying their analysts different just because they’re intl?
Pls name a bank that’s comping internationals differently lol
who overwhelmingly supports mass immigration?
Crony capitalist boomers and naive women
most of the problems in America are downstream of letting women vote. Per Peter Thiel:
“Since 1920, the vast increase in welfare beneficiaries and the extension of the franchise to women—two constituencies that are notoriously tough for libertarians—have rendered the notion of 'capitalist democracy' into an oxymoron."”
Congrats on not believing women should vote!
I would much rather take away this guy's vote than women's.
Probably dating myself here, but there is a funny sketch from the Man Show where Jimmy Kimmel walks around Venice beach and gets a bunch of women to sign a petition to “End Women Suffrage.” This comment made me think of that and made me laugh.
Also almost half of rent controlled apartments in NYC go to foreign born residents.
If you work in banking, you are working 90 hour weeks to subsidize foreigners and to pay for them to raise their kids while not having or seeing your own
every moderately successful finance person is paying to subsidize like 15 people.
you can’t afford to start a family, but you’re paying 50% in taxes for Shaniqua and her two kids to live in NYCHA apartments on the LES. And Wes, a 65 year old artist, to pay for his $300/mo 2 bedroom in the West Village. And you’re subsidizing Mamadou, the 70 IQ doordash driver from Senegal.
And this is just the start! Zohran and the communists will bleed everyone dry
Grubhub, DoorDash, and Uber Eats appear to employ a significant number of workers who may not have legal authorization to work in the United States. Why aren't there more enforcement actions or compliance reviews involving these companies?
There are also ongoing concerns about unauthorized employment, the use of electric bikes on sidewalks where prohibited, and broader enforcement of labor and traffic regulations. It seems like these issues are not being addressed consistently.
I think companies should be held accountable for complying with employment laws and ensuring their workforce is authorized to work, while regulators should enforce existing laws fairly and consistently.
Zohran is a parasite
From my experience, I usually see rent controlled apartments go to kids (almost always white) who got it passed from their parents (as they are typically pre-1974 buildings)
That stifel rejection must be stinging
Congrats on the h1b!
Patriot
i mean you're hiring smart foreigners from top schools not dumb hicks, huge difference right? Like in my class at EB, every foreign kid I meet is really smart and as a citizen could be true asset to nation, thinking from the purpose of tax rev. in the future, but thats just my point
Right now, the economic environment for young people is awful and the competition for the few entry level jobs that pay enough to build wealth is extremely intense. For every 1 seat in IB/Meta/Google there’s 100+ people gunning for it. You could fill every seat with someone smart from America.
And if that’s the case, I think it’s wrong to hire foreigners for that seat. I don’t care how smart they are. They aren’t American and they aren’t entitled to the highest paying jobs here.
And with respect to how smart they are, I think Americans wildly overestimate how smart internationals from “top schools” are - large percentage of the internationals at my BB are not very smart or motivated; simply are nepo kids whose parents were in global 0.1% paying $50k/yr for international high school, $100k/yr for expensive private college. In my experience, the average American has been smarter and better at their job than the average international.
With respect to the tax revenue, I would be in favor of an immigration system that taxed immigrants at a higher rate than Americans and transferred wealth to U.S. citizens but sadly overall we have the exact opposite system.
America should, but never will, have a policy like Switzerland, where you have to prove there was no swiss fit for the job (or at least a decent effort at attempting to find a suitable swiss was made)
Spoiler alert: it’s a lose-lose at the top on this issue. Both schwartzman/griffin etc. are huge republicans and are very pro h1b and prominent Silicon Valley democrats are very much the same, but for different reasons.
It’s the uniparty going against the will of the American people.
Both MAGA and actual socialists should oppose corporate-driven immigration policies that depress wages for American labor.
You know, I'd get on board with this. That said, the US left has gone all-in on racial extremism that their old policies of looking out for the working class/union workers have gone out the window.
Who was that one lady campaigning in NYC saying "Palestine is on the ballot"? What the hell does Palestine have anything to do with my cost of electricity? It's all these weird racial grievances and blood feuds that we've imported
Every H1B is apparently a finance / econ genius until you mention how increasing labor supply puts downward pressure on wages and all they can respond with is some sort of insult
It’s a complete scam to benefit corporations with an endless supply of labor that has no leverage against them
Tough pill to swallow for the foreigners who refuse to accept that they’re not exceptional, they’re just here as fancier indentured servants
Immigrants create downward pressure on wages and upward demand on housing. Americans are being betrayed and gaslit.
It’s a complete betrayal from all angles.
Our government, businesses, and universities are all in on it.
Holy strawman - have you read a single economics paper? The downward pressure thing is MUCH more complicated and murky than econ101 might suggest, and policy can affect outcomes in a way which further complicates this. Do you really think that the simplest conceivable counter argument is a valuable contribution to this discussion
Please enlighten us with your counterargument. I know you might be busy with your intern tasks but I’ll wait.
I hear you. I'm a white male born and raised in rural US, went to college, moved to New York. I didn't immediately get into banking at first. It absolutely sucked, I had to pivot around. It was easy to point for easy answers like DEI, etc. With all that said, let's think a little harder about this at a macro level.
Imagine if banking didn't pay as well. Lets pretend analysts got paid $50K/year. Or factor into this if housing was affordable and wider net of jobs that enabled you to live comfortably in a big city and put aside 20-50% of salary not just concentrated to a shrinking number of tech and finance jobs. You could literally just go to college, join 1 company for 25 years and climb the ladder. Would you really care about any of this? Would any of this really matter to you? Probably not.
Now go back to reality. Someone says "hey, housing is expensive and labor market sucks" and "It wasn't always like this - lets go back to 1985. This MD is dumb as rocks and born here just like me. He had more advantages. I'm entitled to the same". The easiest answer is "We hear you - immigrants are the problem, lets have everyone focus on that".
What they won't have you focus on is control around new building projects, poorly managed infrastructure, or the disconnect in advancing technologies keeping up with the reality of rising luxury demands. This whole economic engine from post-WW2 to now worked very well but is slowly eating itself.
Salary is outstripped by the value of non-cash assets. What you have are boomers saying "oh its the minorities taking over, they're the problem" as they sit on empty $1.5M homes they bought for $25K and bought $50 in apple stock in 1989 because they thought it was literal fruit and forgot about it until retirement came up. You have a shrinking share of those that hold all of the value in assets doing nothing about helping you succeed.
We have literal trillionares now (most of which isn't in cash btw), but hey this XYZ bank has too many H1Bs - that's why I can't live comfortably or get this random handful of "high-paying" cash salary jobs to support a potential 300sqft studio down the street from my 14 hour/day cubicle job, What gives?
What's wrong with trillionaires or billionaires? If the top 1% disappeared, a lot of our critical businesses would slow down and innovation would take a step back
On the other hand, if the bottom 1% disappeared, I could go to CVS without every item on the shelf being locked up and we'd have less people being shoved into subway trains, and we'd have less sexual assaults in the UK
Billion is one thing.. to put into perspective just how much a trillion dollars, the UN Estimates that solving all of world hunger and malnutrition by 2030 would require $93 billion annually. $93B x 4 = $372B. To solve all homelessness in America by 2046, it is estimated that it would take 20 years with investment of $20B annually. $20B x 20 = $400B
$1Trillion equals $1,000 billion.
$1,000B - $372B = $628B solves world hunger.
$1,000B - $400B = $600B solves homelessness in America.
To solve both is $1,000B - $772B = $228B.
Elon musk having $1T and soley make the decision to just be a decent human and address this, would bump him down to the 5th richest person - assuming no other money is pooled into these initiatives.
Here's the 9 next richest people (after Elon Musk)
Still think Trillionaires are necessary?
Capitalism rewards those who work hard. If the top 1% disappeared, guess what, things will continue as if nothing happened. There are hundreds if not thousands of equally smart people in the U.S. If you think otherwise you are naive. Working around C-Suite, you realize a lot of people are just regular people, sure some smarter than others. Innovation will continue, businesses will appoint the second smartest or third. End of the day someone will be willing to work hard for it. Why? Because capitalism rewards those who work hard
Highest IQ comment by far
The easiest IQ test today is asking "What is the primary cause of declining standards of living for the middle class today"
Low IQ: It's because immigrants and H1Bs
Midwit: It's a complex issue with so singular cause
Mega Brain: The asset rich pay a disproportionately low amount of taxes leading to the government having to borrow money via the printing press, with the cost printing (inflation) being passed down to the middle class leading to asset valuations rising alongside purchasing power of incomes decreasing
Banks probably shouldn’t be hiring H1Bs. It’s not special work and you can absolutely find Americans to do it. I’d prefer to see kids from shit hole states getting more opportunities…
With that being said, I work at one of C/M/P and hedge funds will still keep hiring foreigners…the talent coming out of IB these days isn’t great
Also, to my sellside lifers, would be careful before asserting immigrants = lower wages. Intuitively this makes sense but what we’re seeing in markets/data is that at times there’s very little coupling between the two.
Anyway, immigration isn’t a long term fix for the declining birth rate. At least we don’t have an entrenched welfare state unlike the UK/europe, but social security and Medicare/medicaid are going to be unaffordable in a decade or so…need a tax base…
Immigration is what made this country great in the first place. If you don’t welcome talent, US will lose its lead vs. countries like China that are catching up quickly
Ah yes, the US will lose to China (which basically has no immigration) unless we have massive amounts of immigrants.
Also, the vast majority of immigrants that built this country and made it successful were white Europeans. There’s a difference between the people who settled this country and Akshit with a fake degree getting hired by Infosys for a 40% lower salary than an American would accept. Or first-generation migrants from the Horn of Africa and Sudan/Somalia who have an average lifetime net cost to US taxpayers of $760k/per person.
If thats the case (Im uneducated on this topic) why is it very difficult for Europeans to legalky migrate to the US?
The blatant racism is unbelievable. Trump really opened the gate to a bunch of retards.
China is catching up because the kids there are all going to stem whereas the US “white European kids” are going into finance which creates fucking nothing for the society. Having immigration at US is a cheat code because you get to recruit the worlds talent. Do you seriously think entitled “white European kids” is driving this country forward?
I'd love to see someone try pitching to China that they need more immigration because diversity is strength and they need to check their Han priviledge lmao.
White Europeans take 8 weeks of vacation per year and work 20 hours a week. I highly doubt they're building shit--look at Europe's GDP growth
And if you want to talk about history, slaves were the ones who "built" the country
Why should you have a say over how a private profit-seeking non‑government enterprise decides how to arrange its own affairs?
In any case, there is value in having a balanced mix of foreigners in those banks. Many of them (caveat: Indians less for obvious reasons) are much more open to relocating later in their careers (+10/+20 years) to other countries outside the US, going into local government, starting companies in other markets or taking executive roles in leading regional corporates. All of that makes them far more likely to become local points of contact or actual clients for those US / global banks.
If the company were purely focused on servicing Missouri, then fine, hire only Americans. But if the platform is broader than that and both candidates can do the job, then it actually makes sense to have a balanced mix of locals and foreigners.
Think about it statistically - say 10% of the class goes to major funds that later come back to your bank as clients, or become seniors who keep the relationship going as alumni, or at least know people at the bank. The other 90% may end up in dead‑end companies, Corporate Development or other roles that are not especially relevant. Assume maybe 30% go into hedge funds or start some firm that keeps engaging with their old bank. In that scenario, do you really need 60% of the intake to be locals? You are perfectly fine having a mix and deliberately capitalizing on the upside that foreigners are uniquely positioned to offer.
And so far I am aware, banks will gladly fuck you as an American if they could squeeze some more profit out from you (or did we forgot 2008?). Never forget that they are self-centered institutions and don't give an absolute fuck about what you have to say as an Amurican even if they are US headquartered. The power of an investment bank resumes to its global network in getting early visibility to market trends and different company needs in other markets.
PS: If you don't see the value of this model, are you even fit to end up working in a bank? I believe that being blind to this value because of nationalist tendencies / emotionally filled arguments will make you a shitty decision-maker as you will pass valuable long-term strategies because you have some ideas on how a bank should be instead of how to make the bank more profitable/stronger.
only reasonable comment here lol
Because people can have an impact on gov policies surrounding this?
I think it's clear that companies are just groups of people acting in mostly their narrow self interest
not only, but it is even encouraged / many take pride in that by justifying it with the invisible hand argument
So i think a few things misleading - the stat is nation and sector wide, and banking is hardly representative of that. Secondly, what is the market incentive for a bank to prioritize anybody but who they think can get the job done best (or, more broadly in the case of DEI or nepo, who can benefit the bank the most). Blaming “muh immigrants” for minimal white collar domestic hiring, and specifically supposedly limited domestic banking hiring, is ridiculous. I think that the main issue in the U.S. is that we haven’t focused on effectively upskilling our population relative to our immigration growth (as Denmark did, to empirically very good results) but this is an idiotic argument from this forum’s perspective.
Also to all the people seething over the fox news tax strawman, you gotta think about this in better faith a little bit lol
Alright, reading the comments, and setting aside the protectionism, the blatant racism, and moronic statements, there are some valid points.
The underlying arguments are: (1) foreigners are given preferential hiring treatment compared to local talent due to lower real costs associated with the employee, (2) immigration in any form ultimately lowers jobs available for US citizens, and (3) the sturctural system in paying taxes to subsidize rent-controlled housing for illegal immigrants is a betrayal to the US.
So... let me counter each of these.
(1) The majority of firms do not have the bandwidth to process any foreign visa including TNs, H1Bs, or OPTs. A quick search will yield that 2% of all firms are capable of this. So if you're going toe to toe with foreigners at the very few firms that do and are losing, then sucks to be you, but you're losing to foreigners AND local talent, so you're probably just not good. About 5-15% of new graduate IB positions go to foreigners. You chose to ignore the other 80%+ you also lost to who received the offer at the "fair wage" as it were and decided to hyper-focus on the small population of foreigners who just did better than you.
(2) Foreigners also create jobs over the long-run. Around 50% of billion-dollar startups were created by immigrants or children of immigrants. They probably also began working new grad gigs when they enterd so they could get their goddamn citizenship. It's as if the US population has this belief that there's no such thing as newly minted citizens or it's some sort of crime to build a life in the US when people aren't born on that soil. Read the damn history books, the only people who had any claim to the land were the natives the existing inhabitants abused and drove out.
(3) There have been these topics floated around of removing all illegal immigrants from the grimy work that they do, be it in farmwork, delivery work, or other menial jobs that some would think is below them. The Trump Administration actually did this quite aggressively with ICE Raids that resulted in empty farms with no workers to the point where the crops spoiled. There have been many proven cases where citizens at the macro level were unwilling to step into this work at the required level to support the existing structure. For some quoted statistics, "massive workforce absences (as high as 40% to 70% in certain regions) and causing high-value crops to rot in the fields" - ultimately proving that if there were a way to remove and replace illegal immigrants en masse from known pockets, the existing government would've acted on it.
In closing, f*ck your racism, narcism and all-around small d*ck energy. I said this before, I'll say it again: you don't have a monopoly on the country just because you happened to be born there. Especially against Canadians who are the shortest possible distance from your own offices.
Canadians ruined the country in the last ten years because they increased immigration at a 16% CAGR from 2016-2024.
At the same time, over the last 10 years, the Canadian national average home price doubled from $350k to $700k.
Canadians should stay home and fix their country, and not come here.
I'll be honest, with so few data points, I'm not even sure what argument it is you're trying to make. Are you arguing that immigration is bad for the economy because it increases housing prices? I mean don't get me wrong, our policies are sh*t too, but what specifically are you trying to get at?
Citizens of a country don’t have a monopoly on their own country? LOL
Sounds like a lot of cope from a non-US citizen. Kick rocks
Sounds like you need DEI
That's the whole point of the literal American dream your country preaches. And no, citizens don't because being a non-citizen is a temporary state that may change if someone gains citizenship. Y'know? The process that many, many, many Europeans went through across the past 200 years whilst also promoting anti-immigration rhetoric against every other ethnicity in that time?
You make it sound as if being born on US soil required some skill or inherently allows you to close the door on the world.
#1 is bullshit, you can hire an outside attorney to process H1B's pretty easily. I've seen it many times. "Bandwidth" isn't a thing in these decisions, it's all based on cost and benefit. If the benefit exceeds the cost, you spend the money. I've seen firms with less than 10 employees do it.
#2 and #3 aren't objectively false the way #1 was, but they're opinions masquerading as facts and someone could easily argue the other side if they felt like arguing with a bullshitter (which I don't).
They're also facts masquerading as facts. You can't hate the system that fosters innovation and growth by creating a system of mobility for great minds to create and build companies and futures in the US and then also heavily rely upon said companies.
For point #1 - there's a total sum of 3.6M authorized foreign workers under H1B, TN, L1, O-1, and whatever else visa you want to group them in. The US population is 349M which effectively makes the entire foreign skilled population sum to 1.03%. Of all firms "open to sponsoring", only ~2% of US Firms actually do file. If there really were no headaches and no friction to hiring from Canada or other countries, wouldn't the % of US firms be much higher?
And on the topic of opinions masquerading as facts, I'd rather have that than bigotry masquerading as opinion which is what this comment section is riddled with.
If you do feel like arguing with backed data for the other side, by all means, throw stones at my glass house. I'd rather we debate than you calling B.S. on my sourced data with your anecdotal crap. Do you also have a black friend to prove racism no longer exists?
Look man, you're welcome to call me every name in the dictionary, but we're not doing this anymore. Oh wow you're so edgy and cool that you said "f*ck" with that asterisk in the middle.
These policies have been a big problem for the American middle class. You'll be fine since you work on Wall Street. I'm not worried about you. You're welcome to babble on about racist this, racist that, but again, we're not doing this anymore. We don't really care what you call us, but we are going to shut off the H1B abuse.
You're free to do so, but your administration has proven that they often don't think of the consequences of their actions. If you lose a dozen or so billion-dollar startups or growth in the economy over this protectionist mentality or slow down the economic growth as a result, that'll be your country's burden to bear.
You make it sound as if the H1B process was flagarantly abused with no merit over its entire existence. It serves a tactical purpose to fill gaps in the supply and demand of specific positions within the US and even now, will still be needed in some shape or form. What I dislike is the hypocrisy of benefiting from the damn program and by immigration as a whole and then complaining by hpyer-focusing on a negatives. If you want to remove the H1B program, why not apply that retroactively and throw out the founders that have scaled Unicorns today or stop using Immigrant-built applications given your strong disdain against the system of abuse? Or found your own company and just hire local?
And on that last note of immigration in particular, pick any decade in US History and you'll find some legislation against some ethnicity, be it Chinese Exclusion Act, the Johnson-Reed Act, or Asiatic Barred Zone, there's always been some negative connotation against some ethnicity entering the U.S. It seems every single person wants to close the door behind them and throw away the key. You just happen to be the last one through the door looking to do the same.
On the note of being edgy, I was actually just being polite by censoring myself. Nothing more, nothing less.
It isn’t madness, H1B visas are productive for employment and economic growth. The US economy was never a zero sums game. If immigrants are taking all the white and blue collar jobs why do we have more jobs open right now (7.54 billion) as we did in 2020. The funniest part is is that no citizens are taking them even though 6 billion of those jobs are white collar. The reason H1B visas and other immigration tools are so important is because it DOES directly affects us. 35% of H1B visa holders become citizens which means the ones who will become citizens will be paying their fair share of SALT and federal taxes. 59% of all corporations valued over 1 billion dollars were founded by immigrants. These massive corporations hire NATIVE CITIZENS. So the next time you see in the news that trump terminated another 2,000 student Visas, or canceled another thousand of H1B visas think about the amount of native citizens job opportunities that will be lost just because we have a arbitrary president.
I reject the premise here that the only KPIs we should be looking at are tax receipts and GDP.
There is nothing more american than immigrating to this country and working long hours for below-market wages to build a better life.
I think these immigrants are more American than the welfare leeches and the losers who couldn't cut it and are now trying to pull up the ladder.
Sorry, we're not doing this anymore. You can't simultaneously try to wrap yourself in the flag saying that "there's nothing more American than [whatever policy]" while also saying that America is a horrible country, all our holidays are about genocide or whatever, we're really getting tired about being lectured about our history from someone who once read a Howard Zinn book or saw a Tiktok video.
At the substance of the matter, immigrants are supposed to assimilate. We've actively discouraged assimilation for decades.
DEI but rebranded LOL
Every public bank has a fiduciary duty. NOT an "American" duty - and I say this as an American citizen. This is just a weird entitled post.
If you want to do business in America, and your business model is labor arbitrage that hurts Americans (think Infosys, Tata Consultancy), you should be penalized by the government and penalized by your shareholders.
Also if you hire immigrants and DEI instead of competent white and Asian men, you will indirectly harm your business results and shareholder value. There should be lawsuits against DEI as a breach of fiduciary duty.
From my understanding, hiring immigrants were not a function of DEI (pre h1b visa changes), it's because they will listen and work harder. I understand your first argument more than your second.
Again, they're trying to have it both ways. Not that long ago they were going all in on ESG saying that they need to look beyond just profits. So when they get called out on laying off Americans to replace them with H1Bs, they can't just pull out the "but but but we need to maximize profits for shareholders."
I'd appreciate if they were just honest and said, "we look down upon non-Ivy League Americans from 'flyover country' and view them as beneath us." Just be honest and say it with your chest. We know they're thinking it.
..
Lol are people really believing in this? What kind of brain damage you need to suffer to convince yourself to this BS? I’ve contributed to hiring processes at various BBs and EBs, none of them preferred H1Bs over any other bucket.
I’ve directly seen people in one ethnic group on H1Bs/green cards favoring hiring H1Bs from the same ethnic group, over American candidates, at my bank and in other F500 companies
I have a lot of problems with the H1B program, and am generally in favor of downsizing it. I've taken plenty of MS for saying so.
But I don't see how it's the fault of the employer. It's the government that creates the incentive. The government dangles a green card worth millions of dollars to the employee, and effectively says to the employer "if you hire this guy, his probability of getting this green card goes way up if he stays with your company." The employer is now choosing between (i) an American who is free to leave at any time or (ii) an H1B holder who can leave but realistically is fairly tied down by the arrangement.
A rational employer now has a reason to favor the H1B hire. It won't be the only consideration because the H1B hire will have some (minor) additional costs and ultimately candidate quality matters most.
But it's a factor driving a lot of H1B hiring. I don't blame the employer or the candidate.
It's a problem but not nearly as bad as a problem in tech. Xbox announced large scale layoffs of American workers, while simulatenously requesting more H1B slots. Either you need the workers or you don't. You can't have it both ways. If someone gets fired for performance because they suck, okay fair enough, but you're doing a large scale RIF while simultaneously requesting H1Bs. The reality is they want employees that they can control because if they lose their job then they lose their visa, or it's just ethnic in-group preference of CEOs from overseas wanting to hire more people from their ethnic group. Or both.
Plenty more examples than Xbox. This has been going on for decades, companies announcing layoffs but simulatenously requesting H1B slots. You can't have it both ways where you say you're desperate for more workers but also are laying off workers at the same time.
If you can’t make it into any bank as an American, you are just not good enough. The cream rises to the top and instead of complaining just get better lol make it a cost for them to not hire you…
This thread has been formed by my opinions developed by working for an “American” BB. I have successfully broken in and outcompeted internationals at every level.
It pisses me off that these banks are hiring 92nd percentile IQ nepo babies from rich international families on H1Bs vs the 99th percentile white male from Indiana or Georgia who grew up here.
Why are we as Americans participating in a system that fucks over Americans while giving golden tickets to internationals who have no business being here? Why are companies like Walmart favoring hiring people based on if they’re Telugu or not?
enough is enough, Americans should take back their country
This is like trauma porn no different than the woke Olympics 5-10yrs ago. There’s no 92nd percentile H1-B getting a job over a “99th percentile” guy from Georgia. It’s just not true. Either the guy from Georgia isn’t 99th percentile or the H1-B is really good.
I think most of this H1-B stuff on WSO is downstream of finance broadening out via Instagram memes. So some guy from a non-target applies, doesn’t get the job, and is blaming a group that holds maybe less than 5% of the jobs in front office finance.
Go complain about DEI hiring which does give jobs to 90th percentile nepo women over 99th percentile white/asian/indian US citizens. That group is 50% of seats x 50% 90th % nepo = 5x the number of H1-Bs.
If you can’t get a job at a bank, it’s just not for you. The smartest people don’t even go into finance anymore. It’s not that competitive.
IQ is not the differentiator as to who makes it to a BB.
Sure if you have 70 IQ you’re probably ngmi but 92nd percentile vs 99th means way less than willingness to work 80+ hr weeks
There’re already only a handful of banks that are open to hiring internationals, and they do only if the foreign candidate outperforms all other domestics in the hiring process. Whining about a section of finance workforce that is not even 5% of total pool is just pathetic. We can evaporate all the foreigners in this country and you’ll still not get the IB job you’ve been craving for.
No. Foreign-born workers are heavily overrepresented in elite finance/IB relative to their population share. They dominate H-1B visas and entry-level pipelines at bulge brackets. Removing them would open slots for Americans.
Banks sponsor visas aggressively because cheaper labor and specific skills undercut natives. “Outperform all domestics” is cope.
Are you delusional or just outright lying? I’ve run hiring processes at various banks both BBs and EBs, and can easily confirm that ratio of H1Bs to total employee pool in IB is at best laughable.
Dude the majority of investment banks outside of select BB’s/EB’s don’t even sponsor kids on OPT/H1B, just look at the job postings it’ll say at the end that they don’t hire anyone who now or in the future will need visa sponsorship.
And we should shame the BBs/EBs that do until they don’t.
It’s less rampant than tech but plenty of H1B abuse by BBs
Congrats on bigot
WSO: “why isn’t our platform growing?”
The user base:
Hey I'm sorry bro, came her with a MBA, didn't know you guys hate me that much
Go apply to the 90% of banks that don’t sponsor and see if you get an offer then..
Me when I'm a frustated incompetent and put the blame of my rejection on Morgan Stanley on everygroup that I consider inferior just because I'm fucking racist loser who can't beat the inteligence of third-world foreigners:
How fucking dare they hire Indians and Chinese kids, can you please drop the names of these immoral banks that are hiring H1Bs for lower wages at the AN2 level, preferably in NYC, focus on TMT, and BB/EB ONLY!
You have to keep in mind when you hire Chinese immigrants figure out how they get the job. About half of them use “tutoring services” that cost as much as college tuition that will tell them all the questions before the interview. I know this because I worked for one of these companies. You really don’t hate these kids enough. They will play into your stereotype of Asians being technical when truly they are just beyond retarded and cheat their way through literally everything beyond your wildest imagination. At a lot of groups they will essentially bribe employees to leak the questions. For online assessments, they will have one plant take it then have someone with a lot of experience solve the question so that the students have the answers. For any take home assignment obviously it’s never done by the student.
I wish I were kidding but I am not. It’s a 50-50 chance any Chinese immigrant is using one of these services because they are just so common in China. This isn’t true for domestic Chinese kids that were raised in the US.
They benefit greatly from the stigma against being racist. For example, students interested in quant trading will take advantage of your fear of racism by simply claiming to have placed highly in various math competitions, knowing that you have no way to check since their resume says their English name and it would be racist to ask for their “Chinese name” under which their competition scores would be. Students engaging in this type of scam also greatly benefit from the western idea that perhaps there’s just a language barrier and this is why they come across as retarded in the interview. If they come across as retarded it’s because someone didn’t tell them the answer and their resume is a work of fiction.
This sounds extreme and I really wish I was joking but I am not. Also it sounds like a generalization but it is not. The objective market share of these “tutoring” services is actually high and these are facts and yes that does mean you can generalize. Sorry to offend you but I hope you are far more offended by the realization that these “anti-racist” ideas are far more sinister than the racist ones.
But keep in mind that what does an employer get when they hire this person? Are they a dud? Maybe. But you know what’s more important? Loyalty. Employers probably know this but honestly it’s valuable to have someone that is half imprisoned. It is valuable for the same reason IaaS or SaaS is valuable; instead of paying upfront capex for a slave you pay a monthly usage fee. Imagine if you bought a car and the car suddenly drives off on you because it wants a different owner. That would be annoying but we made buying the car (slavery) immoral but we decided immigration policies were moral somehow, which are just a subscription service for something similar. Of course this is a far better economic arrangement because when you buy a car you want it to be yours until you’ve worn it out and want a new one. Labor is the largest part of the cost structure for most businesses and so it makes complete sense that it’s crucial for employers to optimize here and hence we have no real discussion of morality about nearly anything unless it has the effect of lowering labor costs.
So my point is the irony is yes these people truly do have less merit on average and no they are not outcompeting Americans for the same job but yes they are better objective choices for the employer simply because it is nice to have something almost akin to a Slave-aaS model.
Is it cruel? Yes. Is it unfair to you? Yes. Is it actually unfair even to the Chinese kid that’s cheating? Yes. Who wins? The employer does, even if they hire a “worse” employee since a quasi-slave is great for business.
So yes you don’t hate the cheating Chinese kids enough but you know what if you want to direct your hatred somewhere it’s at what allows for this to happen but even then realistically nothing will change. There are no powerful groups that genuinely want a higher cost of labor, so there’s no real mechanism in government for you to get what you want. So you can gripe but realistically there’s nothing you can do other than know the truth and let it go.
Indians, Chinese, Koreans generally have no integrity (compared to Americans) and will cheat and sabotage
😂
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